On 2013\12\22 15:41, d wrote:
On Sat, 21 Dec 2013 21:27:51 +0000
Paul Corfield wrote:
Clearly until there is an outcome from the investigation all of that
is speculation as is allocating "blame" to the bus driver when he was
not the person that triggered the events that caused the collision
with the tree.

Unless the tree jumped in front of his bus then he has to share part of the
blame. No competent driver is going to avoid hitting a car just to drive into
a tree instead.

I don't agree. You aren't aware of everything that's on the footpath at
all times, and when it becomes obvious that remaining on the road will
definitely cause a crash, you don't have time to familiarise yourself
with the consequences of swerving off the road at that location.

In message , at 14:41:36
on Sun, 22 Dec 2013, remarked:
If he stayed on the road (it's not obvious from the reports/pictures
that he didn't) then I don't blame a bus driver for assuming any
potentially conflicting roadside trees have been cleared away.

(Low bridges are an entirely different matter).

I think you are wrong there. He was certainly heading off the road to hit
the tree in that manner.

The picture I posted shows him pretty much parallel to the kerb, I'd
have thought.

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/arti...ATES/s2197/Mai
n-Bus-Crash-2946066.jpg
--
Roland Perry

On Sun, 22 Dec 2013 16:07:02 +0000
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 15:41:03 on Sun, 22 Dec
2013, d remarked:
Clearly until there is an outcome from the investigation all of that
is speculation as is allocating "blame" to the bus driver when he was
not the person that triggered the events that caused the collision
with the tree.

Unless the tree jumped in front of his bus then he has to share part of the
blame. No competent driver is going to avoid hitting a car just to drive into
a tree instead.

If he stayed on the road (it's not obvious from the reports/pictures
that he didn't) then I don't blame a bus driver for assuming any
potentially conflicting roadside trees have been cleared away.

Eh? If a tree has a low branch overhanging the road that a bus could hit then
fair enough, but this tree is clearly on the pavement and its not exactly
small. Unless he's clinically blind there is no way he couldn't have seen it.

-
Spud

In message , at 10:10:56 on Tue, 24 Dec
2013, d remarked:
If he stayed on the road (it's not obvious from the reports/pictures
that he didn't) then I don't blame a bus driver for assuming any
potentially conflicting roadside trees have been cleared away.

Eh? If a tree has a low branch overhanging the road that a bus could hit then
fair enough, but this tree is clearly on the pavement and its not exactly
small. Unless he's clinically blind there is no way he couldn't have seen it.

In this picture, is the bus on the pavement?

http://www.itu.int/en/ITU-T/others/i...s/default.aspx

I'm assuming the kerb next to the bus aligns with that white line just
beyond the two hi-viz in the foreground, and not out where the police
van is parked. Although there does seem to be perhaps the end of a
lay-by directly in front of the bus.
--
Roland Perry

On Tue, 24 Dec 2013 10:35:10 +0000
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 10:10:56 on Tue, 24 Dec
2013, d remarked:
If he stayed on the road (it's not obvious from the reports/pictures
that he didn't) then I don't blame a bus driver for assuming any
potentially conflicting roadside trees have been cleared away.

Eh? If a tree has a low branch overhanging the road that a bus could hit then
fair enough, but this tree is clearly on the pavement and its not exactly
small. Unless he's clinically blind there is no way he couldn't have seen it.

In this picture, is the bus on the pavement?

http://www.itu.int/en/ITU-T/others/i...s/default.aspx

No idea, but IP6 is certainly a car crash. Albeit in slow motion.

Always check your cut and pastes before posting! )

--
Spud

In message , at 10:44:42 on Tue, 24 Dec
2013, d remarked:
In this picture, is the bus on the pavement?

http://www.itu.int/en/ITU-T/others/i...s/default.aspx

No idea, but IP6 is certainly a car crash. Albeit in slow motion.

Always check your cut and pastes before posting! )

I spotted that and thought I'd corrected it

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/arti...ATES/s2197/Mai
n-Bus-Crash-2946066.jpg

--
Roland Perry

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

In message , at 14:41:36
on Sun, 22 Dec 2013, remarked:
If he stayed on the road (it's not obvious from the reports/pictures
that he didn't) then I don't blame a bus driver for assuming any
potentially conflicting roadside trees have been cleared away.

(Low bridges are an entirely different matter).

I think you are wrong there. He was certainly heading off the road to hit
the tree in that manner.

The picture I posted shows him pretty much parallel to the kerb, I'd
have thought.


http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/arti...s2197/Main-Bus
-Crash-2946066.jpg

OK. That's a different view from the one I saw earlier.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Tue, 24 Dec 2013 11:18:43 +0000
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 10:44:42 on Tue, 24 Dec
2013, d remarked:
In this picture, is the bus on the pavement?

http://www.itu.int/en/ITU-T/others/i...s/default.aspx

No idea, but IP6 is certainly a car crash. Albeit in slow motion.

Always check your cut and pastes before posting! )

I spotted that and thought I'd corrected it

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/arti...ATES/s2197/Mai
n-Bus-Crash-2946066.jpg

Well that tree looks pretty firmly planted in the pavement and I'd say yes,
the bus is slightly off the road.

It wouldn't surprise me of course if the tree isn't cut down now under some
spurious H&S grounds due to it being a "menace" (or similar loaded words) to
traffic even though other drivers have probably managed to avoid hitting it
since the internal combustion engine was invented as it looks a good 200
years old.

--
Spud

In message , at 19:44:07 on Tue, 24 Dec 2013,
d remarked:
http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/arti...ATES/s2197/Mai
n-Bus-Crash-2946066.jpg

Well that tree looks pretty firmly planted in the pavement

But what about the top of the trunk leaning towards the road?

and I'd say yes, the bus is slightly off the road.

How many feet are the nearside wheels up the kerb, and why isn't it
tilted as a result?
--
Roland Perry

On Tue, 24 Dec 2013 11:18:43 +0000 Roland Perry
wrote:

http://i2.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article2946066.ece/ALTERNATES/s2197/Main-Bus-Crash-2946066.jpg


traffic even though other drivers have probably managed to avoid hitting
it since the internal combustion engine was invented as it looks a good
200
years old.


https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=e...2F%3B860%3B570

For a benchmark, the Kingston half mile tree is 60 years old


--
Mike D