In message , at 10:31:55 on Sun, 22
Jan 2012, Graeme Wall remarked:
paywave credit cards. Although I always feel a bit awkward using a
credit card for such small purchases.

Why? I usually have a rule that if I can pay by card I do.

Because I know all the processing and billing costs have to be paid by
someone, and in the end it's the consumers.

Handling cash has quite a high cost as well, again, ultimately paid by
the consumers.

As a rule of thumb it's about 1% for cash and 2% for credit cards.

Debit cards?

I'm less intimidated about using a debit card for small transactions, if
only because so many small shops seem happy to accept them rather than
credit cards. The fee will vary, but I've seen 25p-50p quoted for small
traders in the UK (which would break even with a credit card in the
ballpark of £20, depending on what rate they were charged for those).

And of course, the trader probably gets his money from the debit card
fairly transaction quickly, whereas when I took credit cards it was
monthly in arrears (two months for Amex I think).

For online use, Worldpay's current published rate seems to be 3.35% +
35p for both credit and debit cards.

Another outfit is charging less, on what they call "preferential terms":

Credit card 1.695%
Maestro 22.8p
Electron 24.3p
Visa debit 24.3p
--
Roland Perry

"Robert Neville" wrote in message
...
"tim...." wrote:

how does all this work with rental cars?

Presumably the same as it does with speeding citations. You get a bill
from the
rental car company after the fact along with a hefty administrative
surcharge.

It's the "hefty administrative surcharge" I was concerned about.

It's not unreasonable for a rental company to charge a renter for the work
involved processing something that shouldn't happen.

Quite another if the paperwork is unavoidable and caused by the authorities
not providing a system that rental cars can use without incurring that work

On 22-Jan-12 06:39, tim.... wrote:
"Robert Neville" wrote in message
...
"tim...." wrote:
how does all this work with rental cars?

Presumably the same as it does with speeding citations. You get a bill
from the rental car company after the fact along with a hefty
administrative surcharge.

It's the "hefty administrative surcharge" I was concerned about.

It's not unreasonable for a rental company to charge a renter for the
work involved processing something that shouldn't happen.

Quite another if the paperwork is unavoidable and caused by the
authorities not providing a system that rental cars can use without
incurring that work

Exactly. When NTTA had cash lanes, there were indeed a hefty fees (from
both NTTA and the rental agency) for not paying a toll. When their cash
lanes were eliminated, those fines and fees were also eliminated, as
long as one paid the bill on time. CTRMA still has their cash lanes but
adopted the same pay-by-mail system as NTTA.

HCTRA and FBTRA don't (yet) do pay-by-mail, as with other toll roads in
the US, so the fines and fees are still there for their roads.

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein
CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the
K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking

On 22-Jan-12 03:11, Roland Perry wrote:
on Sat, 21 Jan 2012, Neil Williams remarked:
paywave credit cards. Although I always feel a bit awkward using a
credit card for such small purchases.

Why? I usually have a rule that if I can pay by card I do.

Because I know all the processing and billing costs have to be paid by
someone, and in the end it's the consumers.

Many US retailers push for card use because they believe the labor and
fraud costs of handling cash are higher. This is particularly true for
debit cards, which have a significantly lower merchant fee for PIN
transactions rather than signature transactions. Cards are also faster
than cash for small transactions that are below the merchant's "floor"
and therefore do not require a signature _or_ PIN.

(Why the US doesn't have PIN transactions for credit cards, with the
same lower merchant rate, is a mystery to me. My credit card _does_
have a PIN assigned, for getting a cash advance at ATMs, but it doesn't
work for POS transactions.)

S

--
Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein
CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the
K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking

In message , at 09:08:00 on Sun, 22 Jan
2012, Stephen Sprunk remarked:
Many US retailers push for card use because they believe the labor and
fraud costs of handling cash are higher.

Do you mean the risk of counterfeit banknotes? This is something that
seems to have been overcome in the UK one way or another.

Or is it employees pocketing the cash.
--
Roland Perry

On 22/01/2012 15:23, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 09:08:00 on Sun, 22 Jan
2012, Stephen Sprunk remarked:
Many US retailers push for card use because they believe the labor and
fraud costs of handling cash are higher.

Do you mean the risk of counterfeit banknotes? This is something that
seems to have been overcome in the UK one way or another.

Or is it employees pocketing the cash.

The latter more likely. Plus the risk of robberies while the money is
in store or in transit to the bank.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail

how does all this work with rental cars?

Presumably the same as it does with speeding citations. You get a bill
from the rental car company after the fact along with a hefty administrative
surcharge.

It's the "hefty administrative surcharge" I was concerned about.

In my actualy experience, the surcharge is $2 or $3. You can decide whether that
counts as hefty, in the context of everything else you pay for a car rental.

Considering that people often pay $10/day for the rental company's overpriced
insurance, it doesn't seem very hefty to me.

R's,
John

Why? If you get points for every purchase, why not charge everything
you can? That's what I do.

This does assume you have the discipline to pay off your cards every month.

Or get a charge card that gives points. But I'm still not in favour of
generating piles of paper and statement entries for what are in essence
petty cash transactions.

My wife got a free trip to Japan last years using the points from
those petty transactions. For that I can deal with a few slips of paper.

R's,
John

And of course, the trader probably gets his money from the debit card
fairly transaction quickly, whereas when I took credit cards it was
monthly in arrears (two months for Amex I think).

Back in the 1980s, that was about right. But times have changed, and
most credit cards now put the money in the merchant's account the next
day.

If a place offers a discount for paying cash, I'll take it. But here
in the US, other than a few petrol stations, they never do.

R's,
John

In message , at 15:56:42 on Sun, 22 Jan
2012, John Levine remarked:
how does all this work with rental cars?

Presumably the same as it does with speeding citations. You get a bill
from the rental car company after the fact along with a hefty administrative
surcharge.

It's the "hefty administrative surcharge" I was concerned about.

In my actualy experience, the surcharge is $2 or $3. You can decide whether that
counts as hefty, in the context of everything else you pay for a car rental.

Considering that people often pay $10/day for the rental company's overpriced
insurance, it doesn't seem very hefty to me.

Perhaps it depends how many tolls you go through, and whether they
consolidate the bill. When I was in a hire car in USA last summer we
went through maybe five or six each way per day on a "road trip". We
were paying cash, but I was aware they had cameras to send bills to
people using the transponder lane without having a transponder.
--
Roland Perry