I need to travel from Southfields to Elstree daily for a few weeks.
The last time I did this journey, a few years ago, I used to take the
District Line to Blackfriars and change onto the Luton line. I know
Blackfriars tube is closed, and the journey planner tells me to go via
Kings Cross, but having heard bad stories of KC interchange isn't
changing at Blackfriars using Temple or Mansion House still the
easiest option? Any other suggestions?

Paul

"paul in HG" wrote in message
...

I need to travel from Southfields to Elstree daily for a few weeks.
The last time I did this journey, a few years ago, I used to take the
District Line to Blackfriars and change onto the Luton line. I know
Blackfriars tube is closed, and the journey planner tells me to go via
Kings Cross, but having heard bad stories of KC interchange isn't
changing at Blackfriars using Temple or Mansion House still the
easiest option? Any other suggestions?

I would think walking from Temple to Blackfriars is more hassle than
changing at Kings Cross. Other options are

Southfields - Edgware Road - Farringdon - Elstree
Southfields - West Brompton - West Hampstead - Elstree (cheaper as avoids
Zone 1)

Peter Smyth

On May 21, 2:19*pm, paul in HG wrote:
I need to travel from Southfields to Elstree daily for a few weeks.
The last time I did this journey, a few years ago, I used to take the
District Line to Blackfriars and change onto the Luton line. I know
Blackfriars tube is closed, and the journey planner tells me to go via
Kings Cross, but having heard bad stories of KC interchange isn't
changing at Blackfriars using Temple or Mansion House still the
easiest option? Any other suggestions?

Go to Wimbledon and take the direct Thameslink stopping train? Timing
wise might not be so great though (the train starts off going in the
'wrong direction' towards Streatham, and isn't particularly snappy).

Re the interchange at Kings Cross St Pancras - does partly depend
which way your coming at it from, i.e. from the sub-surface lines or
from the Piccadilly line. Whichever way you might do it, via KXSP,
Temple or Mansion House there'd still be a walk - possibly choose
which walk you prefer...

Alternatively - go to West Brompton and change onto the London
Overground to West Hampstead - from this Sunday's timetable change
there are lots more trains that run direct from the WLL onto the NLL
(half-hourly during the day but every 15 mins during the peaks). From
West Hampstead pick up the Thameslink to Elstree & Borehamwood.

The above route route also avoid zone 1, so is cheaper - you'd only
need a zones 2-6 Travelcard, or if using Oyster PAYG you'd only pay a
zones 2-6 fare so long as you touched on the pink Oyster route
validator when changing at West Brompton - see the TfL Single fare
finder and click on 'Alternate fares' for confirmation of this:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/tickets/fa...inder/current/


(Note that at West Hampstead you'd need to touch-out at the London
Overground station before touching in again at the Thameslink station,
as this is an out-of-station interchange. Assuming 10 peak time
journeys in a week at £3.40 each, Oyster PAYG actually comes out 40
pence cheaper than a weekly z2-6 Travelcard at £34.40 - but of course
you get all the extra travel you want thrown in with a Travelcard, so
it'd just take making a single bus journey to tip the balance in its
favour.)

In message
, at
07:39:14 on Sat, 21 May 2011, Mizter T remarked:
Re the interchange at Kings Cross St Pancras - does partly depend
which way your coming at it from, i.e. from the sub-surface lines or
from the Piccadilly line. Whichever way you might do it, via KXSP,
Temple or Mansion House there'd still be a walk - possibly choose
which walk you prefer...

At Kings Cross, the change from subsurface to Thameslink is one of the
shorter. Another possibility is to take the Jubilee via Baker Street,
then change again at West Hampstead.
--
Roland Perry

On May 21, 3:39*pm, Mizter T wrote:

Go to Wimbledon and take the direct Thameslink stopping train? Timing
wise might not be so great though (the train starts off going in the
'wrong direction' towards Streatham, and isn't particularly snappy).

Thanks but I've tried that before and the train just seems to take
forever before it crosses the river. OK for the evening when I'm not
in a rush.

Alternatively - go to West Brompton and change onto the London
Overground to West Hampstead - from this Sunday's timetable change
there are lots more trains that run direct from the WLL onto the NLL
(half-hourly during the day but every 15 mins during the peaks). From
West Hampstead pick up the Thameslink to Elstree & Borehamwood.

The above route route also avoid zone 1, so is cheaper - you'd only
need a zones 2-6 Travelcard, or if using Oyster PAYG you'd only pay a
zones 2-6 fare so long as you touched on the pink Oyster route
validator when changing at West Brompton - see the TfL Single fare
finder and click on 'Alternate fares' for confirmation of this:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/tickets/fa...inder/current/

I'd forgotten about the West Brompton route, that's certainly worth a
try.

Thanks for all the suggestions, time to do some experimenting to see
which is best!

Paul

In message
s.com of Sat, 21 May 2011 14:24:04 in uk.transport.london, paul in HG
writes
On May 21, 3:39*pm, Mizter T wrote:


[snip]

I'd forgotten about the West Brompton route, that's certainly worth a
try.

Thanks for all the suggestions, time to do some experimenting to see
which is best!

Nobody has said that TfL's Journey Planner (JP) can be used for Luton.
It is slightly tricky to persuade it to take some of the more obscure
routes suggested.

Later: Oh bu??er, the target was Elstree.

Sorry about the verbosity in URLs below. JP finds Elstree ambiguous. It
prefers Elstree & Borehamwood Rail Station but tolerates Elstree and
Borehamwood Station. (That can be passed without problem to both FireFox
and Internet Explorer. Browsers use ";amp;" to communicate "&".)
You may also have problems with your news reader not handling url
correctly where url extends over several lines. I had when testing.

Here goes:

1a) The basic route now
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...language=en&se
ssionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&ty
pe_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station

1b) That route using JP's large print version
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/bcl...anguage=en&ses
sionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&typ
e_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station

1c) That route in German
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...sessionID=0&pt
OptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&type_de stinati
on=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station

1d) That route departing on a specified day and time:
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...language=en&se
ssionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&ty
pe_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station&itd
date=20110523&itdtime=700

1e) That route arriving on a specified day and time:
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...language=en&se
ssionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&ty
pe_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station&itd
Date=20110516&itdTime=700&itdTripDateTimeDepArr=ar r

2) Southfields - Edgware Road - Farringdon - Elstree
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...language=en&se
ssionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&ty
pe_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station&typ
e_via=stop&name_via=Edgware Road (Circle Line)
This is a bit long from an Excel 2003 cell containing a hyperlink call
where I generate those urls.
name_via=Baker Street is equivalent and 14 bytes shorter. (BAY is -17).

3) Southfields - West Brompton - West Hampstead - Elstree (cheaper as
avoids Zone 1)
http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/use...language=en&se
ssionID=0&ptOptionsActive=-1&type_origin=stop&name_origin=southfields&ty
pe_destination=stop&name_destination=Elstree and Borehamwood Station&typ
e_via=stop&name_via=West Hampstead
name_via=West Brompton is ineffective - main route goes through WBT.

4)
In message
..com of Sat, 21 May 2011 07:39:14 in uk.transport.london, Mizter T
writes

[snip]

Go to Wimbledon and take the direct Thameslink stopping train? Timing
wise might not be so great though (the train starts off going in the
'wrong direction' towards Streatham, and isn't particularly snappy).
name_via=Wimbledon selects this route. It did not do so for
name_destination=Luton which suggested changing to an overtaking Bedford
train from a St Albans' at Farringdon.

5)
In message of Sat, 21 May 2011 15:52:14
in uk.transport.london, Roland Perry writes

[snip]

At Kings Cross, the change from subsurface to Thameslink is one of the
shorter. Another possibility is to take the Jubilee via Baker Street,
then change again at West Hampstead.
I can't force this. name_via=Finchley Road goes via Westminster.
As already noted, name_via=Baker Street goes via Farringdon.
--
Walter Briscoe

In message
..com of Sat, 21 May 2011 07:39:14 in uk.transport.london, Mizter T
writes


[snip]

Re the interchange at Kings Cross St Pancras - does partly depend
which way your coming at it from, i.e. from the sub-surface lines or
from the Piccadilly line. Whichever way you might do it, via KXSP,
Temple or Mansion House there'd still be a walk - possibly choose
which walk you prefer...

I think JP is unduly pessimistic in advising 13 minutes between KXX
Piccadilly and STP. I believe it nearer 5 - particularly if you leave
from carriage 2, door 2 which is nearest the Northern Ticket Hall.

BTW. I recently saw a link on UTL to station details on
www.directenquiries.com. That site had stopped showing LU stations when
TfL stopped paying it to do so. I don't have a route to http://www.dire
ctenquiries.com/londonunderground.aspx?tab=Underground%20Stations& level=
1 which is back in place.

I can't find interchanges within a station on Direct Enquiries any more.

The route to the Northern Ticket Hall is shown at http://www.directenqu
iries.com/stationDiagram.aspx?tab=StationPlanRoute&did=0173-0980728%2b01
73-0980819_P2H&did1=0173-0980723_H2E&did2=&cid=0173-1508725&cid1=0173-15
08706&cid2=&fid=0173-0029975&eo=&xo=&lpid=4366&sr=Y&sh=Y&level=1&dir=r& c
ompanyid=74329&company=King%27s%20Cross/St%20Pancras
--
Walter Briscoe

On 22/05/2011 08:50, Walter Briscoe wrote:
I think JP is unduly pessimistic in advising 13 minutes between KXX
Piccadilly and STP. I believe it nearer 5 - particularly if you leave
from carriage 2, door 2 which is nearest the Northern Ticket Hall.

I agree that 13 minutes is too generous but I interchange frequently
between Thameslink and Piccadily Lines at St Pancras and my experience
is that the old western route is faster than the one via the Northern
Ticket Hall, probably by 1 to 1.5 minutes; on the other hand the
Northern Ticket Hall route is less congested because because it's
somewhat tucked away. To save most time on the Western route you need
to be in the last carriage of the northbound Picc line train.

If you walk fast, and walk up/down all three escalators, you can do the
interchange in about 7 minutes; to do it faster than that would involve
running, and with all the gormless Eurostar passengers infesting the
shopping arcade usually known as St.Pancras this would be very tricky.

Changing from the Circle line station to Thameslink can be done in about
5 minutes in my experience, but if you are coming on the circle line
from the east it's certainly much faster to change at Farringdon (but
one of the staircases there is out of use at present making it take
longer than it used to).

That's the price of progress, of course: before they plonked the
shopping centre in St.Pancras you could easily change from Picc line to
Thameslink in under 3 minutes using the now abandoned station.

--
Clive Page

In message , at 08:50:39 on Sun, 22
May 2011, Walter Briscoe remarked:
I think JP is unduly pessimistic in advising 13 minutes between KXX
Piccadilly and STP. I believe it nearer 5 - particularly if you leave
from carriage 2, door 2 which is nearest the Northern Ticket Hall.

They have to take account of people with luggage, and who walk slowly
(I'm not sure if they also take into account using all the lifts on the
way).

You have to go up a flight of stairs, along quite a long corridor, up
some escalators, through the Northern Ticket Hall, then up an escalator
to the St Pancras Concourse. Along past the "Farmers market" and ticket
offices, through the FCC barriers, then down two sets of escalators. The
good news is, all the lifts you might need are right next door to the
stairs/escalators, which isn't always the case.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 10:27:29 on Sun, 22 May
2011, Clive Page remarked:

That's the price of progress, of course: before they plonked the
shopping centre in St.Pancras you could easily change from Picc line to
Thameslink in under 3 minutes using the now abandoned station.

The change they made was moving the Thameslink station. It's as far
south as it could be now, given the curvature of the tunnels. The whole
thing's a mess, frankly. Perhaps the entrance to the new Thameslink
station could have been close by the Eurostar check-in, rather than
halfway to Camden.
--
Roland Perry