In message , at 21:29:45 on
Wed, 13 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked:

Section 6.8.6 says "If you make a journey using pay as you go on a bus
or tram, you can make a second bus or tram journey for free within one
hour of first touching in." As has been noted already, that is
ambiguous.

I don't find it ambiguous at all. To me, it's perfectly clear that it
means your second touch-in will be free if it's within 60 minutes of
the first.

Yes, because I can easily conclude they are (from the public perspective
anyway) falling between two stools of dumbing-down and using internal
jargon.

Thus the public might feel that a more accurate clause was:

"If you COMPLETE ONE journey using pay as you go on a bus or
tram, you can START a second bus or tram journey for free within
one hour of first touching in."

But the author sees:

"If you MAKE A TOUCH-IN using pay as you go on a bus or tram,
you can MAKE a second bus or tram TOUCH-IN for free within one
hour of first touching in."

There's another kind of "make" jargon in the Fire Brigade. By default
they send two pumps, but the officer in charge can radio in "Make pumps
four". Which doesn't mean "please place an order with the manufacturer
to make four more pumps", but "make THE NUMBER OF pumps HERE INCREASE TO
four".
--
Roland Perry

On 14/09/2017 07:08, Roland Perry wrote:
Thus the public might feel that a more accurate clause was:

"If you COMPLETE ONE journey using pay as you go on a bus or
tram, you can START a second bus or tram journey for free within
one hour of first touching in."

But the author sees:

"If you MAKE A TOUCH-IN using pay as you go on a bus or tram,
you can MAKE a second bus or tram TOUCH-IN for free within one
hour of first touching in."

I agree its ambiguous, but the former is surely intended.

But what happens if you have to catch a 3rd bus because the 2nd one is terminated early? A couple of times recently on a bus that I've been using the driver has had instructions sent in by radio to stop his service prematurely, perhaps because of congestion or too many of the same route number in a convoy. So I've had to get off and get on another bus that is following the same route. This doesn't cause me more than mild annoyance as I have a bus pass, but if you are using Oyster would this be included in the 2nd-bus-within-an-hour concession, and if so how does the system handle it?

--
Clive Page

In message , at 11:49:08 on Thu, 14
Sep 2017, Clive Page remarked:
On 14/09/2017 07:08, Roland Perry wrote:
Thus the public might feel that a more accurate clause was:
"If you COMPLETE ONE journey using pay as you go on a bus
or
tram, you can START a second bus or tram journey for free within
one hour of first touching in."
But the author sees:
"If you MAKE A TOUCH-IN using pay as you go on a bus or
tram,
you can MAKE a second bus or tram TOUCH-IN for free within one
hour of first touching in."

I agree its ambiguous, but the former is surely intended.

But what happens if you have to catch a 3rd bus because the 2nd one is
terminated early? A couple of times recently on a bus that I've been
using the driver has had instructions sent in by radio to stop his
service prematurely, perhaps because of congestion or too many of the
same route number in a convoy. So I've had to get off and get on
another bus that is following the same route. This doesn't cause me
more than mild annoyance as I have a bus pass, but if you are using
Oyster would this be included in the 2nd-bus-within-an-hour concession,
and if so how does the system handle it?

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to
give you a chitty to show the following driver?
--
Roland Perry

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

In message , at 11:49:08 on Thu, 14
Sep 2017, Clive Page remarked:
On 14/09/2017 07:08, Roland Perry wrote:
Thus the public might feel that a more accurate clause was:
"If you COMPLETE ONE journey using pay as you go on a bus
or tram, you can START a second bus or tram journey for free

within one hour of first touching in."
But the author sees:
"If you MAKE A TOUCH-IN using pay as you go on a bus or tram,
you can MAKE a second bus or tram TOUCH-IN for free within one
hour of first touching in."

I agree its ambiguous, but the former is surely intended.

But what happens if you have to catch a 3rd bus because the 2nd one is
terminated early? A couple of times recently on a bus that I've been
using the driver has had instructions sent in by radio to stop his
service prematurely, perhaps because of congestion or too many of the
same route number in a convoy. So I've had to get off and get on
another bus that is following the same route. This doesn't cause me
more than mild annoyance as I have a bus pass, but if you are using
Oyster would this be included in the 2nd-bus-within-an-hour concession,
and if so how does the system handle it?

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to
give you a chitty to show the following driver?

With emphasis on the "supposed", I seem to recall.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 14/09/2017 13:08, wrote:
Snip

But what happens if you have to catch a 3rd bus because the 2nd one is
terminated early? A couple of times recently on a bus that I've been
using the driver has had instructions sent in by radio to stop his
service prematurely, perhaps because of congestion or too many of the
same route number in a convoy. So I've had to get off and get on
another bus that is following the same route. This doesn't cause me
more than mild annoyance as I have a bus pass, but if you are using
Oyster would this be included in the 2nd-bus-within-an-hour concession,
and if so how does the system handle it?

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to
give you a chitty to show the following driver?

With emphasis on the "supposed", I seem to recall.


The so-called "chitty" was offered to those who used Oyster PAYG or
Contactless by the driver of the W15 service I was on yesterday when he
announced the change of destination.

And by the driver of a 308 service sometime last week.



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In article ,
(Robin) wrote:

On 14/09/2017 13:08, wrote:
Snip

But what happens if you have to catch a 3rd bus because the 2nd one is
terminated early? A couple of times recently on a bus that I've
been using the driver has had instructions sent in by radio to stop
his service prematurely, perhaps because of congestion or too many of
the same route number in a convoy. So I've had to get off and get on
another bus that is following the same route. This doesn't cause me
more than mild annoyance as I have a bus pass, but if you are using
Oyster would this be included in the 2nd-bus-within-an-hour
concession, and if so how does the system handle it?

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to
give you a chitty to show the following driver?

With emphasis on the "supposed", I seem to recall.

The so-called "chitty" was offered to those who used Oyster PAYG or
Contactless by the driver of the W15 service I was on yesterday when
he announced the change of destination.

And by the driver of a 308 service sometime last week.

Things must have improved then.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 14/09/2017 12:08, Roland Perry wrote:

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to give you a chitty to show the following driver?

Yes, well remembered.

Today I was in London and, would you believe it, the second bus I took was terminated early. So this must happen quite often. Surely somebody knows the solution to what must be a common problem? Or are bus fares so cheap that nobody cares any longer?

--
Clive Page

Clive Page wrote:
On 14/09/2017 12:08, Roland Perry wrote:

Back in the day wasn't the driver of the terminating bus supposed to
give you a chitty to show the following driver?

Yes, well remembered.

Today I was in London and, would you believe it, the second bus I took
was terminated early. So this must happen quite often. Surely somebody
knows the solution to what must be a common problem? Or are bus fares
so cheap that nobody cares any longer?

Probably, most people on the bus aren't paying at all, as they're covered
by bus passes, Freedom cards, Travelcards, Season Tickets, Oyster capping,
Hopper fares, Zip Oyster photocards, etc.

Clive Page wrote:
Or are bus fares so cheap that nobody cares any longer?

Even: if tickets cost a pound apiece, why should you make a fuss?

#Paul

wrote:
Clive Page wrote:
Or are bus fares so cheap that nobody cares any longer?

Even: if tickets cost a pound apiece, why should you make a fuss?

£1.50