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Harbour Line (Valletta,Marsa,Cospicua,Zabbar,Marsascala)
Old Line (Valletta,hamrun,Bkara,Qormi,Attard,Zebbug,Rabat,M dina)
University Line (Msida,University,Hospital, Birkirkara,Mosta )

These would appear to be about 2 Km apart.

Does Mdina even get the traffic? When I was in Malta it
had significantly less buses than other destinations.

Sliema Line (Valletta,Sliema, St Julians)

Is there an overground route for this. It is pretty built up.
OTOH it migh be possible to build as a submersed tunnel
along the coast-line. That could be fun!

i dont know if it would be cost effective to include the far
nothern/southern (20 km away) tips of the island. apart from certain
holidays they are not badly affected by traffic at all.

Do you mean Salina/Bugibba. ISTM that this is an area that
can generate substantial passanger traffic. Even if it isn't so
congested by road traffic it is likely to show a better cost
benefit than a line terminating in Mosta.

are running/maintenance costs mainly linked to distance or number of
stops?

i think connecting gozo would be comparable in complexity to the
channel tunnel.

Agreed. Gozo is out of the question.

So far these are what will be needed so far

trains 4 short trains (3 cars) x 2 for both directions + 4 backup
trains

This is one train every 30-40 minutes?
Looking at the frequency of the buses, this isn't enough.

laying track 100km x both directions

This seems too much:
1) for only 20 stations.
2) Separate lines 2 Km apart is not cost effective.
Build one line which splits if you must serve Mdina.
3) with only one train per direction on each line, why are you
building full length double track?

leveling ground 50km
spanning bridges 2km
tunnels 10km
1 train yard
1 train HQ
20 stations

This is not enough. It is a waste of the rest of the infrastructure
and stations 5 Km apart cannot replace a bus service.

Are you not going to serve the airport?

tim

tim (moved to sweden) wrote:
submersed tunnel
along the coast-line. That could be fun!
what is a coastline submersed tunnel? where are they using this?

Do you mean Salina/Bugibba. ISTM that this is an area that
benefit than a line terminating in Mosta.
yes bugibba should be included with mosta

trains 4 short trains (3 cars) x 2 for both directions + 4 backup
trains

This is one train every 30-40 minutes?
Looking at the frequency of the buses, this isn't enough.
i was thinking more like 1 every 3 minutes, like the Tube. it must be
better than the bus frequency of 15-20min. current bus fare is .50 €

and stations 5 Km apart cannot replace a bus service.
why? the train will just driver faster between the stops.
Are you not going to serve the airport?
there is not much traffic to and from airport.its quite a small
airport.

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tim (moved to sweden) wrote:
submersed tunnel
along the coast-line. That could be fun!
what is a coastline submersed tunnel?

A submersed tunnel is one built at ground level in sections
which are then sunk into the water either directly on the river
bed or in a trench dug into it and connected up to make a
usable tunnel.

It is an easy(ish) way to build an under water tunnel where the
ground is difficult to bore.

where are they using this?

As transverse tunnels, the Oresund link (Copenhagen to Malmo)
used this method of construction. In the UK the Conway by-pass
used one and the planned (probably to be cancelled) Portsmouth
tram uses one under the harbour.

I am not aware of submersed tunnels being used longitudinally
along a coatsline as I suggested.

Do you mean Salina/Bugibba. ISTM that this is an area that
benefit than a line terminating in Mosta.
yes bugibba should be included with mosta

trains 4 short trains (3 cars) x 2 for both directions + 4 backup
trains

This is one train every 30-40 minutes?
Looking at the frequency of the buses, this isn't enough.
i was thinking more like 1 every 3 minutes,

Then you don't have enough trains in your list.

like the Tube. it must be better than the bus frequency
of 15-20min.

I don't see that it needs to be better. As it will be
more reliable the samne frequency will suffice.

current bus fare is .50 ?

This is too cheap so you can increase it for the better
'comfort' (and I do know that a Maltese pound is more
than a GB one)


and stations 5 Km apart cannot replace a bus service.
why? the train will just driver faster between the stops.

People who live between the stops won't walk that
far. You will leave them with no service. You will either
have to continue running the buses or they will go by car.


Are you not going to serve the airport?
there is not much traffic to and from airport.its quite a small
airport.

Everyone who visits the island goes there. If these people
are going to be the main-stay of your other services then a
link to the airport ought to be viable. Admittedly, most of
them just get herded of to a hotel in a coach but it might
be possible to change this system.

tim

On Sat, 8 Oct 2005 20:28:20 +0200, "tim \(moved to sweden\)"
wrote:

A submersed tunnel is one built at ground level in sections
which are then sunk into the water either directly on the river
bed or in a trench dug into it and connected up to make a
usable tunnel.

It is an easy(ish) way to build an under water tunnel where the
ground is difficult to bore.

The Conwy road tunnel was built in that way.

Neil

--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
When replying please use neil at the above domain
'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read.

On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 18:34:42 GMT, (Neil
Williams) wrote:

The Conwy road tunnel was built in that way.

....which you already posted. Sorry.

Neil

--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
When replying please use neil at the above domain
'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read.

tim (moved to sweden) wrote:

current bus fare is .50 ?

This is too cheap so you can increase it for the better
'comfort' (and I do know that a Maltese pound is more
than a GB one)

thats .50 euro cents, the euro symbol came out as a ?

tim (moved to sweden) wrote:


and stations 5 Km apart cannot replace a bus service.
why? the train will just driver faster between the stops.

People who live between the stops won't walk that
far. You will leave them with no service. You will either
have to continue running the buses or they will go by car.

this is true.i guess i based my station distances on those of the 1890s
old malta railway. People certainly wont walk more than 1000m to go by
Tube if they can use the bus, especially if it is swelterng hot or
rainy.

I will have to multiply the station count by 3 =60 stations.

Would it be best to have all the lines not cross and terminate at
valletta, or dig deep and have them intersect, like

Harbour Line:StJulians,Sliema,Msida,Marsa,Cospicua,Zabbar, Marsascala)
Old Line(Valletta,Msida,hamrun,Bkara,Qormi,Attard, Zebbug,Rabat,Mosta)
University Line (Msida,University,Hospital, Birkirkara,Mosta,Bugibba)

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tim (moved to sweden) wrote:

current bus fare is .50 ?

This is too cheap so you can increase it for the better
'comfort' (and I do know that a Maltese pound is more
than a GB one)

thats .50 euro cents, the euro symbol came out as a ?

Then it's definately too cheap.

IIRC it costs more than that in Poland where the minimun
wage is about 1 Euro/h

tim