| Page 1 of 2 | 1 | 2 |
|
|
Goblin latest
It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ -- Basil Jet - listening to (Mi-Mz)... Michael Chapman. Michael Karoli. Michael Nyman. Michael Rother. Mick Karn. Mick Ronson. Mickey Hart. Midlake. Mike Oldfield. Mike Watt. Miles Davis. Million Dead. Mini Mansions. Ministry. Minutemen. Mission Of Burma. Mister Modo and Ugly Mac Beer. Modest Mouse. Modified Man. Moebius. Mogwai. Moloko. Momus. Monaco. Monks. Monstrance. Monte Cazazza. Moonshake. Mordant Music. Morrissey. Morton Subotnick. Motörhead. Mouse On Mars. Mozart. Mr Wright. Mudhoney. Mumford & Sons. Muse. MX-80 Sound. My Bloody Valentine. My Brightest Diamond |
Goblin latest
Basil Jet wrote:
It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ TfL certainly has a lot of looming issues. But I'd have thought it could redeploy some of the 315s displaced from the Shenfield line as a very short-term GOBLIN replacement fleet. Presumably Bombardier would have to fund this, as it's months late with the new Aventras, and it currently maintains the 315s anyway. |
Goblin latest
On Wed, 18 Jul 2018 05:24:29 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. Its not hard to see why this has happened when you witness the responses of so called "professional" railway employees on here when I suggested perhaps TfL should have ordered a few more 378s when they had the chance or perhaps BR should have just electrified the goblin with DC decades ago. It really is no surprise the british rail industry is an utter basket case when this is the calibre of the people working in it. |
Goblin latest
In article ,
Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ TfL certainly has a lot of looming issues. But I'd have thought it could redeploy some of the 315s displaced from the Shenfield line as a very short-term GOBLIN replacement fleet. Stock training the GOBLIN drivers twice is probably better than bustitution; but are the 315s commited elsewhere? -- Mike Bristow |
Goblin latest
Mike Bristow wrote:
In article , Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ TfL certainly has a lot of looming issues. But I'd have thought it could redeploy some of the 315s displaced from the Shenfield line as a very short-term GOBLIN replacement fleet. Stock training the GOBLIN drivers twice is probably better than bustitution; but are the 315s commited elsewhere? No, they're destined for the scrapyard, but have been kept in reserve while the TfL Rail Aventras bedded in. It would seem to make sense for GOBLIN drivers to start being trained on them immediately. |
Goblin latest
Basil Jet wrote:
It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ Surely there are some surplus EMUs lurking somewhere at the moment which they could borrow for a while, as Scotrail did with the 365s? Anna Noyd-Dryver |
Goblin latest
In message , at 12:22:04 on Wed, 18 Jul
2018, Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...k-and-crossrai l-a-london-transport-update/ Surely there are some surplus EMUs lurking somewhere at the moment which they could borrow for a while, as Scotrail did with the 365s? Even more 365's, currently [a week ago anyway] at Papworth sidings? -- Roland Perry |
Goblin latest
In article , wrote:
Its not hard to see why this has happened when you witness the responses of so called "professional" railway employees on here when I suggested perhaps TfL should have ordered a few more 378s when they had the chance or perhaps BR should have just electrified the goblin with DC decades ago. It really is no surprise the british rail industry is an utter basket case when this is the calibre of the people working in it. This being the TfL that's so scrapped for cash that it's mortgaging rolling stock it hasn't finished paying for yet? Or the DC electrification project which would have cost the taxpayer millions and set back OHLE by half a century further? -- Jonathan D. Amery, http://www.pick.ucam.org/~jdamery/ ##### "In the name of scientific experimentation, the varying o__####### bureaus, departments and faculties agreed that an effort \'####### should be made to have him assassinated to verify that fact." D. Eddings |
Goblin latest
On 18 Jul 2018 15:14:44 +0100 (BST)
Jonathan Amery wrote: In article , wrote: Its not hard to see why this has happened when you witness the responses of so called "professional" railway employees on here when I suggested perhaps TfL should have ordered a few more 378s when they had the chance or perhaps BR should have just electrified the goblin with DC decades ago. It really is no surprise the british rail industry is an utter basket case when this is the calibre of the people working in it. This being the TfL that's so scrapped for cash that it's mortgaging rolling stock it hasn't finished paying for yet? The 378s were ordered long before Kahn came in and froze fares. Or the DC electrification project which would have cost the taxpayer millions and set back OHLE by half a century further? Half a century? Would the presense of a switched off conductor rail on a closed for upgrade line cause some some disturbance in The Force preventing the installation of AC overhead then? Oddly it didn't prevent most of the rest of the NLL being converted to AC. |
Goblin latest
In article , wrote:
On 18 Jul 2018 15:14:44 +0100 (BST) Jonathan Amery wrote: This being the TfL that's so scrapped for cash that it's mortgaging rolling stock it hasn't finished paying for yet? The 378s were ordered long before Kahn came in and froze fares. Also long before there was any finalized plans to electrify the GOBLIN in any sense; as has been described before. Also TfL were already running low on money in the early 2010s which would have been the latest possible time to order more 378s, and that at a higher cost than the original units were since they'd used all their option to buy more units. Or the DC electrification project which would have cost the taxpayer millions and set back OHLE by half a century further? Half a century? Would the presense of a switched off conductor rail on a closed for upgrade line cause some some disturbance in The Force preventing the installation of AC overhead then? Oddly it didn't prevent most of the rest of the NLL being converted to AC. No, but having spent millions only 10 years ago will cause a disturbance in the beancounters. -- Jonathan Amery. +---------+ ________________ _________________ ##### |Cambridge| |# [] ## ## [] # | | # [] ## ## [] #| #######__o +-+-----+-+ | [] [] | | [] [] | #######'/ ----------+-----+--------- \-oo----------oo-/+\-oo----------oo-/ |
Goblin latest
On 18 Jul 2018 16:32:34 +0100 (BST)
Jonathan Amery wrote: In article , wrote: On 18 Jul 2018 15:14:44 +0100 (BST) Jonathan Amery wrote: This being the TfL that's so scrapped for cash that it's mortgaging rolling stock it hasn't finished paying for yet? The 378s were ordered long before Kahn came in and froze fares. Also long before there was any finalized plans to electrify the GOBLIN in any sense; as has been described before. Not entirely true. The goblin electrification looked pretty certain in 2009 when it would have been fairly easy to roll a few more 378s off the production line. Also TfL were already running low on money in the early 2010s which would have been the latest possible time to order more 378s, and that at a higher cost than the original units were since they'd used all their option to buy more units. Would that cost have been more than the 710s they're ordering now? Either way, they'd have an electric service running now if they'd ordered more 378s. Currently they don't. Half a century? Would the presense of a switched off conductor rail on a closed for upgrade line cause some some disturbance in The Force preventing the installation of AC overhead then? Oddly it didn't prevent most of the rest of the NLL being converted to AC. No, but having spent millions only 10 years ago will cause a disturbance in the beancounters. :o) 10 years ago yes, but I was referring to decades ago when the NLL was first electrified. I have no idea why the goblin didn't have a 3rd rail put down at the same time but if it had this problem wouldn't exist. |
Goblin latest
On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 10:18:54 +0100
Robin9 wrote: ;166533 Wrote: 10 years ago yes, but I was referring to decades ago when the NLL was first electrified. I have no idea why the goblin didn't have a 3rd rail put down at the same time but if it had this problem wouldn't exist. The North London Line was indeed electrified decades ago, and electric trains ran from Richmond to Broad Street. When Broad Street was closed, the 3rd rail electrification was extended to North Woolwich and the trains from Richmond were diverted to there. I've sometimes wondered why the NLL went as far as north woolwich. There's nothing there (though that seems to be changing). Was the ferry trip over from woolwich proper + NLL preferable to the direct train services from woolwich? When I moved to Leyton, I used it one day to visit a friend in Kentish Town. The man in the ticket office - yes, we have them in those days - asked me "why does nobody use this line?" I replied that it was because no-one knew about the service. Some things don't change. If you look at a current tube map you'll notice the finsbury park to moorgate line has now been removed which seems a petty thing to do given how useful it is. Just because its not run by TfL doesn't to me seem like a good enough excuse not to have it. |
Quote:
Now, of course, the Stratford/North Woolwich section is a tram service with additional stops and 3rd rail has been replaced by overhead cables until South Acton Station. As for the Woolwich Ferry, I don't recall many pedestrians ever using it. It was always busy with vehicles. |
Goblin latest
On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 13:39:54 +0100
Robin9 wrote: Now, of course, the Stratford/North Woolwich section is a tram service with additional stops and 3rd rail has been replaced by overhead cables until South Acton Station. As for the Woolwich Ferry, I don't recall many pedestrians ever using it. It was always busy with vehicles. I didn't mean the current woolwich ferry , I remember reading somewhere that there was a foot ferry to north woolwich that landed at a quay just near the station. |
Goblin latest
|
Goblin latest
On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 17:49:49 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\19 14:24, wrote: On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 13:39:54 +0100 Robin9 wrote: Now, of course, the Stratford/North Woolwich section is a tram service with additional stops and 3rd rail has been replaced by overhead cables until South Acton Station. As for the Woolwich Ferry, I don't recall many pedestrians ever using it. It was always busy with vehicles. I didn't mean the current woolwich ferry , I remember reading somewhere that there was a foot ferry to north woolwich that landed at a quay just near the station. It's a foot tunnel. I've never heard of a foot ferry in Woolwich. Pedestrians are of course allowed on the car ferry. Interesting, didn't know there was a foot tunnel at woolwich. |
Goblin latest
On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 05:24:31 UTC+1, Basil Jet wrote:
It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ Overtaken by events. The proposed timetable change that would require the 172s to move to West Midlands Trains has been cancelled. Therefore, if necessary, the 172 could stay beyond November 2018. Two class 710s have been moved to Willesden to ease storage issues at Derby.. Still awaiting the type approval sign off for them to actually run on NR tracks. Only then can a range of activities commence which would allow them to be used for driver training on the GOBLIN. Two more 710s may follow to Willesden but, again, only for storage at this point. -- Paul C via Google |
Goblin latest
On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 10:13:34 UTC+1, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ TfL certainly has a lot of looming issues. But I'd have thought it could redeploy some of the 315s displaced from the Shenfield line as a very short-term GOBLIN replacement fleet. Presumably Bombardier would have to fund this, as it's months late with the new Aventras, and it currently maintains the 315s anyway. No you can't redeploy 315s. They do not have body mmounted CCTV cameras so you need to either retrofit them with this kit - pointless as they going to the scrapheap. You could fit platform CCTV and monitors at stations assuming there is space - this would take many months to do and get sign off. The new trains should be in service by then. The other alternative is to have dispatching staff on every platform - seems a rather extreme thing to do and no one will have budget for it. I really can't see any of this happening plus there are still a load of issues around whether the 315s even fit on the GOBLIN, whether LO drivers are trained on the stock etc etc. -- Paul C via Google |
Goblin latest
On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 10:16:01 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2018 05:24:29 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. Its not hard to see why this has happened when you witness the responses of so called "professional" railway employees on here when I suggested perhaps TfL should have ordered a few more 378s when they had the chance or perhaps BR should have just electrified the goblin with DC decades ago. It really is no surprise the british rail industry is an utter basket case when this is the calibre of the people working in it. As I was the person who gave you a honest answer to your past questions about the 710s vs 378s then I assume you are tarring me with your insults about "so called professional railway employees". I have always tried to give you decent and appropriate answers on here despite the abuse and insults you chuck around. I know you won't give a damn about this but I won't be bothering in future. Must be nice to be so bloody clever that you can read the past, the present and the future and also be "right" about everything. -- Paul C via Google |
Goblin latest
On 20/07/2018 09:45, wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 17:49:49 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\19 14:24, wrote: On Thu, 19 Jul 2018 13:39:54 +0100 Robin9 wrote: Now, of course, the Stratford/North Woolwich section is a tram service with additional stops and 3rd rail has been replaced by overhead cables until South Acton Station. As for the Woolwich Ferry, I don't recall many pedestrians ever using it. It was always busy with vehicles. I didn't mean the current woolwich ferry , I remember reading somewhere that there was a foot ferry to north woolwich that landed at a quay just near the station. It's a foot tunnel. I've never heard of a foot ferry in Woolwich. Pedestrians are of course allowed on the car ferry. Interesting, didn't know there was a foot tunnel at woolwich. Though from a nostalgia-fuelled visit last year it is at times more a cycle tunnel - and I don't mean the cyclists "scooting" their bike where it's quiet the way they used to 60 years ago. -- Robin reply-to address is (intended to be) valid |
Goblin latest
Paul Corfield wrote:
On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 05:24:31 UTC+1, Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ Overtaken by events. The proposed timetable change that would require the 172s to move to West Midlands Trains has been cancelled. Therefore, if necessary, the 172 could stay beyond November 2018. Ah, every cloud has a silver lining! Two class 710s have been moved to Willesden to ease storage issues at Derby. Still awaiting the type approval sign off for them to actually run on NR tracks. Only then can a range of activities commence which would allow them to be used for driver training on the GOBLIN. Two more 710s may follow to Willesden but, again, only for storage at this point. I was wondering if TfL Rail 345s could be used for at least part of the GOBLIN driver training? I know the software is different, but presumably the 710s and 345s are very similar to drive, and there's no shortage of 345s waiting to go into service. If so, it could reduce the amount of hands-on training needed on the tardy 710s. |
Goblin latest
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 02:24:35 -0700 (PDT)
Paul Corfield wrote: On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 10:13:34 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: =20 It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel= =20 trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up=20 bustituting for a while. =20 https://www.londonreconnections.com/...-and-crossrai= l-a-london-transport-update/ =20 =20 TfL certainly has a lot of looming issues. But I'd have thought it could redeploy some of the 315s displaced from the Shenfield line as a very short-term GOBLIN replacement fleet. Presumably Bombardier would have to fund this, as it's months late with the new Aventras, and it currently maintains the 315s anyway. No you can't redeploy 315s. They do not have body mmounted CCTV cameras so = you need to either retrofit them with this kit - pointless as they going to= the scrapheap. You could fit platform CCTV and monitors at stations assum= ing there is space - this would take many months to do and get sign off. Th= I assume there are rules saying they can't just look out of a window when closing the doors to check for obstructions? |
Goblin latest
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 02:29:44 -0700 (PDT)
Paul Corfield wrote: On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 10:16:01 UTC+1, wrote: On Wed, 18 Jul 2018 05:24:29 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel= =20 trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up=20 bustituting for a while. =20 Its not hard to see why this has happened when you witness the responses = of so called "professional" railway employees on here when I suggested perha= ps TfL should have ordered a few more 378s when they had the chance or perha= ps BR=20 should have just electrified the goblin with DC decades ago. It really is= no=20 surprise the british rail industry is an utter basket case when this is t= he=20 calibre of the people working in it. As I was the person who gave you a honest answer to your past questions abo= ut the 710s vs 378s then I assume you are tarring me with your insults abou= t "so called professional railway employees". I have always tried to give y= I wasn't thinking of you tbh. However please explain why tfl didn't order any more 378s for the goblin when they ordered more cars for the ELL back in 2013 when the goblin electrification had been given the go-ahead. |
Goblin latest
On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote:
Paul Corfield wrote: On Wednesday, 18 July 2018 05:24:31 UTC+1, Basil Jet wrote: It's looking fairly likely that TfL will have to give away their diesel trains before the electric trains are ready, and might end up bustituting for a while. https://www.londonreconnections.com/...nsport-update/ Overtaken by events. The proposed timetable change that would require the 172s to move to West Midlands Trains has been cancelled. Therefore, if necessary, the 172 could stay beyond November 2018. Ah, every cloud has a silver lining! Two class 710s have been moved to Willesden to ease storage issues at Derby. Still awaiting the type approval sign off for them to actually run on NR tracks. Only then can a range of activities commence which would allow them to be used for driver training on the GOBLIN. Two more 710s may follow to Willesden but, again, only for storage at this point. I was wondering if TfL Rail 345s could be used for at least part of the GOBLIN driver training? I know the software is different, but presumably the 710s and 345s are very similar to drive, and there's no shortage of 345s waiting to go into service. If so, it could reduce the amount of hands-on training needed on the tardy 710s. Well you can't run a 345 on the GOBLIN - won't fit anywhere as they're all too long. No point teaching LO drivers on the GEML as most of them will never drive it - only those working the Romminster shuttle. I also can't see anything that might interrupt the launch of Crossrail being countenanced by TfL. That's the "must happen" event of the year - only 5 and a bit months to go. I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail plus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be different to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. I really don't think there are practical alternatives that involve short term use of "alien" rolling stock. TfL, Arriva and Bombardier simply have to get through the slog of getting the 710s into service as fast as they can. The only fall back, if the 172s have to leave, is to revert to a bus replacement service. That would be enormously embarrassing but if Bombardier cannot get the trains to work what else can be done in a short time period at minimum expense? TfL have no money to splash around on more complex and costly alternatives. The shame of it all is that an electrified line and new trains are what is needed but getting there has been painful beyond belief and an object lesson in "how not to do this". -- Paul C via Google |
Goblin latest
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT)
Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? |
Goblin latest
On 18/07/2018 10:40, Recliner wrote:
No, they're destined for the scrapyard, but have been kept in reserve Oooooooh. Oh, only Class 315s. -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
Goblin latest
|
Goblin latest
Graham Harrison wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Interestingly, Southwest, the biggest buyer of 737s, has always persuaded Boeing not to change the flight deck and controls too much as the plane has gone through multiple generations. |
Goblin latest
On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. -- Basil Jet - listening to (Mi-Mz)... Michael Chapman. Michael Karoli. Michael Nyman. Michael Rother. Mick Karn. Mick Ronson. Mickey Hart. Midlake. Mike Oldfield. Mike Watt. Miles Davis. Million Dead. Mini Mansions. Ministry. Minutemen. Mission Of Burma. Mister Modo and Ugly Mac Beer. Modest Mouse. Modified Man. Moebius. Mogwai. Moloko. Momus. Monaco. Monks. Monstrance. Monte Cazazza. Moonshake. Mordant Music. Morrissey. Morton Subotnick. Motörhead. Mouse On Mars. Mozart. Mr Wright. Mudhoney. Mumford & Sons. Muse. MX-80 Sound. My Bloody Valentine. My Brightest Diamond |
Goblin latest
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. 👍 |
Goblin latest
On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 23:55:57 +0100
Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout Sure, I understand that but it makes it easier. that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly But you could say the same about cars and lorries, however the controls have had the same basic layout for about 100 years now meaning with only a small amount of familiarisation someone can jump from one road vehicle to another and be driving it fairly quickly. |
Goblin latest
On Sat, 21 Jul 2018 09:48:28 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. Oh do give it a rest. What exactly is the major advance in technology from the 378s to the 710s? Very little I'd venture, perhaps a weight reduction and thats about it. And I bet the seats in the latter will have all the padding of concrete so will be less pleasent for passengers. |
Goblin latest
On 22/07/2018 09:27, wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jul 2018 09:48:28 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. Oh do give it a rest. What exactly is the major advance in technology from the 378s to the 710s? Very little I'd venture, perhaps a weight reduction and thats about it. And I bet the seats in the latter will have all the padding of concrete so will be less pleasent for passengers. You don't get to tell the entire group to **** off and then have us at your beck and call to answer questions that you've already been given answers to in the last six months. -- Basil Jet - listening to (Mi-Mz)... Michael Chapman. Michael Karoli. Michael Nyman. Michael Rother. Mick Karn. Mick Ronson. Mickey Hart. Midlake. Mike Oldfield. Mike Watt. Miles Davis. Million Dead. Mini Mansions. Ministry. Minutemen. Mission Of Burma. Mister Modo and Ugly Mac Beer. Modest Mouse. Modified Man. Moebius. Mogwai. Moloko. Momus. Monaco. Monks. Monstrance. Monte Cazazza. Moonshake. Mordant Music. Morrissey. Morton Subotnick. Motörhead. Mouse On Mars. Mozart. Mr Wright. Mudhoney. Mumford & Sons. Muse. MX-80 Sound. My Bloody Valentine. My Brightest Diamond |
Goblin latest
Basil Jet wrote:
On 22/07/2018 09:27, wrote: On Sat, 21 Jul 2018 09:48:28 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. Oh do give it a rest. What exactly is the major advance in technology from the 378s to the 710s? Very little I'd venture, perhaps a weight reduction and thats about it. And I bet the seats in the latter will have all the padding of concrete so will be less pleasent for passengers. You don't get to tell the entire group to **** off and then have us at your beck and call to answer questions that you've already been given answers to in the last six months. Yup, I've decided not to provide any more free education to Neil (Boltar). |
Goblin latest
On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 10:56:19 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: On 22/07/2018 09:27, wrote: On Sat, 21 Jul 2018 09:48:28 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 2018\07\20 23:55, Graham Harrison wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 13:56:59 +0000 (UTC), wrote: On Fri, 20 Jul 2018 05:44:10 -0700 (PDT) Paul Corfield wrote: On Friday, 20 July 2018 10:41:18 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: I also suspect that the 345s have different performance parameters than the= 710s given the need for very rapid acceleration and braking on Crossrail p= lus higher speeds to run skip stop out west. Their cabs should also be dif= ferent to reflect the different signalling tech that the trains work with. Is there any case for a common cab EMU control panel to be mandated so that cross training between various stocks is less of a chore in the same way that all airliners by airbus (don't know about boeing) tend to have the controls in similar locations no matter what the aircraft? Just because they have similar controls doesn't mean you, the pilot, can walk off an A320 straight onto an A380. Airbus do indeed tout that possibility but there is a requirement for additional training if only because of the increased weight and 4 engines. Not only that but the differences between early A320s and the latest neo models isn't simply a matter of new engines; display systems in the cockpits have moved on as well. I would suggest that the continuous evolution of control systems means that a single cab configuration, designed now, would be seen as obsolete quite quickly Not if Boltar was in charge, because he would have bought enough aeroplanes for 150 years in 1903. Oh do give it a rest. What exactly is the major advance in technology from the 378s to the 710s? Very little I'd venture, perhaps a weight reduction and thats about it. And I bet the seats in the latter will have all the padding of concrete so will be less pleasent for passengers. You don't get to tell the entire group to **** off and then have us at your beck and call to answer questions that you've already been given answers to in the last six months. I've yet to here any technical details beyond "oh, they're better". |
Goblin latest
On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 10:13:19 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: Yup, I've decided not to provide any more free education to Neil (Boltar). Am I supposed to be impressed? Its amazing what you can dig up from old usenet post addresses correlated with company names isn't it as someone demonstrated to me , oh, at least 10 years ago. |
Goblin latest
wrote:
On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 10:13:19 -0000 (UTC) Recliner wrote: Yup, I've decided not to provide any more free education to Neil (Boltar). Am I supposed to be impressed? Its amazing what you can dig up from old usenet post addresses correlated with company names isn't it as someone demonstrated to me , oh, at least 10 years ago. Why would I try and impress you, Mr Neil J Robertson? |
Goblin latest
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 10:46:56 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: wrote: On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 10:13:19 -0000 (UTC) Recliner wrote: Yup, I've decided not to provide any more free education to Neil (Boltar). Am I supposed to be impressed? Its amazing what you can dig up from old usenet post addresses correlated with company names isn't it as someone demonstrated to me , oh, at least 10 years ago. Why would I try and impress you, Mr Neil J Robertson? Good old companies house. No doubt if you're not too thick you've also found a couple of my old addresses too and the name of my late stepmum bless her. Well done. Now you're probably trying to figure out which is my profile on facebook - I can save you the trouble, I'm not on it and there is no picture of me anywhere on the internet. But do carry on searching since you inevitably won't believe me. If I wanted anonymity on here I wouldn't still be using this old handle. HTH. |
Goblin latest
It's a foot tunnel. I've never heard of a foot ferry in Woolwich.
Pedestrians are of course allowed on the car ferry. There used to also be a railway-operated ferry at North Woolwich, the burned out remains of the pier which it once served were still there a few years ago and may still be there now, I haven’t been there recently. It was killed off many decades ago by the mearby free ferry and foot tunnel. I think it may have been around First World War time, but I’m not sure. |
| All times are GMT. The time now is 08:33 AM. |
|
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2006 LondonBanter.co.uk