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London Overground Expansion
On Oct 6, 10:49*am, BumYoghurt
wrote: The circular route that is planned is a joke, as people mentioned, you need to change at Clapham Junction (the LO platform is a joke there too, covered in weeds, even after they closed it for 4 weeks for maintenance). You'll probably be dropped from Crystal Palace/Surrey Quays at Clapham on platform 17, leaving a 1-2 minutes walk to platform 2 for the LO interchange. I think some are missing the (potential) bigger picture. Extending the (outer SLL) Crystal Palace service to Clapham Junction would use platforms 16 & 17, which could then be extended up the WLL to Willesden Junction. The SLL service would then have platforms 2a & 2b all to itself. As has been mooted elsewhere, they could conceivably then extend these to Wimbledon via East Putney if they rebuilt the flyover at the very least...though they'd probably have to reinstate platform 1 for that as well, depending on whether 2b is obtained by building out the platform to make a bay or by dividing the platform and using a crossover. |
London Overground Expansion
On Wed, Oct 05, 2011 at 11:16:49AM +0100, BumYoghurt wrote:
Just a bit furious as to why they won't extend the London Overground to Streatham- especially when no new track needs to be built. Crystal Palace to Clapham Junction would join up Balham, Wandsworth and Streatham Hill/Common and all would be well with the world. You can't just extend it to Streatham Hill/Common, because there's no facilities for turning trains around - no bay platform, and not enough capacity to let them tie up a through line for a few minutes without seriously screwing up all the other routes. Instead of terminating at Streatham Common, they'd have to go through Norbury and Thornton Heath to Selhurst and then reverse in the depot, or go through to West Croydon (but the bay platform is already in use there for other services) or to East Croydon (which also already has trains being reversed there. Similar for Streatham Hill. Not to mention that those trains would have to cross several more junctions, and share track with several more services, all of which serves to make a service less reliable. -- David Cantrell | even more awesome than a panda-fur coat comparative and superlative explained: Huhn worse, worser, worsest, worsted, wasted |
London Overground Expansion
On Thu, Oct 06, 2011 at 04:57:58PM +0100, Paul Scott wrote:
I'd expect that resurfacing of the whole platform, and reopening the second set of stairs, will be done once the work actually starts at the station.... One has to wonder why that wasn't done at the same time as they laid the extra track just north of the platform. Presumably platform 2 will have to be closed *again* while those works are going on. -- David Cantrell | London Perl Mongers Deputy Chief Heretic 23.5 degrees of axial tilt is the reason for the season |
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Currently we have services from New Cross etc terminating at Highbury And Islington while other services from Stratford go through Highbury And Islington to Clapham Junction. Why is this arrangement better than a straightforward Outer Circle system? |
London Overground Expansion
On Oct 7, 7:41*pm, Robin9 wrote:
David Cantrell;123554 Wrote: There will be no Overground services going *through* Clapham Junction, and no services starting at Clapham Junction, going all the way round the circle, and ending at Clapham Junction. Does anyone know why not? I distinctly remember hearing Ken Livingstone in his day saying that the London Overground would provide London for the first time ever with a circular service through the suburbs. He quite obviously saw the London Overground as a kind of Outer Circle Line. Currently we have services from New Cross etc terminating at Highbury And Islington while other services from Stratford go through Highbury And Islington to Clapham Junction. Why is this arrangement better than a straightforward Outer Circle system? -- Robin9 Because it provides terminating points where the service can recover as well as provide isolation from disruptions on the other half. Think about what happens on the inner Circle Line when a train breaks down. Nothing can pass it, so services back up, and until you get to a point where you can reverse trains, everything grinds to a halt. In an ideal world, you'd perhaps have two semi-circular services operating on the Circle instead: Something like Kings Cross to South Kensington via Liverpool St., and Kings Cross to South Kensington via Notting Hill Gate. Problem is that some will want to get from one half to the other without changing. Notting Hill to Liverpool St is easy - use the Central Line, but something like Paddington to Aldgate is a bit more problematic. Have another pair of overlapping services perhaps, maybe between Tower Hill & Paddington...but space for the terminating platforms needed is hard to find, so the ideal locations aren't always possible. |
London Overground Expansion
"Jamie Thompson" wrote in message
On Oct 7, 7:41 pm, Robin9 wrote: David Cantrell;123554 Wrote: There will be no Overground services going *through* Clapham Junction, and no services starting at Clapham Junction, going all the way round the circle, and ending at Clapham Junction. Does anyone know why not? I distinctly remember hearing Ken Livingstone in his day saying that the London Overground would provide London for the first time ever with a circular service through the suburbs. He quite obviously saw the London Overground as a kind of Outer Circle Line. Currently we have services from New Cross etc terminating at Highbury And Islington while other services from Stratford go through Highbury And Islington to Clapham Junction. Why is this arrangement better than a straightforward Outer Circle system? -- Robin9 Because it provides terminating points where the service can recover as well as provide isolation from disruptions on the other half. Think about what happens on the inner Circle Line when a train breaks down. Nothing can pass it, so services back up, and until you get to a point where you can reverse trains, everything grinds to a halt. In an ideal world, you'd perhaps have two semi-circular services operating on the Circle instead: Something like Kings Cross to South Kensington via Liverpool St., and Kings Cross to South Kensington via Notting Hill Gate. Problem is that some will want to get from one half to the other without changing. Notting Hill to Liverpool St is easy - use the Central Line, but something like Paddington to Aldgate is a bit more problematic. Have another pair of overlapping services perhaps, maybe between Tower Hill & Paddington...but space for the terminating platforms needed is hard to find, so the ideal locations aren't always possible. Well, that's why the Circle line is no longer circular: it's two services that meet at Edgware Road. If you want to go from Bayswater to Baker St, you have to change trains (unless you choose to go the much longer wrong way round). |
London Overground Expansion
"David Cantrell" wrote in message
... One has to wonder why that wasn't done at the same time as they laid the extra track just north of the platform. Presumably platform 2 will have to be closed *again* while those works are going on. I expect because the works just done were part of the NLR improvement project for the enhanced WLL frequency, and the work yet to be done is part of the SLL project. A different type of money probably... Paul S |
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Incidentally if splitting the service to provide a safety margin is so advantageous, why not use the idea to incorporate some of the extensions to the London Overground that have been suggested in this forum over the past few months. For example, instead of the current Richmond to Stratford service, why not Richmond to Caledonian Road and Queens Park to Stratford? |
Some lovely insight here chaps, thanks!
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