On 2010\08\08 10:55, wrote:
On Aug 7, 2:00 pm, wrote:

We see a lot of Scottish money, here in the Lakes,
but I'm fairly sure it isn't legal tender Clive

Legal tender is what you can't refuse to take if you
are offered it by someone who owes you money.

That means that cheques, credit cards and debit
cards are not legal tender - you have the option
to take them if you choose.

So when anybody refuses to accept a Scottish note,
it is solely because of their own choice. The "I can't
take it because it is not legal tender" routine is
nonsense.

Most people in shops are employees and so are not free to decide what is
or is not acceptable payment to their employer. They aren't saying
they'll be prosecuted if they accept it, they're saying they'll be
sacked if they accept it. Most Scottish people IME become aggressive
when their money is rejected, even when a debt has been accrued in
London and legal tender is required.

wrote

On Aug 7, 2:00*pm, Clive wrote:

We see a lot of Scottish money, here in the Lakes,
but I'm fairly sure it isn't legal tender Clive

Legal tender is what you can't refuse to take if you
are offered it by someone who owes you money.

That means that cheques, credit cards and debit
cards are not legal tender - you have the option
to take them if you choose.

So when anybody refuses to accept a Scottish note,
it is solely because of their own choice. The "I can't
take it because it is not legal tender" routine is nonsense.

Nope, it's shorthand "when I try to use it, someone else may refuse to
accept it as they are entitled to do".

Money that may not be accepted is a genuine inconvenience - I recall
solving the problem for Guernsey notes and coin by paying it over
NatWest's bank counter for the credit of my UK bank account the day my
holiday ended and drawing Bank of England notes from the appropriate
cash machine at the same time.


--
Mike D

On Aug 8, 4:11*pm, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2010\08\08 10:55, wrote:
On Aug 7, 2:00 pm, *wrote:

We see a lot of Scottish money, here in the Lakes,
but I'm fairly sure it isn't legal tender * * * * * * * *Clive

Legal tender is what you can't refuse to take if you
are offered it by someone who owes you money.
That means that cheques, credit cards and debit
cards are not legal tender - you have the option
to take them if you choose.
So when anybody refuses to accept a Scottish note,
it is solely because of their own choice. The "I can't
take it because it is not legal tender" routine is
nonsense.

Most people in shops are employees and so are not free to decide what is
or is not acceptable payment to their employer. They aren't saying
they'll be prosecuted if they accept it, they're saying they'll be
sacked if they accept it. Most Scottish people IME become aggressive
when their money is rejected, even when a debt has been accrued in
London and legal tender is required.-

With the greatest of respect you are under a misapprehension when
you say that legal tender is required. Were this indeed the case
then
no credit cards would be accepted as credit cards are certainly not
legal tender, nor are cheques nor debit cards.

What does constitute legal tender is set out by law, and in
London (as in the rest of England) consists mainly of Bank of
England Notes. Wikipedia does quite a good explanation for
various places, and is worth consulting.

The reason Scottish notes are rejected is because the person
on the till does not want to take them. This may indeed be their
employers policy or, as you write they may fear their employers
reaction because they have not been fully trained regarding what
they may accept. They really should come out into the open and
say that they are unfamiliar with these notes and do not want
to accept them, rather than hiding behind the "not legal tender"
routine.

I got a very clear explanation of one Scots unhappiness when
his money was rejected. "I thought" he said "that I lived in
an United Kingdom"

On Aug 8, 5:22*pm, "Michael R N Dolbear" wrote:
wrote
On Aug 7, 2:00*pm, Clive wrote:

We see a lot of Scottish money, here in the Lakes,
but I'm fairly sure it isn't legal tender * * * * * * * *Clive

Legal tender is what you can't refuse to take if you
are offered it by someone who owes you money.
That means that cheques, credit cards and debit
cards are not legal tender - you have the option
to take them if you choose.
So when anybody refuses to accept a Scottish note,
it is solely because of their own choice. The "I can't
take it because it is not legal tender" routine is nonsense.

Nope, it's shorthand "when I try to use it, someone else may refuse to
accept it as they are entitled to do".
Money that may not be accepted is a genuine inconvenience - I recall
solving the problem for Guernsey notes and coin by paying it over
NatWest's bank counter for the credit of my UK bank account the day my
holiday ended and drawing Bank of England notes from the appropriate
cash machine at the same time. Mike D

Anybody is certainly fully entitled to refuse Scottish, Northern
Irish,
Manx or Channel Islands notes, as are they entitled to refuse
payment by cheque, Debit Card or Credit Card, as all of them
are equally not legal tender. For the same reason Bank of
England notes could be refused for payments made outside
England and Wales. What would be more honest would be
to say that they are refusing payment of a type with which
they are not familiar, or not trained to accept.

On Sun, 8 Aug 2010 13:58:29 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

Anybody is certainly fully entitled to refuse Scottish, Northern
Irish,
Manx or Channel Islands notes, as are they entitled to refuse
payment by cheque, Debit Card or Credit Card, as all of them
are equally not legal tender.

Anyone is entitled to refuse any payment of any kind for any reason
(so long as it is not a reason, e.g. racial discrimination, that is
against the law) so long as the payment is in a situation where no
debt exists.

Legal tender only applies to things like a meal in a restaurant, where
a debt exists at the time of paying because you've already eaten the
food. If you buy a Tube ticket, you're doing so in advance of the
journey, so no debt has occurred, so they may take or not take any
method of payment they wish. If you fare-dodge then are charged a
Penalty Fare, OTOH, a debt exists (as the travel has already occurred
and cannot un-occur) so the legal tender rules would apply.

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
To reply put my first name before the at.

On Sun, 8 Aug 2010 13:47:58 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

What does constitute legal tender is set out by law, and in
London (as in the rest of England) consists mainly of Bank of
England Notes. Wikipedia does quite a good explanation for
various places, and is worth consulting.

But as per my other posting, legal tender is completely irrelevant
where no debt exists.

Ryanair, for instance, does not accept cash for booking of flights
(well, it might at the airport, but I'm not entirely sure it does). It
doesn't need to because no debt exists at the time of booking, as
you're booking before you fly.

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
To reply put my first name before the at.

On Aug 8, 10:28*pm, Neil Williams
wrote:
semiretired wrote:

Anybody is certainly fully entitled to refuse Scottish, Northern
Irish, Manx or Channel Islands notes, as are they entitled to
refuse payment by cheque, Debit Card or Credit Card, as all
of them are equally not legal tender.

Anyone is entitled to refuse any payment of any kind for any reason
(so long as it is not a reason, e.g. racial discrimination, that is
against the law) so long as the payment is in a situation where no
debt exists.
Legal tender only applies to things like a meal in a restaurant, where
a debt exists at the time of paying because you've already eaten the
food. *If you buy a Tube ticket, you're doing so in advance of the
journey, so no debt has occurred, so they may take or not take any
method of payment they wish. *If you fare-dodge then are charged a
Penalty Fare, OTOH, a debt exists (as the travel has already occurred
and cannot un-occur) so the legal tender rules would apply. Neil

Then I think we are agreed that refusing money "because it is not
legal tender" is a red herring.

On Sun, 8 Aug 2010 15:09:17 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

Then I think we are agreed that refusing money "because it is not
legal tender" is a red herring.

I think so, yes.

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
To reply put my first name before the at.

On Aug 8, 10:29*pm, Neil Williams
wrote:
semiretired wrote:

What does constitute legal tender is set out by law, and in
London (as in the rest of England) consists mainly of Bank of
England Notes. Wikipedia does quite a good explanation for
various places, and is worth consulting.

But as per my other posting, legal tender is completely irrelevant
where no debt exists.
Ryanair, for instance, does not accept cash for booking of flights
(well, it might at the airport, but I'm not entirely sure it does). It
doesn't need to because no debt exists at the time of booking, as
you're booking before you fly. Neil

Of course they are not a U.K. company, and this seems to
aid them in some of their arrangements.

My point was that when refusing to accept payment the
real reason should be stated and not an irrelevance
about legal tender.

On 08/08/2010 17:22, Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
wrote

On Aug 7, 2:00 pm, wrote:

We see a lot of Scottish money, here in the Lakes,
but I'm fairly sure it isn't legal tender Clive

Legal tender is what you can't refuse to take if you
are offered it by someone who owes you money.

That means that cheques, credit cards and debit
cards are not legal tender - you have the option
to take them if you choose.

So when anybody refuses to accept a Scottish note,
it is solely because of their own choice. The "I can't
take it because it is not legal tender" routine is nonsense.

Nope, it's shorthand "when I try to use it, someone else may refuse to
accept it as they are entitled to do".

Money that may not be accepted is a genuine inconvenience - I recall
solving the problem for Guernsey notes and coin by paying it over
NatWest's bank counter for the credit of my UK bank account the day my
holiday ended and drawing Bank of England notes from the appropriate
cash machine at the same time.


Banks in London will accept all notes from the United Kingdom of Great
Britian & Northern Ireland, as well as those from Guernsey, Jersey and
the Isle of Man. The automatic deposit machines will not accept single
notes, however, which come from Scotland, Guernsey, Jersey and the Isle
of Man.