(snipped long fares info)
WTF!!!!

Does this mean that the majority of in-boundary National Rail stations
(given the exceptions mentioned) will switch to zonal fares? I get the
impression that will be too easy to understand.

Instead, AIUI, does it just mean that through fares from NR stations in
the same zone (e.g Forest Hill, Wandsworth Common, Kew Bridge) to LU
stations are the same, but the NR price is still additional to the LU
price (e.g. Battersea Park to Baker Street SDS still costs Battersea
Park - Victoria SDS + LU Z1 single, but e.g. South Bermondsey - Moorgate
costs the same total as that).

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 00:03:35 +0000, Dave Arquati wrote:

(snipped long fares info)
WTF!!!!

Does this mean that the majority of in-boundary National Rail stations
(given the exceptions mentioned) will switch to zonal fares? I get the
impression that will be too easy to understand.

Well I read it as a through NR to LU journey that is within the zones
and on an applicable route (!) will be the LU zonal fare for the
appropriate number of zones travelled through. Therefore Battersea Park
to Camden Town will be the U12 fare.

Instead, AIUI, does it just mean that through fares from NR stations in
the same zone (e.g Forest Hill, Wandsworth Common, Kew Bridge) to LU
stations are the same, but the NR price is still additional to the LU
price (e.g. Battersea Park to Baker Street SDS still costs Battersea
Park - Victoria SDS + LU Z1 single, but e.g. South Bermondsey - Moorgate
costs the same total as that).

see above. I believe the arrangement removes fare summation if I've
understood the official text properly.

the question I have is whether the fare from a NR station to another NR
station (on applicable routes) will be the zonal fare or not -
regardless of whether a LU trip is needed or not. I strongly suspect
this will not be the case, which is a huge shame, but perhaps we should
not expect too much too soon. The fare decisions for many people will
become very complex indeed - especially if they start on a non
applicable route. Notice how many of the exclusions relate to National
Express franchises!
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...
(snipped long fares info)
WTF!!!!

Does this mean that the majority of in-boundary National Rail stations
(given the exceptions mentioned) will switch to zonal fares? I get the
impression that will be too easy to understand.

Instead, AIUI, does it just mean that through fares from NR stations in
the same zone (e.g Forest Hill, Wandsworth Common, Kew Bridge) to LU
stations are the same, but the NR price is still additional to the LU
price (e.g. Battersea Park to Baker Street SDS still costs Battersea
Park - Victoria SDS + LU Z1 single, but e.g. South Bermondsey - Moorgate
costs the same total as that).


Nearly, Richmond to U1 via London is currently £5.10, however Richmond to
U1234 via 'Any Permitted' from Jan will be £4.20 and is valid for a single
journey within zone 1234 (subject to a few excpetions) on the tube, train or
DLR

Richmond to U1234 via the tube only is still cheaper at £2.80 (which is a
reduction on the current fare)

Hope that helps anyone further understand


Martin

martin wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...

(snipped long fares info)
WTF!!!!

Does this mean that the majority of in-boundary National Rail stations
(given the exceptions mentioned) will switch to zonal fares? I get the
impression that will be too easy to understand.

Instead, AIUI, does it just mean that through fares from NR stations in
the same zone (e.g Forest Hill, Wandsworth Common, Kew Bridge) to LU
stations are the same, but the NR price is still additional to the LU
price (e.g. Battersea Park to Baker Street SDS still costs Battersea
Park - Victoria SDS + LU Z1 single, but e.g. South Bermondsey - Moorgate
costs the same total as that).



Nearly, Richmond to U1 via London is currently £5.10, however Richmond to
U1234 via 'Any Permitted' from Jan will be £4.20 and is valid for a single
journey within zone 1234 (subject to a few excpetions) on the tube, train or
DLR

Richmond to U1234 via the tube only is still cheaper at £2.80 (which is a
reduction on the current fare)

Hope that helps anyone further understand

Not entirely... does that mean that an entirely new system of train+Tube
zonal fares has been developed for NR services? That example says that
these new fares are neither TfL zonal fares nor a combined NR fare + LU
fare, but a completely new concoction. No wonder the travelling public
get confused.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 00:59:35 +0000, Dave Arquati
wrote:

Not entirely... does that mean that an entirely new system of train+Tube
zonal fares has been developed for NR services? That example says that
these new fares are neither TfL zonal fares nor a combined NR fare + LU
fare, but a completely new concoction. No wonder the travelling public
get confused.

Indeed. Why *do* TfL insist on complicating matters? How many
different fares do they need?

Neil

Neil Williams wrote:
On Thu, 09 Dec 2004 00:59:35 +0000, Dave Arquati
wrote:


Not entirely... does that mean that an entirely new system of train+Tube
zonal fares has been developed for NR services? That example says that
these new fares are neither TfL zonal fares nor a combined NR fare + LU
fare, but a completely new concoction. No wonder the travelling public
get confused.


Indeed. Why *do* TfL insist on complicating matters? How many
different fares do they need?

In this instance, it sounds as though TfL aren't really the ones
complicating matters. It's no secret that TfL want complete control of
the London suburban rail network, using Tube zonal fares.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Dave Arquati wrote:
(snipped long fares info)
WTF!!!!

Does this mean that the majority of in-boundary National Rail
stations (given the exceptions mentioned) will switch to zonal
fares? I get the impression that will be too easy to understand.

For that matter, does this mark the beginning of the widespread
installation of Oyster card readers across most of the inner suburban
NR stations?