On 19/10/2018 15:22, wrote:
On Fri, 19 Oct 2018 07:18:18 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp wrote:
This stuck out:
"With pollution killing about 48,000 Parisians a year..."
Wow. That is a huge amount. I wonder what the figure is for London.

Whatever it is its probably hell of a lot less than it was even 20 years ago
with the improvements in vehicle emission controls. The whole thing is being
over hyped by politicians looking for an easy bandwagon and various eco idiots
and vested interests.

And when they say "killing 48,000 a year" what they mean is that all
Parisians (And Londoners) are having their lives slightly shortened by
the pollution compared with their predicted lifespans in unpolluted
places. Call it about 1.5% off your life exectancy.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

John Williamson wrote:
On 19/10/2018 15:22, wrote:
On Fri, 19 Oct 2018 07:18:18 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp wrote:
This stuck out:
"With pollution killing about 48,000 Parisians a year..."
Wow. That is a huge amount. I wonder what the figure is for London.

Whatever it is its probably hell of a lot less than it was even 20 years ago
with the improvements in vehicle emission controls. The whole thing is being
over hyped by politicians looking for an easy bandwagon and various eco idiots
and vested interests.

And when they say "killing 48,000 a year" what they mean is that all
Parisians (And Londoners) are having their lives slightly shortened by
the pollution compared with their predicted lifespans in unpolluted
places. Call it about 1.5% off your life exectancy.


To get a better idea of how pollution affects people you really need to see
what is has been like for the past 200 years rather than the last 50.
Comparing London and Paris would be interesting
London smogs used to be notorious till burning of plain coal was banned in
smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.
In contrast homes in Paris tended to burn wood for much of the 19th and
20th centuries which is why the buildings never got that black look so
prevalent on London buildings till they got pressure washed from the
1970’s.
London shines now compared to what it used to look like but
Parisians may not have had such a great change.


GH

On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT
Marland wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
And when they say "killing 48,000 a year" what they mean is that all
Parisians (And Londoners) are having their lives slightly shortened by
the pollution compared with their predicted lifespans in unpolluted
places. Call it about 1.5% off your life exectancy.


To get a better idea of how pollution affects people you really need to see
what is has been like for the past 200 years rather than the last 50.
Comparing London and Paris would be interesting
London smogs used to be notorious till burning of plain coal was banned in
smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.

IMO based on nothing apart from the vague haze I can see in the tube train
headlights when it comes down the tunnel and the fact that a some of the
drivers wear mouth masks , I would suggest that the worst pollution in London
now isn't at street level - its on the deep level tube.

On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT, Marland
wrote:

smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.

I have noticed that my snot gets darker when I'm on holiday in London.
I normally reside in Kristiansand, Norway.

--
jhk

Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:
On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT, Marland
wrote:

smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.

I have noticed that my snot gets darker when I'm on holiday in London.
I normally reside in Kristiansand, Norway.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-41498653

So, the Mayor thinks that tyres and brakes aggravate the problem significantly. It would be interesting to know by how much that could be reduced if we did away with speed humps and all the new traffic lights which have been installed in the past 20 years.

Robin9 wrote:

'Recliner[_3_ Wrote:
;167253']Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:-
On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT, Marland
wrote:
-
smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a
dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.-

I have noticed that my snot gets darker when I'm on holiday in London.
I normally reside in Kristiansand, Norway.
-

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-41498653

So, the Mayor thinks that tyres and brakes aggravate the problem
significantly. It would be interesting to know by how much that could be
reduced if we did away with speed humps and all the new traffic lights
which have been installed in the past 20 years.


Yes, it's interesting how much of the pollution is *not* the product of
vehicle combustion engines. So getting rid of older diesels won't have
quite the dramatic impact expected.

On Wed, 24 Oct 2018 09:14:58 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
Robin9 wrote:

'Recliner[_3_ Wrote:
;167253']Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:-
On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT, Marland
wrote:
-
smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a
dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.-

I have noticed that my snot gets darker when I'm on holiday in London.
I normally reside in Kristiansand, Norway.
-

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-41498653

So, the Mayor thinks that tyres and brakes aggravate the problem
significantly. It would be interesting to know by how much that could be
reduced if we did away with speed humps and all the new traffic lights
which have been installed in the past 20 years.


Yes, it's interesting how much of the pollution is *not* the product of
vehicle combustion engines. So getting rid of older diesels won't have
quite the dramatic impact expected.

"a network of "zero-emission zones" where the burning of wood or coal is
prohibited."

I thought the burning of coal in london had been prohibited since the 50s.
Perhaps that was just for commercial premises, not homes.

On Wed, 24 Oct 2018 09:29:30 +0100
Robin9 wrote:
'Recliner[_3_ Wrote:
;167253']Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:-
On 20 Oct 2018 01:26:15 GMT, Marland
wrote:
-
smokeless zones and even into 1980’s a trip to London resulted in a
dirty
collars, hair and black snot which doesn’t happen now since vehicle
exhausts got treated.-

I have noticed that my snot gets darker when I'm on holiday in London.
I normally reside in Kristiansand, Norway.
-

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-41498653

So, the Mayor thinks that tyres and brakes aggravate the problem
significantly. It would be interesting to know by how much that could be
reduced if we did away with speed humps and all the new traffic lights
which have been installed in the past 20 years.

Ken livingstone buggered up the traffic light sequencing which make traffic
jams even worse, unfortunately neither subsequent mayor seems to have been
bothered to fix what he broke.