On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

wrote:
On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

That's too bad, particularly the upload speeds. You must be a long way from
the cabinet.

On Tue, 23 Jul 2019 23:25:58 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

Outside ? Do you actually mean the terminal block ? None of the jacks
are made for outdoor use.

That's too bad, particularly the upload speeds. You must be a long way from
the cabinet.

Roland Perry Wrote in message:
Since I always buy my phones unlocked, with cash, I have had this
type of contract (30-day) from Vodafone for *at least* 7 years,
probably more like a decade. If they're "softening up" their
users, they're taking a ****ing long time over it.
Have they always called it a "contract", despite being only for 30days?

Yes.

As an aside, actually you have just prompted me to consider
extending the term to 12 months though, in the interests of
"locking in" the set of free-roaming countries for a year at
least before Brexit... Emergency roaming data is the only reason
I keep that SIM (that and an irrational attachment to a phone
number that's been mine for a couple of decades,) and Vodafone's
roaming deals are actually pretty decent.

The only person making this complicated is you. It's really very
simple - they have two fundamental offers - Contract (post-pay)
and Pay As You Go (pre-pay).
And then there's the hybrid deals which are a bit of both, but mainly PAYG (post-pay).

Please can you provide an example of one of these "hybrid" deals
then? Because I've yet to see one that wasn't just a 30-day
contract.

--

On 23/07/2019 20:07, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 18:59:17 on Tue, 23 Jul
2019, Clank remarked:
Roland Perry Wrote in message:
When we got the first three last year the 12-month minimum version
was £1 pcm cheaper (so we took it); but when I got the fourth one a
couple of months ago the prices were identical and the staff member
flat out told us that they could see no reason why you'd take the
12-month.
I can only assume they are softening up their users to have a rather
too fuzzy impression of what the term "contract" means, and wean them
off the idea of "PAYG".

Since I always buy my phones unlocked, with cash, I have had this
type of contract (30-day) from Vodafone for *at least* 7 years,
probably more like a decade.Â* If they're "softening up" their
users, they're taking a ****ing long time over it.

Have they always called it a "contract", despite being only for 30days?
You still have a paid agreement with them no matter what you or they
call it.

The only person making this complicated is you.Â* It's really very
simple - they have two fundamental offers - Contract (post-pay)
and Pay As You Go (pre-pay).

And then there's the hybrid deals which are a bit of both, but mainly
PAYG (post-pay).

On 24/07/2019 00:25, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

That's too bad, particularly the upload speeds. You must be a long way from
the cabinet.

I'm 2.09 Km as the gull flies from the exchange (between Penarth and
Dingle Road railway stations) but I'm about 1.6 K from my cabinet which
is probably at least 2.5 Km electrically from the exchange.

On 24/07/2019 05:20, Charles Ellson wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jul 2019 23:25:58 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

Outside ? Do you actually mean the terminal block ? None of the jacks
are made for outdoor use.
BT do have an outdoor waterproof socket available. It can be quite fun
as most engineers have not seen one before.

That's too bad, particularly the upload speeds. You must be a long way from
the cabinet.

wrote:
On 24/07/2019 00:25, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 23:12, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 22:21, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 23/07/2019 17:27, Clank wrote:
MissRiaElaine Wrote in message:
calls to German mobiles costs ?20 per month. My mother-in-law now has a
mobile instead of a land line in her OAP home.
So how do you get broadband..? *Reliable and fast* mobile broadband is
still some way off, certainly here in the UK.

That's because the UK has ****ing terrible infrastructure.

I just did a quick speedtest.net test of my mobile broadband:

https://www.speedtest.net/my-result/a/5143807298


Unfortunately the UK population seems more interested in blaming
foreigners and electing clowns than actually doing anything about
said woeful infrastructure, so ¯\_(?)_/¯.


23-07-2019 16:38:46 (GMT) 10.4 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:54:27 (GMT) 8.2 Mbps 0.5 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:52:52 (GMT) 8.0 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:51:23 (GMT) 3.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:49:57 (GMT) 9.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:41:25 (GMT) 6.1 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:38:20 (GMT) 7.7 Mbps 0.6 Mbps EE
23-07-2019 15:23:15 (GMT) 1.3 Mbps 0.4 Mbps EE

This is my crap broadband this afternoon.


Is that mobile (4G), WiFi or wired data?

Sorry. Wired internet.

The amazing thing is I've managed to persuade EE something is wrong!


Is that ADSL or VDSL (ie, FTTC)? It would be mediocre for the former, but
terrible for the latter.

For a period I was getting similar poor performance from my FTTC line. I
kept complaining, and each time they sent an Openreach technician who
usually got me back up to 50Mbps download/10 upload, but it didn't last.
Finally, I told BT that I'd had enough, and demanded that they release me
from my contract. They reluctantly agreed, and I've changed ISP. I've now
got my final BT bill with the hefty cancellation charge, which I hope they
will cancel as promised.

With my new ISP, I now get completely consistent speeds on a wired
connection (it's more variable on WiFi). You probably don't want to look at
the speeds I get now…
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/48239986081/in/dateposted-friend/lightbox/

If I want faster, it's readily available, with no hardware changes, but the
price goes up. However, I really don't think I have any conceivable need
for more.

It's VDSL. My line is so bad that the maximum realistic speed is 13Mbps
which it has been since it was repaired a few weeks ago. Our evening
storm has just started and the speed has dropped again. Normally this
means the connections in my outside waterproof master socket (which
isn't waterproof) have corroded... again.

That's too bad, particularly the upload speeds. You must be a long way from
the cabinet.

I'm 2.09 Km as the gull flies from the exchange (between Penarth and
Dingle Road railway stations) but I'm about 1.6 K from my cabinet which
is probably at least 2.5 Km electrically from the exchange.


If you have FTTC, it's only the cable distance between your router and the
cabinet that matters; the copper cable from the cabinet to the exchange
only affects voice calls. And, yes, 1.6km from the cabinet will give very
low speeds. In theory, you could get up to about 20 Mbps if the cables and
joints between you and the cabinet are in good condition:

https://www.increasebroadbandspeed.co.uk/2013/chart-bt-fttc-vdsl2-speed-against-distance

I'm about 500m from my cabinet, and got download speeds up to about 51
Mbps, but usually less, and up to 11 Mbps upload. It's nice to get a
reliable 165 Mbps now, both down and up.

In message , at 08:39:21 on Wed, 24 Jul
2019, remarked:

Have they always called it a "contract", despite being only for
30days?

You still have a paid agreement with them no matter what you or they
call it.

That's never been in dispute. It's the wording used which is confusing
people.

If I buy a first class stamp, I have a legal contract with the Post
Office (to deliver one letter). But when they talk about 'contracts'
they mean long term high volume business.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 09:13:10 on Wed, 24 Jul
2019, Clank remarked:

Please can you provide an example of one of these "hybrid" deals
then?

Virgin pay-monthly.

Because I've yet to see one that wasn't just a 30-day contract.
And therein lies your denial about the terminology.
--
Roland Perry