Mizter T wrote:
Martin Underwood wrote:

Martin Underwood wrote in message
:

Every Strangers Eyes wrote in message
:

I got off the bus feeling very self rightous but what are peoples
thoughts on this?
Tell the driver you're going to throw up. They soon let you off.
It's worth a try, especially if you go up to his cab and lean in
towards him as you say it!!!

When buses are on a planned diversion, so the drivers make any effort
to warn the passengers beforehand, so as to say "this is the last
stop [before the diversion] where you can get off for the next n
miles"? Silly question - I'm sure they don't - that would involve
thinking of their passengers' needs before the needs of Health and
Safety.
Sorry, that should read "When buses are on a planned diversion, DO the
drivers make any effort..."

Occasionally they do, more often than not they don't. Would be great if
it became standard practice.

Nobody, apart from you, has made any connection to health and safety
rules precluding drivers making announcements. Basic common sense would
suggest that as buses are now often fitted with PA systems there is no
such exclusion. Basic common sense would also suggest that
announcements are not best made when a driver is negotiating a
difficult section of road.

The lack of announcements woud appear to be a case of poor practice,
perhaps in part because the lack of PA systems until recently means
there hasn't been time for such a good practice to emerge, rather a
result of the ever present H&S gremlin that many appear to believe is
perpetually lurking in the shadows pulling the strings on order to
frustrate them.

I think announcements when driving conditions permit would be a big
bonus. I've noticed some bendy bus drivers making them. I'd really
appreciate announcements that a bus is going to terminate short -
sometimes they change destination mid-route without telling anyone,
which is extremely frustrating.

The new iBus system should take care of routine announcements for
upcoming stops.


--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Dave Arquati wrote:

(snip)

I think announcements when driving conditions permit would be a big
bonus. I've noticed some bendy bus drivers making them. I'd really
appreciate announcements that a bus is going to terminate short -
sometimes they change destination mid-route without telling anyone,
which is extremely frustrating.

The new iBus system should take care of routine announcements for
upcoming stops.


That said sometimes the announcements can be confusing in themselves. I
was on a number 12 going north when the driver received instructions to
stop short of his destination - his announcement was along the lines of
"this bus will no longer be going to Oxford, it will now be terminating
at Trafalgar, to go to Oxford please get on the bus behind me".

I was left wondering whether if I got on the next I really could get to
Oxford for 80p, albeit taking ages and stopping every quarter of a
mile. Meanwhile I wondered what would happen if I stayed put - would I
be transported to south west Spain, even back to 1805! To be fair
everyone seemed to understand his announcement and dissapointingly
no-one else seemed to be even remotely amused.

Another thing I think is a good practice that's only adopted on some
routes is having a black-on-yellow strip on the destination blind
reading "parrtial route" or something similar. This clearly provides a
visual aid to passengers that the bus isn't going all the way
(IYSWIM!).

I'm not sure about the new iBus system - specifically, about the
automatic announcements that'll be part of the system. It could be
really annoying! Perhaps only key stops could have announcements, such
as full (i.e. non-request) bus stops.

In message . com,
Mizter T writes
Another thing I think is a good practice that's only adopted on some
routes is having a black-on-yellow strip on the destination blind
reading "parrtial route" or something similar. This clearly provides a
visual aid to passengers that the bus isn't going all the way (IYSWIM!).

*Does* this system exist "on some routes" in London?! I've seen it
done in Paris but never in London!

(Actually, some form of "flag" to suggest a short working, such as
Travel West midlands' "E" suffix, is I reckon a good, simple idea.)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Ian Jelf wrote:
In message . com,
Mizter T writes
Another thing I think is a good practice that's only adopted on some
routes is having a black-on-yellow strip on the destination blind
reading "parrtial route" or something similar. This clearly provides a
visual aid to passengers that the bus isn't going all the way (IYSWIM!).

*Does* this system exist "on some routes" in London?! I've seen it
done in Paris but never in London!

I've seen it done on the 207, when there's a short working from
Shepherd's Bush to Ealing Hospital or Acton Tram Depot; the blind says
the destination with "Part route only" below it in smaller type, all
black-on-yellow.

I think it's very useful, and should be extended to other routes if
possible.

(Actually, some form of "flag" to suggest a short working, such as
Travel West midlands' "E" suffix, is I reckon a good, simple idea.)


--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Sun, 20 Aug 2006 20:04:18 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

In message . com,
Mizter T writes
Another thing I think is a good practice that's only adopted on some
routes is having a black-on-yellow strip on the destination blind
reading "parrtial route" or something similar. This clearly provides a
visual aid to passengers that the bus isn't going all the way (IYSWIM!).

*Does* this system exist "on some routes" in London?! I've seen it
done in Paris but never in London!

A quirk of blinds on buses operated by First. There are a number of
special features on them and many of them work rather well. Needless to
say the BBC (Bus Blinds Committee of TfL - I kid you not) is now
stamping on all of this individuality so we can be reduced to the
hopeless dull, uninformative crap that is being seen on new buses on
recently retendered routes. In other words single line destination
displays with no via points and utterly meaningless names for certain
locations - Clapham Park for Streatham Hill, Atkins Rd on the 45s and
the now classic Manor Circus which is really Richmond on the route 493.
This latter one has now been "repealed" by the BBC and Richmond can be
used on route 493 blinds!

(Actually, some form of "flag" to suggest a short working, such as
Travel West midlands' "E" suffix, is I reckon a good, simple idea.)

Yes - it is an elegant solution if you have electronic displays or four
track number blinds. I suspect it would not work on conventional blinds
in London as you'd probably need an E variant for every number which for
some garages would result in blinds that were too big for the blind
boxes.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
A quirk of blinds on buses operated by First. There are a number of
special features on them and many of them work rather well. Needless
to say the BBC (Bus Blinds Committee of TfL - I kid you not)
Boggle

is now stamping on all of this individuality so we can be reduced to
the hopeless dull, uninformative crap that is being seen on new buses
on recently retendered routes. In other words single line destination
displays with no via points and utterly meaningless names for certain
locations - Clapham Park for Streatham Hill, Atkins Rd on the 45s
This single line display with no "via" points is truly *ludicrous*. I
hope it's a fad.

and the now classic Manor Circus which is really Richmond on the route
493. This latter one has now been "repealed" by the BBC and Richmond
can be used on route 493 blinds!
Sanity prevails! Now to work on those "via" points.......

--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Ian Jelf wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield
writes
A quirk of blinds on buses operated by First. There are a number of
special features on them and many of them work rather well. Needless
to say the BBC (Bus Blinds Committee of TfL - I kid you not)
Boggle

is now stamping on all of this individuality so we can be reduced to
the hopeless dull, uninformative crap that is being seen on new buses
on recently retendered routes. In other words single line destination
displays with no via points and utterly meaningless names for certain
locations - Clapham Park for Streatham Hill, Atkins Rd on the 45s
This single line display with no "via" points is truly *ludicrous*. I
hope it's a fad.

Indeed - I've noticed this on both the 13 and the 9 for certain vehicles
- simply stating "Aldwych" is very pointless by itself, and is extremely
unhelpful to visitors when trying to work out which of dozens of buses
to catch from Oxford Street, for example.

The slap in the face is that the text isn't even much bigger than on the
types of blind it replaced!

I hope this is a swing too far in one direction - the other end of the
scale being the tall, narrow text used on some older vehicles that
operate sometimes on the 49, 148, 52 and N9 amongst others. There's a
happy medium in existence, let's hope it gets back there!

and the now classic Manor Circus which is really Richmond on the route
493. This latter one has now been "repealed" by the BBC and Richmond
can be used on route 493 blinds!
Sanity prevails! Now to work on those "via" points.......



--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Sun, 20 Aug 2006 22:18:49 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
A quirk of blinds on buses operated by First. There are a number of
special features on them and many of them work rather well. Needless
to say the BBC (Bus Blinds Committee of TfL - I kid you not)
Boggle

It would be nice if they actually rode on some bus routes to see where
people live and what they expect to see on the front of a bus.

is now stamping on all of this individuality so we can be reduced to
the hopeless dull, uninformative crap that is being seen on new buses
on recently retendered routes. In other words single line destination
displays with no via points and utterly meaningless names for certain
locations - Clapham Park for Streatham Hill, Atkins Rd on the 45s
This single line display with no "via" points is truly *ludicrous*. I
hope it's a fad.

Nope - it's called DDA compliance and thus will be implemented
everywhere. Quite why Lothian Buses are compliant with their via points
and TfL must be different no one has properly explained.

and the now classic Manor Circus which is really Richmond on the route
493. This latter one has now been "repealed" by the BBC and Richmond
can be used on route 493 blinds!
Sanity prevails! Now to work on those "via" points.......

This has been argued endlessly on various yahoo type groups including
input from people very senior and very close to the debate. I fear
there is no possible reprieve for via points on front blinds in the same
way as there is no likely reprieve for proper timetables, timetable
booklets and possibly the quadrant bus maps - it is rumoured only one or
maybe two more editions will be published before they die at the hands
of "simple" information.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
Nope - it's called DDA compliance and thus will be implemented
everywhere. Quite why Lothian Buses are compliant with their via points
and TfL must be different no one has properly explained.
And that is one ray of hope I retain for future provision of "via"
points, old optimist that I am.

Reducing the amount of information so the limited amount left is legible
is wooly thinking at best.

and the now classic Manor Circus which is really Richmond on the route
493. This latter one has now been "repealed" by the BBC and Richmond
can be used on route 493 blinds!
Sanity prevails! Now to work on those "via" points.......

This has been argued endlessly on various yahoo type groups including
input from people very senior and very close to the debate. I fear
there is no possible reprieve for via points on front blinds in the same
way as there is no likely reprieve for proper timetables, timetable
booklets and possibly the quadrant bus maps -
Is any/all of that because of DDA-related issues?

it is rumoured only one or
maybe two more editions will be published before they die at the hands
of "simple" information.
I want to move to Switzerland.......

:-))
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk