Northern Line goes south
 

The whole Northern Line has been suspended since just before 6am this
morning, because of 'signal systems failure at the main control centre'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-49576740

Northern Line goes south
 

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
The whole Northern Line has been suspended since just before 6am this
morning, because of 'signal systems failure at the main control centre'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-49576740

"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

tim

Northern Line goes south
 

On 04/09/2019 15:17, tim... wrote:


"Recliner" wrote in message
...
The whole Northern Line has been suspended since just before 6am this
morning, because of 'signal systems failure at the main control centre'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-49576740

"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

140000% PiXC?


--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Simple Kid - 2003 - SK1

Northern Line goes south
 

On Wed, 4 Sep 2019 15:17:59 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:



"Recliner" wrote in message
...
The whole Northern Line has been suspended since just before 6am this
morning, because of 'signal systems failure at the main control centre'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-49576740

"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

Yes, that's something I often wonder with LU disruptions. Probably
what they really mean is that they're running a reduced service, with
extended intervals between trains.

Northern Line goes south
 

On Wed, 4 Sep 2019 15:17:59 +0100
"tim..." wrote:
"Billy No Mates Always On His Own" Billy No Mates Always On His Own.usenet@gma
il.com wrote in message
...
The whole Northern Line has been suspended since just before 6am this
morning, because of 'signal systems failure at the main control centre'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-49576740

"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

If they tried to get in on the Met with its signalling also not playing
ball they wouldn't have. Seems that these modern systems have quite a few
single points of failure instead of being distributed with failover backups.

Northern Line goes south
 

In article , Recliner
writes
"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

Yes, that's something I often wonder with LU disruptions. Probably
what they really mean is that they're running a reduced service, with
extended intervals between trains.

No, the trains do run to a timetable. This may mean that train 123 is 20
minutes behind time or, more likely, that trains are taking longer
between stations than they should.

--
Clive D.W. Feather

Northern Line goes south
 

"Clive D.W. Feather" wrote in message
...
In article , Recliner
writes
"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe
delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

Yes, that's something I often wonder with LU disruptions. Probably
what they really mean is that they're running a reduced service, with
extended intervals between trains.

No, the trains do run to a timetable.

Most of us know that

It used to be possible to get a physical copy (I'm beginning to wish that I
had kept my "collection")

And very possible an online variant, as for busses until they took those
away (or hid them very well) in favour of just informing people using the
journey planner.

This may mean that train 123 is 20
minutes behind time or,

but if everything is running 20 minutes (or 2 hours, or 4 hours, or 6 hours)
behind time, because all trains were stuck in the depot for that length of
time, who will notice other than the dispatcher (whatever his job title is).

It's all very well TfL telling us that trains are running with severe
delays, meaning that individual trains are running behind their nominal
timetable, but if there still a service frequency of one trains every 3-4
minutes, in the real world, who cares?

OTOH if they mean something else, such as extended intervals because fewer
trains are running, or because of extended dwell times at stations caused by
congested platforms, they should use a more appropriate terminology.

tim

Northern Line goes south
 

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 08:44:10 +0100, tim... wrote:


"Clive D.W. Feather" wrote in message
...
In article , Recliner
writes
"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe
delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

Yes, that's something I often wonder with LU disruptions. Probably
what they really mean is that they're running a reduced service, with
extended intervals between trains.

No, the trains do run to a timetable.

Most of us know that

It used to be possible to get a physical copy (I'm beginning to wish that I
had kept my "collection")

And very possible an online variant, as for busses until they took those
away (or hid them very well) in favour of just informing people using the
journey planner.

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

This may mean that train 123 is 20
minutes behind time or,

but if everything is running 20 minutes (or 2 hours, or 4 hours, or 6 hours)
behind time, because all trains were stuck in the depot for that length of
time, who will notice other than the dispatcher (whatever his job title is).

It's all very well TfL telling us that trains are running with severe
delays, meaning that individual trains are running behind their nominal
timetable, but if there still a service frequency of one trains every 3-4
minutes, in the real world, who cares?

OTOH if they mean something else, such as extended intervals because fewer
trains are running, or because of extended dwell times at stations caused by
congested platforms, they should use a more appropriate terminology.

The definition for Severe Delays is based on how the trains are perceived
to be running, not on if they are running according to the WTT. For
example on the Jubilee line during peak times gaps in service of more
than 10 minutes are a severe delay.

See
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/transpa...=FOI-1233-1718
for some examples.

Northern Line goes south
 

"David Walters" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 08:44:10 +0100, tim... wrote:


"Clive D.W. Feather" wrote in message
...
In article , Recliner
writes
"The service had reopened by 13:00, but is now running with severe
delays"

yep all trains are running 7 hours late

how will anyone notice?

Yes, that's something I often wonder with LU disruptions. Probably
what they really mean is that they're running a reduced service, with
extended intervals between trains.

No, the trains do run to a timetable.

Most of us know that

It used to be possible to get a physical copy (I'm beginning to wish that
I
had kept my "collection")

And very possible an online variant, as for busses until they took those
away (or hid them very well) in favour of just informing people using the
journey planner.

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

what a confusing format

East and westbound on alternative pages - might very possibly make sense in
printed form, absolutely useless in PDF form

tim

Northern Line goes south
 

On 06/09/2019 10:56, tim... wrote:

"David Walters" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 08:44:10 +0100, tim...
wrote:

"Clive D.W. Feather" wrote in message
...

No, the trains do run to a timetable.

Most of us know that

It used to be possible to get a physical copy (I'm beginning to wish
that I
had kept my "collection")

And very possible an online variant, as for busses until they took those
away (or hid them very well) in favour of just informing people using
the journey planner.

Hid them so well that I had to type "london underground working
timetables" into Mr Google's Information Emporium to get them to come up
as the first result.

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

what a confusing format

East and westbound on alternative pages - might very possibly make sense
in printed form, absolutely useless in PDF form

They're for drivers, not for spotters. Normies never see them. Why are
you channelling Boltar?

The other fact not mentioned is that when the service restarts all of
the drivers will be in the wrong places, which means they'll be hitting
their legal working hours limit in odd places unless the controllers
turn various trains in various places for the next few hours. This won't
affect the central area much, but you will probably get unusually long
intervals at Barnet and Edgware sporadically for the rest of the day.

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Radiohead - 2001 - Pyramid Song

Northern Line goes south
 

"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 06/09/2019 10:56, tim... wrote:

"David Walters" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 08:44:10 +0100, tim...
wrote:

"Clive D.W. Feather" wrote in message
...

No, the trains do run to a timetable.

Most of us know that

It used to be possible to get a physical copy (I'm beginning to wish
that I
had kept my "collection")

And very possible an online variant, as for busses until they took
those
away (or hid them very well) in favour of just informing people using
the journey planner.

Hid them so well that I had to type "london underground working

would never have occurred to me to add "working timetable"

timetables" into Mr Google's Information Emporium to get them to come up
as the first result.

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

what a confusing format

East and westbound on alternative pages - might very possibly make sense
in printed form, absolutely useless in PDF form

They're for drivers, not for spotters.

Not a spotter, just a customer who's interested in the nominal frequency for
each service

As an example, I caught a Wimbleware train yesterday which was changed en
route to early terminating at HSK, because we were "running late"

I looked at the board when I got off and the next Wimbleware train was in 10
minutes and I thought "if it's a 10 minute frequency then that's late as
well!)

Normies never see them.

Yesterday I was a normal - I was going shopping to a specific shop.

Admittedly, on the way back I detoured via the West London line as I hadn't
done it since before there were intermediate stations.

Why are you channelling Boltar?

I didn't realise that I was (whatever channelling means)

The other fact not mentioned is that when the service restarts all of the
drivers will be in the wrong places, which means they'll be hitting their
legal working hours limit

Yeah I got that.

tim

Northern Line goes south
 

On 06/09/2019 16:13, tim... wrote:
"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 06/09/2019 10:56, tim... wrote:

"David Walters" wrote in message
...

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

what a confusing format

East and westbound on alternative pages - might very possibly make
sense in printed form, absolutely useless in PDF form

They're for drivers, not for spotters.

Not a spotter, just a customer who's interested in the nominal frequency
for each service

There's a frequency table in each WTT preceding the actual times.

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Radiohead - 1997 - No Surprises

Northern Line goes south
 

"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 06/09/2019 16:13, tim... wrote:
"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 06/09/2019 10:56, tim... wrote:

"David Walters" wrote in message
...

The Underground Working Timetables are available online:
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables

what a confusing format

East and westbound on alternative pages - might very possibly make
sense in printed form, absolutely useless in PDF form

They're for drivers, not for spotters.

Not a spotter, just a customer who's interested in the nominal frequency
for each service

There's a frequency table in each WTT preceding the actual times.

yeah, I got that

It also tells me how many train diagrams there are, and what time they leave
the depot.

my point was it contained more than I actually needed.

tim



--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Radiohead - 1997 - No Surprises

Northern Line goes south
 

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 16:13:53 +0100
"tim..." wrote:
"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 06/09/2019 10:56, tim... wrote:
Yesterday I was a normal - I was going shopping to a specific shop.

Admittedly, on the way back I detoured via the West London line as I hadn't
done it since before there were intermediate stations.

Why are you channelling Boltar?

I didn't realise that I was (whatever channelling means)

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the fault of
the passenger.

Northern Line goes south
 

On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

Northern Line goes south
 

"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

tim

Northern Line goes south
 

On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.


--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

Northern Line goes south
 

MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.

Lineside signals are disappearing altogether. So colour light signals will
soon seem as quaint as semaphores. You already don't see signals on HS1, or
the DLR, or several Tube lines. Presumably the same will soon be true of
the Glasgow Subway, or Merseyside.

Northern Line goes south
 

MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.



With the Underground gradually being reequipped with new signalling systems
and trains with in cab displays
are there going to be signals with LEDs to worry about in a few years.


GH

Northern Line goes south
 

Marland wrote:
MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.



With the Underground gradually being reequipped with new signalling systems
and trains with in cab displays
are there going to be signals with LEDs to worry about in a few years.

Haven't those on five lines already gone? And, of course, the DLR never
had them.

Northern Line goes south
 

On 07/09/2019 23:00, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are
the fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.

Right... because peering into the fog hoping to see a light every 100
yards that hasn't been obscured by a branch or stolen by scrotes is so
much better than having a monitor in the cab with the message
"Clear for 6.7km, 50kph TSR in 3.4km" written on it.

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Bibio - 2001 - K Is For Kelson

Northern Line goes south
 

On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 00:49:05 +0100, Basil Jet
wrote:

On 07/09/2019 23:00, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are
the fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.

Right... because peering into the fog hoping to see a light every 100
yards that hasn't been obscured by a branch or stolen by scrotes is so
much better than having a monitor in the cab with the message
"Clear for 6.7km, 50kph TSR in 3.4km" written on it.

There are times when I wish Usenet allowed upvotes.

I've just come back from a rail rover. I loved seeing remote token
exchange platforms, drivers getting out of the cab to request tokens
at other places, and distant signals sharing the post with the section
signal. I find the appearance of semaphores reassuring in a nostalgic
way but also deepy archaic. They really should no longer be there. The
same will become increasingly true of all lineside signals.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

Northern Line goes south
 

toRecliner wrote:
Marland wrote:





With the Underground gradually being reequipped with new signalling systems
and trains with in cab displays
are there going to be signals with LEDs to worry about in a few years.

Haven't those on five lines already gone? And, of course, the DLR never
had them.


Quite possibly, I don’t get to London as much as I used to and to quote
some lines from my album collection

Nothing seems the same.
Still you never see the change
From day to day.
No one notices the customs slip away.

GH

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 00:49, Basil Jet wrote:
On 07/09/2019 23:00, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries
on this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are
the fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.

Right... because peering into the fog hoping to see a light every 100
yards that hasn't been obscured by a branch or stolen by scrotes is so
much better than having a monitor in the cab with the message
"Clear for 6.7km, 50kph TSR in 3.4km" written on it.

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

And stop talking in metric, last time I checked we used MILES in this
country. At least that's what's on the dial of every car speedometer
I've seen lately.


--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

Northern Line goes south
 

On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

On 08/09/2019 00:49, Basil Jet wrote:
On 07/09/2019 23:00, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries
on this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are
the fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.

Right... because peering into the fog hoping to see a light every 100
yards that hasn't been obscured by a branch or stolen by scrotes is so
much better than having a monitor in the cab with the message
"Clear for 6.7km, 50kph TSR in 3.4km" written on it.

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.


And stop talking in metric, last time I checked we used MILES in this
country. At least that's what's on the dial of every car speedometer
I've seen lately.

So when did you last buy fuel in gallons?

Most UK trams and light railways use km. For example, this is a
speedo on a Nottingham NET tram:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/47935957238/in/album-72157708767150101/lightbox/

Engineering went metric many decades ago. Nobody would dream of
engineering a new British car using imperial measurements. In fact, no
engineers still working would have any experience of anything but SI
units.

And why do you think car acceleration timings in the UK are quoted for
the 0-62.5mph range? They gave up on 0-60 long ago.

Northern Line goes south
 

"tim..." wrote:

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

And staffed switch boxes!

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:

And why do you think car acceleration timings in the UK are quoted for
the 0-62.5mph range? They gave up on 0-60 long ago.

What's so special about 28 m/s?

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Bibio - 2016 - A Mineral Love

Northern Line goes south
 

Basil Jet wrote:
On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:

And why do you think car acceleration timings in the UK are quoted for
the 0-62.5mph range? They gave up on 0-60 long ago.

What's so special about 28 m/s?


100 km/h.

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:
On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.

I disagree. How is someone working trackside supposed to know whether a
train is signalled or not..?

And stop talking in metric, last time I checked we used MILES in this
country. At least that's what's on the dial of every car speedometer
I've seen lately.

So when did you last buy fuel in gallons?

Most people, myself included, fill the tank regardless of the actual
quantity. Or I might put 20 quid in if I'm a bit short. But distances
are signposted in miles and fuel economy is still measured in miles per
gallon.

I will resist metrication till my dying day. Which given the state of
the country right now may not be far off.


--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 17:35, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:
On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.

I disagree. How is someone working trackside supposed to know whether a
train is signalled or not..?

An app on their phone or iPad tells them. Various platforms have
signalling diagram monitors which provide this info to platform staff,
and no tungsten filaments were electrocuted in the making of this image.

I will resist metrication till my dying day.

I'm a Ukip member, and I'm laughing at you.

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Bibio - 2016 - A Mineral Love

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 17:55, Basil Jet wrote:

I'm a Ukip member, and I'm laughing at you.

Laugh away, why should that bother me..?


--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

Northern Line goes south
 

Basil Jet wrote:
On 08/09/2019 17:35, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:
On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.

I disagree. How is someone working trackside supposed to know whether a
train is signalled or not..?

An app on their phone or iPad tells them. Various platforms have
signalling diagram monitors which provide this info to platform staff,
and no tungsten filaments were electrocuted in the making of this image.

I will resist metrication till my dying day.

I'm a Ukip member, and I'm laughing at you.


Ah, you're the member?

Northern Line goes south
 

On 7 Sep 2019 23:04:09 GMT
Marland wrote:
MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.



With the Underground gradually being reequipped with new signalling systems
and trains with in cab displays
are there going to be signals with LEDs to worry about in a few years.

And what a success they've been last week. Northern line completely dead on
monday due to total signalling failure and constant delays and cancellations
on the Met while they bed in the new system.

Northern Line goes south
 

On Sat, 7 Sep 2019 23:33:20 -0000 (UTC)
Billy No Mates Always On His Own Billy No Mates Always On His Own.usenet@gmail.
com wrote:
Marland wrote:
MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 07/09/2019 20:51, tim... wrote:


"MissRiaElaine" wrote in message
...
On 07/09/2019 16:19, wrote:

Didnt you know you can't criticise TfL or any of its subsidiaries on
this
group since they're absolutely beyond reproach and any issues are the
fault of
the passenger.

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).

bring back paper timetables

Indeed. And proper signals (semaphore would be nice, but colour light
signals with actual light bulbs would be ok.) LED signals are like LED
street lights, in other words HORRIBLE.



With the Underground gradually being reequipped with new signalling systems
and trains with in cab displays
are there going to be signals with LEDs to worry about in a few years.

Haven't those on five lines already gone? And, of course, the DLR never
had them.

And in typical TfL fashion the systems are all incompatible with each other.
I bet the signalling engineers have been paid overtime trying to get the new
Met system to play nice with the jubilee system. And of course the piccadilly
will be redone in the next decade which no doubt TfL will make sure bears no
resemblence to anything on the district or met just to make the shared track
sections are an unreliable nightmare.

Northern Line goes south
 

On 08/09/2019 20:14, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
On 08/09/2019 17:35, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:
On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.

I disagree. How is someone working trackside supposed to know whether a
train is signalled or not..?

An app on their phone or iPad tells them. Various platforms have
signalling diagram monitors which provide this info to platform staff,
and no tungsten filaments were electrocuted in the making of this image.

I will resist metrication till my dying day.

I'm a Ukip member, and I'm laughing at you.

Ah, you're the member?

People called me that even before I joined.

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
His Clancyness - 2010 - Always Mist Revisited

Northern Line goes south
 

MissRiaElaine wrote:

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).


And stop talking in metric, last time I checked we used MILES in this
country. At least that's what's on the dial of every car speedometer
I've seen lately.

Many vehicles have a dial that shows both or a display that can be
switched.

It was London Transport which recalculated its route measurements to
Kilometres back in 1972 .
Ironically they chose Ongar as the 0 datum which means their measurements
start on a line that was closed
and is now no longer theirs

The old measurements as miles and chains sometimes had oddities due to the
different paths of ownership some sections had passed through over the
years , eg Richmond to site of Studland Road junction were measured from
Waterloo due to the former LSWR then Southern Railway ownership of that
section.

You will be pleased that the Underground still use mph for speed
indications though and even the S stock speed indication is in MPH.
Hopefully they won’t change it or they will be wanting to tow the whole
lot back to Derby again to change it.

GH

Northern Line goes south
 

In message , at 21:58:14 on Sun, 8 Sep
2019, Marland remarked:
MissRiaElaine wrote:

Bring back London Transport (and British Rail for that matter).


And stop talking in metric, last time I checked we used MILES in this
country. At least that's what's on the dial of every car speedometer
I've seen lately.

Many vehicles have a dial that shows both or a display that can be
switched.

It was London Transport which recalculated its route measurements to
Kilometres back in 1972 .
Ironically they chose Ongar as the 0 datum

I think they chose Ongar because it was the furthest east.

which means their measurements start on a line that was closed and is
now no longer theirs

It's not the only disappeared datum. Road miles from London were
measured from the Post Office near St Pauls (the tube station used to be
called "Post Office") because postage was originally calculated by the
mile.

The site is now occupied by a merchant bank, and the A1 no longer goes
to the door, but has only been truncated by a few hundred yards.

The old measurements as miles and chains sometimes had oddities due to the
different paths of ownership some sections had passed through over the
years , eg Richmond to site of Studland Road junction were measured from
Waterloo due to the former LSWR then Southern Railway ownership of that
section.

You will be pleased that the Underground still use mph for speed
indications though and even the S stock speed indication is in MPH.
Hopefully they won’t change it or they will be wanting to tow the whole
lot back to Derby again to change it.

GH

--
Roland Perry

Northern Line goes south
 

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 21:58:14 on Sun, 8 Sep
2019, Marland remarked:


It was London Transport which recalculated its route measurements to
Kilometres back in 1972 .
Ironically they chose Ongar as the 0 datum

I think they chose Ongar because it was the furthest east.

which means their measurements start on a line that was closed and is
now no longer theirs

It's not the only disappeared datum. Road miles from London were
measured from the Post Office near St Pauls (the tube station used to be
called "Post Office") because postage was originally calculated by the
mile.



Hmm, I always thought it was where the original Charing Cross was located.

I could see the Post Office might have used its own datum for postage from
its own main London premises for its own purposes but the Post Office
premises you mention were not constructed until the early 19th Century and
many milestones would have been put in place before that by the Turnpike
Trusts who were required to do so.

Perhaps someone else can adjudicate.


GH

Northern Line goes south
 

On 09/09/2019 09:25, Marland wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 21:58:14 on Sun, 8 Sep
2019, Marland remarked:


It was London Transport which recalculated its route measurements to
Kilometres back in 1972 .
Ironically they chose Ongar as the 0 datum

I think they chose Ongar because it was the furthest east.

which means their measurements start on a line that was closed and is
now no longer theirs

It's not the only disappeared datum. Road miles from London were
measured from the Post Office near St Pauls (the tube station used to be
called "Post Office") because postage was originally calculated by the
mile.



Hmm, I always thought it was where the original Charing Cross was located.

I could see the Post Office might have used its own datum for postage from
its own main London premises for its own purposes but the Post Office
premises you mention were not constructed until the early 19th Century and
many milestones would have been put in place before that by the Turnpike
Trusts who were required to do so.

Perhaps someone else can adjudicate.


The wording on this plaque seems pretty definitive

https://ads9rca.wordpress.com/2016/1...tarting-point/

Maybe distances to "City" are measured to St Paul's Post Office?

--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
Bogshed - Demo's And Rarities 1985-87

Northern Line goes south
 

"Basil Jet" wrote in message
...
On 08/09/2019 20:14, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
On 08/09/2019 17:35, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 08/09/2019 15:38, Recliner wrote:
On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 14:58:02 +0100, MissRiaElaine
wrote:

Always assuming the tech works. A light bulb is about as simple as
you
can get. Imagine if they tried the same on the roads..!

Incandescent light bulbs have a short life and need frequent
replacement. The light is also not consistent, dimming and getting
more yellow over time. LED arrays are far better. But in railway
terms, no lineside signals at all is better still.

I disagree. How is someone working trackside supposed to know whether a
train is signalled or not..?

An app on their phone or iPad tells them. Various platforms have
signalling diagram monitors which provide this info to platform staff,
and no tungsten filaments were electrocuted in the making of this image.

I will resist metrication till my dying day.

I'm a Ukip member, and I'm laughing at you.

Ah, you're the member?

People called me that even before I joined.

around 26,000 apparently

only slightly fewer than those who still tell the pollsters they are going
to vote for them :-)

tim



--
Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to
His Clancyness - 2010 - Always Mist Revisited