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Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
In message , at
14:34:32 on Mon, 25 Nov 2013, Neil Williams remarked: But is it allowed to process a contactless transaction offline? Floor limits are decided by the retailer, But isn't the contactless credit limit something quite low. but the retailer does this at their own risk. Even for a transaction below the ?£20? contactless credit limit? Fairly sure this is completely independent of what means of verification is used (Pin, signature, contact less or cardholder not present) . Why would a signature protect the retailer more, if the agreement they have is for signature-less contactless transactions? -- Roland Perry |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 14:42:52 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote: But isn't the contactless credit limit something quite low. Twenty quid. Even for a transaction below the ?£20? contactless credit limit? I would think so. Why would a signature protect the retailer more, if the agreement they have is for signature-less contactless transactions? Because then it is basically a swipe and sign transaction. But I bet this is a non deliberate IT error. Neil -- Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On 25/11/2013 08:01, Roland Perry wrote:
[1] Western Ticket Hall, St Pancras. I have to say I've never noticed it. Will pay more attention next time I'm there. It's at the western end of the western ticket hall, one flight of steps (or one lift) up. These are the steps you go up to get to St.Pancras, turning right at the top; but if, instead of turning right, you look diagonally across to your left you will see it the customer inquiry office. I have no idea what the hours are but it's usually been open when I've needed it, e.g. to get a paper copy of the bus map. -- Clive Page |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Neil Williams" wrote in message .net... On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 15:20:07 +0000, Mizter T wrote: I don't think that, for example, basic bank account holders will get CPC cards because of this issue. Probably not. But I am sure all banks will issue to any standard debit card eligible customer, as people will generally want them. are you sure? The demographic that been tested wants them, but are you sure that that's a majority. there are certainly many who don't see the need for them and don't want the risk accociated with something that they will never use tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Neil Williams" wrote in message .net... On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 16:03:41 +0100, "tim......" wrote: no Oyster requires you to own a one time purchase card which has limited supply outlets Now issued at ticket machines and newsagents, no? not sure what you mean just because you can get an Oyster at the machine doesn't make it is useful ticket for someone who wants to make a single journey. The 5 pound deposit makes that completely impractical German transit systems let you buy a paper ticket for immediate travel, from thirs party agents Not in Hamburg. Are you sure Yes. The you are wrong as I've just checked there is a long list of "newsagent" type outlets listed on the website that sell tickets for immediate travel. Though you are right that they don't have paper strip tickets and now have a smart card, but paper single trip and day tickets seem to be still available. and you seem to be able to print at home. I didn't actually get as far as buying the ticket but it seems unlikely they are going to deliver a 1.36 ticket to me. and then there's the "handy ticket" but I wouldn't like to encourage transport authorities to use this method as it usually isn't very friendly for foreigners Long time since I was there but I'm sure that they had strip cards No, they do not and never did. Some German cities do though. Every (large) germen city that I have ever worked in has had some sort of "Carnet" system. They aren't a rarity tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 18:50:12 +0100, "tim......"
wrote: The demographic that been tested wants them, but are you sure that that's a majority. there are certainly many who don't see the need for them and don't want the risk accociated with something that they will never use Your loss. Neil -- Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On 22/11/2013 16:59, Neil Williams wrote: On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 15:20:07 +0000, Mizter T wrote: I don't think that, for example, basic bank account holders will get CPC cards because of this issue. Probably not. But I am sure all banks will issue to any standard debit card eligible customer, as people will generally want them. I wouldn't be so sure of that - there appears to be a different (i.e. more stringent) issuance criteria for contactless-enabled cards. I'll try and remember to ask a friend who should know about such things. * Barclays http://www.barclays.co.uk/Helpsupport/Barclayscontactlessdebitcards/P1242561764200 Under the "How do I get it?" tab: "Contactless debit cards are subject to status and application." ~ * HSBC http://www.hsbc.co.uk/1/2/customer-support/card-services/using-your-card/contactless Under the "I have some questions" tab, in the first FAQ ("About Contactless technology": "Q. How can I get a contactless card? A. Tailor based on contactless card issuance policy" ~ *** NatWest http://www.natwest.com/personal/current-accounts/g4/cards/contactless.ashx Overview tab: "We are now issuing Visa Debit cards with contactless technology to all eligible customers." "How do I get a contactless card?" tab: "-I've just opened a new NatWest current account- If you're eligible, a Visa Debit card with contactless technology will be issued as standard when you open your current account with us. I'm already a NatWest customer -I'm already a NatWest customer- If you’re eligible, a Visa Debit card with contactless technology will be issued as standard when your current Visa Debit card needs replacing. [...]" |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 18:59:53 +0100, "tim......"
wrote: not sure what you mean I was taking issue with "limited supply outlets". Neil -- Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 06:50:12PM +0100, tim...... wrote:
"Neil Williams" wrote in message .net... Probably not. But I am sure all banks will issue to any standard debit card eligible customer, as people will generally want them. are you sure? The demographic that been tested wants them, but are you sure that that's a majority. there are certainly many who don't see the need for them and don't want the risk accociated with something that they will never use Banks seem to be issuing contactless payment cards without asking whether people want them, and most people have no idea that there is any risk associated with them. Whether people want something has little bearing on whether they *should* want it and that has no bearing on whether they will get it. -- David Cantrell | Hero of the Information Age I remember when computers were frustrating because they did exactly what you told them to. That seems kinda quaint now. -- JD Baldwin, in the Monastery |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 02:26:58PM +0000, Neil Williams wrote:
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 13:19:01 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. It is probably more economically sound that she travels free than that there is a ticket office there for her. Probably. And she would if she lived in London because she'd have some species of Freedom Pass. Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! -- David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david I think the most difficult moment that anyone could face is seeing their domestic servants, whether maid or drivers, run away -- Abdul Rahman Al-Sheikh, writing on 25 Jan 2004 at http://archive.arabnews.com/?article=38558 |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 09:08:44AM -0600, wrote:
In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: I say good riddance to ticket offices, despite my own mother not being able to use the machines, provided that they still provide some way of dealing with Oyster errors at stations. You mean they introduce ways of dealing with Oyster errors at stations? Most problems I ever have they (including ticket office staff) say "ring the helpline". The times I've had problems they were sorted out at a station. -- David Cantrell | Cake Smuggler Extraordinaire The Law of Daves: in any gathering of technical people, the number of Daves will be greater than the number of women. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"David Cantrell" wrote Probably. And she would if she lived in London because she'd have some species of Freedom Pass. Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! When it still existed I was once in the queue at Bromley South Travel Centre (run then by South East Trains). Someone who I took to be a widow of a BR staff member was arranging ticketing for a journey to Wickford. It took a considerable time to issue the correct ticket (Priv Return BZ6 to Wickford, as her Freedom Pass would take her to BZ6) and explain to her what she would need to show if she was gripped. The whole fare, let alone the Commission, wouldn't have paid the clerk's time in arranging the transaction. Peter |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 12:26:10 +0000, David Cantrell
wrote: Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! I see no reason it should not be. Neil -- Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
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Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Neil Williams" wrote in message .net... On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 18:50:12 +0100, "tim......" wrote: The demographic that been tested wants them, but are you sure that that's a majority. there are certainly many who don't see the need for them and don't want the risk accociated with something that they will never use Your loss. I wasn't stating a personal position, just telling you how it is tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Neil Williams" wrote in message . net... On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 12:26:10 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! I see no reason it should not be. that fact that all and sundry will be buying themselves priv tickets is the reason that they will use tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
wrote in message ... In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 02:26:58PM +0000, Neil Williams wrote: On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 13:19:01 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. It is probably more economically sound that she travels free than that there is a ticket office there for her. Probably. And she would if she lived in London because she'd have some species of Freedom Pass. Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! How will special tickets like privs be issued without ticket offices? Can one buy a cash ticket from a machine? Yes most people queuing up at the machine are buying "cash" tickets, few of them are topping up Oysters. Of course for cash you can substitute card, I assume that you were using the term to identify the type of ticket bought, not actual payment method tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"tim......" wrote:
wrote in message ... In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: On Mon, Nov 25, 2013 at 02:26:58PM +0000, Neil Williams wrote: On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 13:19:01 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. It is probably more economically sound that she travels free than that there is a ticket office there for her. Probably. And she would if she lived in London because she'd have some species of Freedom Pass. Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! How will special tickets like privs be issued without ticket offices? Can one buy a cash ticket from a machine? Yes most people queuing up at the machine are buying "cash" tickets, few of them are topping up Oysters. Of course for cash you can substitute card, I assume that you were using the term to identify the type of ticket bought, not actual payment method I wonder if TfL will maintain the high premium for "cash" fares once the ticket offices close? I think the premium was first introduced to deter people from using the ticket offices. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
Neil Williams wrote:
In most other countries I expect they would be unavailable and it would just be a "tourist tax". Or a city tax would be charged on hotel rooms and a free ticket issued for everyone staying. I wonder if, say, a £3 per day flat-rate fee on hotel rooms and give everyone a free Z1-2 travelcard would do the trick - not everyone will use it but it solves the problem for the rest. There could also be machines at exit stations for converting Oyster cards into cash - the hotel takes a deposit for the card, the deposit is returned when you exit your last station in London. The only question is for people buying the ticket from their plane/train terminus and the hotel before they pick up their travelcard. Maybe the hotel issues a code so you can collect that Oyster from a machine when you arrive. Theo |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Tue, Nov 26, 2013 at 02:38:02PM +0000, Neil Williams wrote:
On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 12:26:10 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: Things get more complicated because my father is a BR pensioner, so they both get priv rate travel on the tube. I'm guessing that that won't be available via ticket machines! I see no reason it should not be. Given how seldom tickets will actually be inspected by real people, I assume that the risk of revenue loss would be too great. Priv rate tickets are quarter price IIRC. Furthermore, the number of legitimate users of such tickets is minute. TfL staff/families/pensioners get staff Oyster cards IIRC. I don't think current TOC staff are eligible unless they are one of the few left who used to work for BR. So it's only a handful of ex-BR TOC staff, and BR pensioners, who qualify. Not enough legitimate users to make the risk of fare evasion worth it, I'd think. I expect that my parents will have to apply via BR Pensions for some kind of Oyster card if they want to keep their cheap tube travel. I doubt they'll think it worth the bother though, given that most of their journeys in London are merely as part of a cross-London train journey and so already paid for at a NR station ticket office. -- David Cantrell | top google result for "topless karaoke murders" All children should be aptitude-tested at an early age and, if their main or only aptitude is for marketing, drowned. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
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Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 12:10:43 +0000, David Cantrell
wrote: Given how seldom tickets will actually be inspected by real people, I assume that the risk of revenue loss would be too great. Priv rate tickets are quarter price IIRC. Or you have barriers reject them, so they would be subject to a manual barrier check. Neil -- Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 23:30:07 +0000, Paul Corfield wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 17:11:09 -0600, wrote: In article , (David Walters) wrote: On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 21:59:44 +0100, Neil Williams wrote: I think it's about 15 years after its time. City transport networks need simple, automated ticketing. Ticket offices are for the mainline - and TBH I see a reduced need for them there as well - better to have them out showing how to use the machine next time. I generally agree with you but there are lots of tickets that can currently only be bought from a ticket office. As an example can I get a £2 travelcard for a child travelling with me while I use my Gold Card from any machines? Can one get any child tickets from machines? It didn't use to be possible. Yes you can but I believe you have to press an acknowledgement button so you "accept" you are buying a child ticket. This is demonstrate "intent" in the event of an adult travelling on a child ticket and then being caught in a revenue check. TfL would be able to trace back the ticket purchase details. Similarly you can buy railcard discounted tickets such as the Gold Card discounted ODTC - I have actually bought one! Not sure about the child £2 ticket but I would expect it to be available subject to the same process as I set out above. I tried today and couldn't get the machine to sell me one. It's not generally a problem since accompanied children travel free on TfL/LU but if you are also using National Rail they need a ticket. When/if the Moorgate ticket office closes it will not be possible to buy the ticket I want before getting on the train. Of course I don't need that ticket until I get past Finsbury Park. One might say this isn't a TfL/LU problem but I can't buy the discounted tickets from First Capital Connect machines either. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On 27/11/2013 21:17, Paul Corfield wrote:
I believe it is the case that TOC staff do receive privilege rate travel on NR and foreign railways after a qualifying period. I think it is also the case that some TOCs have reciprocal arrangements with TfL for priv travel on LU regardless of how long the employee has worked for the TOC - i.e. not an issue dating back to BR times. Friends who joined TOCs (but not AIUI Network Rail; and I don't know anyone at a freight or open access company) post-privatisation seem to get FIP boxes, but it seems to be only used by people who are "in the know", rather than something absolutely everyone uses. (as in, many people don't actually know about it, rather than just because they are the kind of weird people who don't spend their holidays bashing foreign railways) -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On 30/11/2013 20:44, Arthur Figgis wrote: On 27/11/2013 21:17, Paul Corfield wrote: I believe it is the case that TOC staff do receive privilege rate travel on NR and foreign railways after a qualifying period. I think it is also the case that some TOCs have reciprocal arrangements with TfL for priv travel on LU regardless of how long the employee has worked for the TOC - i.e. not an issue dating back to BR times. Friends who joined TOCs (but not AIUI Network Rail; and I don't know anyone at a freight or open access company) post-privatisation seem to get FIP boxes, but it seems to be only used by people who are "in the know", rather than something absolutely everyone uses. (as in, many people don't actually know about it, rather than just because they are the kind of weird people who don't spend their holidays bashing foreign railways) Possibly not promoted to staff because it costs the TOC money? |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On 01/12/2013 18:18, Mizter T wrote:
On 30/11/2013 20:44, Arthur Figgis wrote: On 27/11/2013 21:17, Paul Corfield wrote: I believe it is the case that TOC staff do receive privilege rate travel on NR and foreign railways after a qualifying period. I think it is also the case that some TOCs have reciprocal arrangements with TfL for priv travel on LU regardless of how long the employee has worked for the TOC - i.e. not an issue dating back to BR times. Friends who joined TOCs (but not AIUI Network Rail; and I don't know anyone at a freight or open access company) post-privatisation seem to get FIP boxes, but it seems to be only used by people who are "in the know", rather than something absolutely everyone uses. (as in, many people don't actually know about it, rather than just because they are the kind of weird people who don't spend their holidays bashing foreign railways) Possibly not promoted to staff because it costs the TOC money? Does it? Obviously there is the admin, but it surely can't be that expensive and probably can't easily be got rid of because of the assorted international agreements. I assume the losses from foreign railwaymen riding up and down on peak trains for free can't be all that great. -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Mizter T" wrote in message ... On 30/11/2013 20:44, Arthur Figgis wrote: On 27/11/2013 21:17, Paul Corfield wrote: I believe it is the case that TOC staff do receive privilege rate travel on NR and foreign railways after a qualifying period. I think it is also the case that some TOCs have reciprocal arrangements with TfL for priv travel on LU regardless of how long the employee has worked for the TOC - i.e. not an issue dating back to BR times. Friends who joined TOCs (but not AIUI Network Rail; and I don't know anyone at a freight or open access company) post-privatisation seem to get FIP boxes, but it seems to be only used by people who are "in the know", rather than something absolutely everyone uses. (as in, many people don't actually know about it, rather than just because they are the kind of weird people who don't spend their holidays bashing foreign railways) Possibly not promoted to staff because it costs the TOC money? Isn't that what joining the union is for? tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
Theo Markettos writes:
Neil Williams wrote: In most other countries I expect they would be unavailable and it would just be a "tourist tax". Or a city tax would be charged on hotel rooms and a free ticket issued for everyone staying. I wonder if, say, a £3 per day flat-rate fee on hotel rooms and give everyone a free Z1-2 travelcard would do the trick - not everyone will use it but it solves the problem for the rest. You are assuming everyone staying in a hotel is an occasional tourist. Many are regular visitors who, like me, already have an oyster card and stay overnight after a concert or a show. They will not take kindly to having to pay again for public transport. Phil |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
In message , at 19:44:35 on Mon, 2 Dec 2013,
Phil remarked: In most other countries I expect they would be unavailable and it would just be a "tourist tax". Or a city tax would be charged on hotel rooms and a free ticket issued for everyone staying. I wonder if, say, a £3 per day flat-rate fee on hotel rooms and give everyone a free Z1-2 travelcard would do the trick - not everyone will use it but it solves the problem for the rest. You are assuming everyone staying in a hotel is an occasional tourist. Many are regular visitors who, like me, already have an oyster card and stay overnight after a concert or a show. They will not take kindly to having to pay again for public transport. And in another place: "The 24-hour tube will boost weekend departures from Heathrow and hit companies selling holiday 'add-ons', claims an operator. Proposals for a 24-hour Tube service on Friday and Saturday nights from 2015 was announced by Transport for London last month. But loveholidays.com claims 'extras' like airport parking or overnight hotels are likely to suffer, as demand will drop. It also believes that Heathrow will become the preferred airport for passengers, as it is the only London/South East airport on a Tube line. Al Francis from loveholidays.com says: "People will be more willing to take flights at 'unsociable' times because the 24-hour Tube service will mean it will be easier to get across London to and from the airport. "The losers will be 'holiday extras'. With a 24-hour Tube service, people are less likely to need airport parking or book an airport hotel." -- Roland Perry |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 09:08:44 -0600,
wrote: In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 05:55:11PM +0000, d wrote: He's probably one of those people who thinks because HE never needs a particular service, no one else ever will either. And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. I say good riddance to ticket offices, despite my own mother not being able to use the machines, provided that they still provide some way of dealing with Oyster errors at stations. You mean they introduce ways of dealing with Oyster errors at stations? Most problems I ever have they (including ticket office staff) say "ring the helpline". The outlying stations are of greater concern than the inner tube, and sub-surface, stations. There needs to be a manned passimeter, and someone watching the gate line, platforms etc. TfL should also consider encouraging newsstands and cafes. If TfL need to save money they would do better to look at more unmanned trains. Is there room for productivity increases? -- http://www.991fmtalk.com/ The DMZ in Reno |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
Aurora wrote:
On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 09:08:44 -0600, wrote: In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 05:55:11PM +0000, d wrote: He's probably one of those people who thinks because HE never needs a particular service, no one else ever will either. And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. I say good riddance to ticket offices, despite my own mother not being able to use the machines, provided that they still provide some way of dealing with Oyster errors at stations. You mean they introduce ways of dealing with Oyster errors at stations? Most problems I ever have they (including ticket office staff) say "ring the helpline". The outlying stations are of greater concern than the inner tube, and sub-surface, stations. There needs to be a manned passimeter, and someone watching the gate line, platforms etc. TfL should also consider encouraging newsstands and cafes. A manned passimeter? Not for the last few decades, the there hasn't! And it's rare to have a manned presence on the platforms on quieter stations. If TfL need to save money they would do better to look at more unmanned trains. Is there room for productivity increases? They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings
there. Hmmn. What does the Paris Metro know that TfL doesn't? -- Regards, John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. http://jl.ly |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Roland Perry" wrote in message ... In message , at 19:44:35 on Mon, 2 Dec 2013, Phil remarked: In most other countries I expect they would be unavailable and it would just be a "tourist tax". Or a city tax would be charged on hotel rooms and a free ticket issued for everyone staying. I wonder if, say, a £3 per day flat-rate fee on hotel rooms and give everyone a free Z1-2 travelcard would do the trick - not everyone will use it but it solves the problem for the rest. You are assuming everyone staying in a hotel is an occasional tourist. Many are regular visitors who, like me, already have an oyster card and stay overnight after a concert or a show. They will not take kindly to having to pay again for public transport. And in another place: "The 24-hour tube will boost weekend departures from Heathrow and hit companies selling holiday 'add-ons', claims an operator. Proposals for a 24-hour Tube service on Friday and Saturday nights from 2015 was announced by Transport for London last month. But loveholidays.com claims 'extras' like airport parking or overnight hotels are likely to suffer, as demand will drop. Rubbish The average person who uses service like that has to make a journey much longer than is possible on the underground If your destination is Milton Keynes, for example, it's no good that you can get to Euston if there aren't any onward trains tim It also believes that Heathrow will become the preferred airport for passengers, as it is the only London/South East airport on a Tube line. Al Francis from loveholidays.com says: "People will be more willing to take flights at 'unsociable' times because the 24-hour Tube service will mean it will be easier to get across London to and from the airport. "The losers will be 'holiday extras'. With a 24-hour Tube service, people are less likely to need airport parking or book an airport hotel." -- Roland Perry |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
"Recliner" wrote in message ... Aurora wrote: On Mon, 25 Nov 2013 09:08:44 -0600, wrote: In article , (David Cantrell) wrote: On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 05:55:11PM +0000, d wrote: He's probably one of those people who thinks because HE never needs a particular service, no one else ever will either. And for people like my blind mother, there will still be staff available to help her buy a ticket. I say good riddance to ticket offices, despite my own mother not being able to use the machines, provided that they still provide some way of dealing with Oyster errors at stations. You mean they introduce ways of dealing with Oyster errors at stations? Most problems I ever have they (including ticket office staff) say "ring the helpline". The outlying stations are of greater concern than the inner tube, and sub-surface, stations. There needs to be a manned passimeter, and someone watching the gate line, platforms etc. TfL should also consider encouraging newsstands and cafes. A manned passimeter? Not for the last few decades, the there hasn't! And it's rare to have a manned presence on the platforms on quieter stations. If TfL need to save money they would do better to look at more unmanned trains. Is there room for productivity increases? They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. why not Other automated lines do (or don't whichever way you look at it!) tim |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
In message , at 18:39:48 on Tue, 3 Dec
2013, tim...... remarked: And in another place: "The 24-hour tube will boost weekend departures from Heathrow and hit companies selling holiday 'add-ons', claims an operator. Proposals for a 24-hour Tube service on Friday and Saturday nights from 2015 was announced by Transport for London last month. But loveholidays.com claims 'extras' like airport parking or overnight hotels are likely to suffer, as demand will drop. Rubbish Many such shroud-waving claims are best treated with extreme suspicion. The average person who uses service like that has to make a journey much longer than is possible on the underground If your destination is Milton Keynes, for example, it's no good that you can get to Euston if there aren't any onward trains Although just losing trade from people living inside the Tube area would have some sort of impact. -- Roland Perry |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Tue, 3 Dec 2013 18:41:18 +0100
"tim......" wrote: They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. why not Other automated lines do (or don't whichever way you look at it!) Good luck trying to evacuate a stranded tube train with no staff on board. Fully automated metro systems - and the DLR - ALL have walkways in the tunnels alongside the track so the doors can be opened remotely and the passengers can just walk to the nearest station. Try doing that with the 6 inch gap between the doors and the tunnel walls on the deep level tube lines. Oh, and there's a 4th rail in the middle of the track so its bloody tricky to walk along without getting electrocuted if someone hasn't switched the power off. -- Spud |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
wrote:
On Tue, 3 Dec 2013 18:41:18 +0100 "tim......" wrote: They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. why not Other automated lines do (or don't whichever way you look at it!) Good luck trying to evacuate a stranded tube train with no staff on board. Fully automated metro systems - and the DLR - ALL have walkways in the tunnels alongside the track so the doors can be opened remotely and the passengers can just walk to the nearest station. Try doing that with the 6 inch gap between the doors and the tunnel walls on the deep level tube lines. Oh, and there's a 4th rail in the middle of the track so its bloody tricky to walk along without getting electrocuted if someone hasn't switched the power off. All true, and DLR trains aren't unmanned or fully automated anyway. The operator still closes the doors, after looking down the platform. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
On Tue, 03 Dec 2013 14:13:38 -0600, Recliner
wrote: wrote: On Tue, 3 Dec 2013 18:41:18 +0100 "tim......" wrote: They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. why not Other automated lines do (or don't whichever way you look at it!) Good luck trying to evacuate a stranded tube train with no staff on board. Fully automated metro systems - and the DLR - ALL have walkways in the tunnels alongside the track so the doors can be opened remotely and the passengers can just walk to the nearest station. Try doing that with the 6 inch gap between the doors and the tunnel walls on the deep level tube lines. Oh, and there's a 4th rail in the middle of the track so its bloody tricky to walk along without getting electrocuted if someone hasn't switched the power off. All true, and DLR trains aren't unmanned or fully automated anyway. The operator still closes the doors, after looking down the platform. And in practice becomes a driver when things go tits-up. |
Proposal - every Tube ticket office to close by 2015
John Levine wrote:
They won't have less than one member of staff on a train, so no savings there. Hmmn. What does the Paris Metro know that TfL doesn't? How to build tunnels with walkways? |
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