In uk.transport.london message
om, Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:16:38, e27002 aurora posted:

On Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:03:03 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

Basil Jet wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxScXvX1Dv4

I'm a little surprised that they claim it uses less power than a
conventional lift. If you have to raise a given mass through a
given vertical distance, shouldn't the answer be the same?


It is a funicular railway, no?


According to the beginning of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funicular#Inclined_lift, a funicular must
have two cars - but other parts of the article ignore that.

--
(c) John Stockton, Surrey, UK. Turnpike v6.05 MIME.
Merlyn Web Site - FAQish topics, acronyms, & links.

On Sun, 15 Nov 2015 22:33:16 +0000, Dr J R Stockton
wrote:

In uk.transport.london message
om, Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:16:38, e27002 aurora posted:

On Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:03:03 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

Basil Jet wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxScXvX1Dv4

I'm a little surprised that they claim it uses less power than a
conventional lift. If you have to raise a given mass through a
given vertical distance, shouldn't the answer be the same?


It is a funicular railway, no?


According to the beginning of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funicular#Inclined_lift, a funicular must
have two cars - but other parts of the article ignore that.

"Funicular" relates to the haulage method (a rope) so once again
Wonkypaedia seems to have bolted a few bits on to a definition unlike
e.g. Wiktionary which simply states "Of, pertaining to, resembling, or
powered by a rope or cable" in agreement with various dictionary
websites. It would seem to be a false assumption that a funicular
railway is inevitably one that uses two vehicles rather than one and a
counterbalance as used on the currently out of use Broadstairs Cliff
Railway :-
http://www.theheritagetrail.co.uk/cl...roadstairs.htm
(NB 5' 3" gauge).
and the definitely-defunct Margate Cliff Railway
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/mar.htm

The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.

On 16/11/2015 01:38, Charles Ellson wrote:
On Sun, 15 Nov 2015 22:33:16 +0000, Dr J R Stockton
wrote:

In uk.transport.london message
om, Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:16:38, e27002 aurora posted:

On Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:03:03 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

Basil Jet wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxScXvX1Dv4

I'm a little surprised that they claim it uses less power than a
conventional lift. If you have to raise a given mass through a
given vertical distance, shouldn't the answer be the same?


It is a funicular railway, no?


According to the beginning of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funicular#Inclined_lift, a funicular must
have two cars - but other parts of the article ignore that.

"Funicular" relates to the haulage method (a rope) so once again
Wonkypaedia seems to have bolted a few bits on to a definition unlike
e.g. Wiktionary which simply states "Of, pertaining to, resembling, or
powered by a rope or cable" in agreement with various dictionary
websites. It would seem to be a false assumption that a funicular
railway is inevitably one that uses two vehicles rather than one and a
counterbalance as used on the currently out of use Broadstairs Cliff
Railway :-
http://www.theheritagetrail.co.uk/cl...roadstairs.htm
(NB 5' 3" gauge).
and the definitely-defunct Margate Cliff Railway
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/mar.htm

The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.


Technically the counterbalance could be the second vehicle in the
description, it doesn't have to be passenger carrying.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.

On 16/11/2015 01:38, Charles Ellson wrote:
On Sun, 15 Nov 2015 22:33:16 +0000, Dr J R Stockton
wrote:

In uk.transport.london message
om, Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:16:38, e27002 aurora posted:

On Sat, 14 Nov 2015 09:03:03 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

Basil Jet wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxScXvX1Dv4

I'm a little surprised that they claim it uses less power than a
conventional lift. If you have to raise a given mass through a
given vertical distance, shouldn't the answer be the same?


It is a funicular railway, no?


According to the beginning of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funicular#Inclined_lift, a funicular must
have two cars - but other parts of the article ignore that.

"Funicular" relates to the haulage method (a rope) so once again
Wonkypaedia seems to have bolted a few bits on to a definition unlike
e.g. Wiktionary which simply states "Of, pertaining to, resembling, or
powered by a rope or cable" in agreement with various dictionary
websites. It would seem to be a false assumption that a funicular
railway is inevitably one that uses two vehicles rather than one and a
counterbalance as used on the currently out of use Broadstairs Cliff
Railway :-
http://www.theheritagetrail.co.uk/cl...roadstairs.htm
(NB 5' 3" gauge).
and the definitely-defunct Margate Cliff Railway
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/mar.htm

The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.



--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.

Charles Ellson wrote:


The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.

There's one in Switzerland on that list, and a former one on IoM, which are
single car funiculars.


Anna Noyd-Dryver

On 16.11.15 22:03, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
Charles Ellson wrote:


The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.

There's one in Switzerland on that list, and a former one on IoM, which are
single car funiculars.


Anna Noyd-Dryver

The one on the Isle of Man closed sometimes in the 70/s80s, IIRC.

What about the funicular at Aberystwyth?

On Tue, 17 Nov 2015 00:38:07 +0000, "
wrote:

On 16.11.15 22:03, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote:
Charles Ellson wrote:


The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA. Using two vehicles is probably optimal for
nearly all systems thus providing the seed for Wonky's incorrect
description.

There's one in Switzerland on that list, and a former one on IoM, which are
single car funiculars.


Anna Noyd-Dryver

The one on the Isle of Man closed sometimes in the 70/s80s, IIRC.

What about the funicular at Aberystwyth?

Two vehicles but described as a "water balance system" before
electrification in 1921 :-
http://www.aberystwythcliffrailway.co.uk/
It was the longest UK funicular before the Cairngorm Mountain Railway
was opened.

On 17.11.15 1:15, wrote:
On Tue, 17 Nov 2015 00:38:07 +0000, "
wrote:


There's one in Switzerland on that list, and a former one on IoM, which are
single car funiculars.


Anna Noyd-Dryver



What about the funicular at Aberystwyth?

That has two cars, they have buffers at the lower end which appear to
have come off ordinary goods wagons. Can't really see the point of
them as if the car was to descend out of control they won't actually
do much,perhaps they are there to let the car rest against something
if it has to be detached during cable maintainance but what would pass
for a buffer stop was in a state of collapse when I visited a few
months back.
Maybe it is for a cosmetic look to make the cars seem more train like
for the Thomas the Tank generation.
http://www.nwrail.org.uk/vc121010-aberystwyth-3.jpg

G.Harman


Do any of the UK funiculars use tokens for fare payment and entrance?

In message , Charles Ellson
wrote:
It would seem to be a false assumption that a funicular
railway is inevitably one that uses two vehicles rather than one and a
counterbalance as used on the currently out of use Broadstairs Cliff
Railway :-
http://www.theheritagetrail.co.uk/cl...roadstairs.htm
(NB 5' 3" gauge).
and the definitely-defunct Margate Cliff Railway
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/mar.htm

The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA.

Only?

The Southend Cliff Lift (though it's actually in Westcliff) is single
car.

So is the one at the reconstructed village near Ironbridge whose name I
forget. (I managed to persuade my youngest two daughters that it was a
house moving by magic.)

--
Clive D.W. Feather | Home:
Mobile: +44 7973 377646 | Web: http://www.davros.org
Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is:

In article , (Clive D.
W. Feather) wrote:

In message , Charles
Ellson wrote:
It would seem to be a false assumption that a funicular
railway is inevitably one that uses two vehicles rather than one and a
counterbalance as used on the currently out of use Broadstairs Cliff
Railway :-
http://www.theheritagetrail.co.uk/cl...roadstairs.htm
(NB 5' 3" gauge).
and the definitely-defunct Margate Cliff Railway
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/mar.htm

The only other two single-vehicle railways in the World listed in :-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...cular_railways
were both in the USA.

Only?

The Southend Cliff Lift (though it's actually in Westcliff) is single
car.

Not called a funicular we note.

So is the one at the reconstructed village near Ironbridge whose name
I forget. (I managed to persuade my youngest two daughters that it
was a house moving by magic.)

--
Colin Rosenstiel