"Access Systems" wrote:



NYC TA buses have been 100% ADA compliant for a number of years...

Yes, but how accessible are they overall to the disabled population? Not
just wheelchair users, but also the far more numerous "ambulant disabled"
who can walk with difficulty (most of whom don't consider themselves to be
"disabled enough" to use the lift)? A standard-floor bus with a wheelchair
lift fitted may meet ADA requirements - but it still leaves a *lot* to be
desired as far as disability access is concerned, when compared with a
low-floor bus.

As you note elsewhere in the thread, the private bus lines running routes
under contract to the City (which I understand are marketed as part of the
NYCTA network, and accept MetroCards) are not yet 100% ADA compliant.





also a much higher percentage of the subway (tube) stations are
accessible..

NOT TRUE!

Quite the reverse, in fact - the London Underground has a much higher
percentage of stations accessible than the New York Subway. Look at the MTA
and TfL websites (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/mta/ada/stations.htm and
http://tube.tfl.gov.uk/content/tubem...s_guide_1.pdf).



I assume that we are talking about step-free access from street to platform
(ie accessibility for wheelchair users). If we consider that a station is
"accessible" if there is step-free access to and from trains running in both
directions, on at least one line serving that station (and count it as "half
a station" if this applies only to trains running in one direction), we
find:

New York Subway - 37 accessible stations, plus 3 accessible in only one
direction, to give a total of 38½ stations out of a possible 468. This is
8.23%.

London Underground - 44 accessible stations, plus 11 accessible in only
one direction, to give a total of 49½ stations out of a possible 275. This
is 18.00%.


If we also consider the MTA's and TfL's "secondary" Metro systems, then New
York is even worse by comparison. Including the Staten Island Railway and
the Docklands Light Railway, we find:

New York - 42½ stations out of a possible 490. This is 8.67%.
London - 81½ stations out of a possible 305. This is 26.72%.



New York seems to have a lot of catching up to do...



--
MetroGnome
~~~~~~~~~~

(To email me, edit return address)




Notes about my figures
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I've tried to be as balanced as possible.

I've assumed that the MTA list is completely up-to-date (it includes, for
example, the brand new access at 72nd Street on the IRT, which was not shown
as accessible on the November 2003 system map). I've just taken the
oft-quoted "468 subway stations" figure as correct - this presumably
includes the temporarily-closed stations near Coney Island, and possibly
some arguable cases.

The London access guide is dated 2002, and includes four stations (Kilburn,
Earl's Court, Fulham Broadway, and Hounslow East - shown with the wheelchair
symbol crossed out) where access was then either under construction or
suspended temporarily - I've assumed that wheelchair access has now been
completed/restored (it definitely has been at some of them, but I'm not 100%
sure it has been at all of them). I've also accounted for Heron Quays
having re-opened. In arguable cases (where interchange between lines
involves the use of public streets or walkways), I have considered Shadwell
and Hammersmith to be single stations, but Paddington and Canary Wharf to
each consist of two separate stations.

In misc.transport.urban-transit MetroGnome wrote:
"Access Systems" wrote:
NYC TA buses have been 100% ADA compliant for a number of years...

Yes, but how accessible are they overall to the disabled population? Not

ADA is for all people with disabilities

just wheelchair users, but also the far more numerous "ambulant disabled"
who can walk with difficulty (most of whom don't consider themselves to be
"disabled enough" to use the lift)? A standard-floor bus with a wheelchair

people are permitted to "stand" on the lifts, in fact it is manitory that
they be allow to.

lift fitted may meet ADA requirements - but it still leaves a *lot* to be
desired as far as disability access is concerned, when compared with a
low-floor bus.

I agree the low floor bus is the best thing since sliced bread but a lot
of transit authorities in the USA are resistant. the ADA only requires
access not how it is to be done

As you note elsewhere in the thread, the private bus lines running routes
under contract to the City (which I understand are marketed as part of the
NYCTA network, and accept MetroCards) are not yet 100% ADA compliant.

yes and no, they are not yet ADA compliant because they are running rust
buckets that should have been replaced years ago and is the main reason
for the effort to get them taken over.

also a much higher percentage of the subway (tube) stations are
accessible..

NOT TRUE!

Quite the reverse, in fact - the London Underground has a much higher
percentage of stations accessible than the New York Subway. Look at the MTA
and TfL websites (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/mta/ada/stations.htm and
http://tube.tfl.gov.uk/content/tubem...s_guide_1.pdf).


Notes about my figures
Bob
--
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve Neither liberty nor safety", Benjamin Franklin
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