wrote:

Thanks - it certainly is. Interesting to see the old subway will be
brought back into use and extended. I wonder if this will include
re-opening the original ticket hall - at least as an exit.

They're re-opening the old subway which used to be the only access to
platforms 9-13 as they used to be, but not the long subway under
platform 3/5, which used to be the access to all of the other
platforms. People who complain about the long walk between 5 and 10
must have either never used the station in those days, or forgotten
about it.

Stratford station was a real dump in the '70s and '80s, but it used to
absolutely fascinate me. I remember when I first went through the
place, being puzzled by what seemed to be a four-platform station, with
the platforms numbered 3,5,6 and 8. then one day I got out, and
discovered the low-level 1 and 2, 2 reached directly from the old
subway, and 1 over the old concrete footbridge, still there I think,
alongside the new one. Later I found 9, 10 (now 10a) and 11. There
was no way of getting to 12 and 13, it was an island then, as the
subway had been long bricked up beyond the stairs to 11.

The entrance was just behind where the tank loco is now displayed, and
there was a subway under Great Eastern Road, which came up inside the
shopping centre. This was the only normal entrance to the shopping
centre at this end, there was a door, roughly where the present ones
are, but that was just a fire exit. When you walked out of the old
booking hall, and up the stairs there were the remains of two old
posters high up about Easter train services. The exit must have been
at street level before the exit subway was built.

Platforms 1 and 2 were served by North Woolwich - Tottenham Hale DMUs,
previously the service had run to Palace Gates until about 1964, but I
did'nt know the station then. In the '80s the line between Dalston and
Stratford was re-opened to passengers, and a Camden Road - North
Woolwich service provided. How things have changed on the North
Woolwich line since then! The line between Stratford and Tottenham
Hale was then served only by a rush-hour shuttle service until this was
withdrawn, and Lea Bridge station closed, in 1985. One of the
destinations shown on the dark blue and white sign by the entrance to
the low-level platforms was 'THE DOCKS'

After you passed through the ticket barrier you tured sharp left into
the long subway under 3/5. Straight ahead was the subway now proposed
to be re-opened, leading to the higher numbered platforms. No trains
normally served these platforms, except or one or two of the Tottenham
Hale shuttles, which used 11, the others ran into the low-level, via
High Meads. What is now 9 was not a platform face, there railings
aling the edge of it, and some old GER buildings. What is now 10 was
9, what is now 10a was 10, 11 was as it is now and 12/13 were a long
disused island, with, as I said previously, no access. I really wanted
to get down this subway and onto 9-11, but the staff on the barrier
would never allow me down there; I didn't know anout the odd one or two
trains still serving 11.

One day the tracks through 6 an 8 were closed, and the trains were
serving 9 and 10, as they then were. This was my chance. This subway
was filthy, and looked like it had been disuded for decades. There was
lots of 'stuff' dumped there, including more blue and white signs.
There was also one on the wall pointing to platforms 10-13, with '13'
painted over to read '11' There were various doors leading off this
subway, I'm still not sure where they went, there were two ancient
goods lifts on the platforms above, which I couldn't find the bottom
end of; maye they came out behind these doors; parcels office maybe?
There was another door, leading into a room full of electronic
equipment; relay room and telephone exchange under the signalbox?
There was also another passage leaing off to the East, still in use by
staff, I think this may have led to the depot.

The building between platforms 10 (now 10a) and 11 was in use by staff
at each end, but the centre section was roofless; had it been the
victim of a fire at sometime, or wartime bombing? What was it
originally?

Before the stairs up to platform 11 there were two disused staircases
which had been capped with concrete at platform level, near the
roofless building; these stairways were also full of rubbish.

Later, it was decided to re-open platforn 12, and to run services on
the Cambridge line. The platform was re-built, and the wall in the
subway demolished, and the staircase up to the platform re-built. The
capped-off stairways were boarded over at subway level, and the subway
cleaned up somewhat. From the time of this work it was possible for
me to walk along the subway any time I wanted to. one day there was a
pile of rubbish which had been cleared out of one of the side rooms.
There was an old wooden board with the remains of a timetable showing
services to Hertford East from the long disused platform 12. The
reburbishment of the Cambridge line platforms took ages, and must hve
cost a fortune, but the services didn't last long; I'm not surprised,
BR didn't seem to want anybody to know about these services, there
didn't seem to be any timetables posted anywhere, and the subway still
looked distinctly disused.

The high-level platforms which were still in use had blue and white
glass name signs, which had originally been fluorescent lit, but the
lighting had nong ceased to function, and some of the signs had been
broken, and replaced by ones made of plywood, hadboard or some similar
material. There had previously been illuminated cubes with blue and
white glass platform numbers; I remember seeing these in use, but they
too were later dumped in the dis-used subway.

About twenty years ago the never used bay platform 4 was brought into
use for the DLR; it has been shortened somewhat from its original
length. The other bay, platform 7, remains unused to this day, the
Fenchurch Street electtric shuttle servce for which they were intended
never having been introduced, and Bow Road station closed in 1949.

I'm glad to see that the Cambridge line platforms still have a place in
the proposed upgrade; I hope we they will see a proper service again,
and the re-opening of Lea Bridge station.

Are the large areas at each end of the mezzanine level, beyond the
stairs, to serve some useful purpose at last? They're totally wasted
space at the moment.

For such an important station it's amasing how dilapidated parts of
Stratford became. The nice new station of 1949 was looking distinctly
past its best by the early '70s. Does anybody have any pictures of the
station prior to the rebuilding for the Central Line extension, and the
Shenfield electrification?

wrote:
Paul Scott wrote:

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/initiative...ord/scheme.asp

Thanks - it certainly is. Interesting to see the old subway will be
brought back into use and extended.

Is that the beautiful but sad staircase in a cage?

John Rowland wrote:

Is that the beautiful but sad staircase in a cage?

Yes, that's it. This subway served platforms from 9 to 12/13. From
what I can make out from old drawings, 3/4/5 did not exist before the
rebuilding for the Central Line, so the long subway under 3/5 was
probably built at this time. This subway led to the stairs up to the
platform, just above the words 'New Westbound' on the new platform
level drawing. There was a doorway to the left which led onto the
low-level, and a short subway to the right serving platforms 6, 7
(never used) and 8. During the last rebuilding this subway was
extended as ffar as platform 12, and the old subway closed. For a while
both were open, and you could make a circular walk. Finally, the new
subway to the West of the low-level lines, serving 3-10 was opened.
What is now 9/10 was extended a considerable distance, it used to end
not far from where 10a does now. I am not clear how what is now 6/8
was reached prior to 1949, mayde there was a stairway from the old
subway behind one of the closed doors. This platform was also much
shorter until the time of the electrification and Central Line
extension.

"Stephen Furley" wrote in message
ups.com...

John Rowland wrote:

Is that the beautiful but sad staircase in a cage?

Yes, that's it. This subway served platforms from 9 to 12/13. From
what I can make out from old drawings, 3/4/5 did not exist before the
rebuilding for the Central Line, so the long subway under 3/5 was
probably built at this time. This subway led to the stairs up to the
platform, just above the words 'New Westbound' on the new platform
level drawing. There was a doorway to the left which led onto the
low-level, and a short subway to the right serving platforms 6, 7
(never used) and 8. During the last rebuilding this subway was
extended as ffar as platform 12, and the old subway closed. For a while
both were open, and you could make a circular walk. Finally, the new
subway to the West of the low-level lines, serving 3-10 was opened.
What is now 9/10 was extended a considerable distance, it used to end
not far from where 10a does now. I am not clear how what is now 6/8
was reached prior to 1949, mayde there was a stairway from the old
subway behind one of the closed doors. This platform was also much
shorter until the time of the electrification and Central Line
extension.

From what I can make out of an old (1915) drawing, what are now platforms 10
and 10a served the old slow lines, and what is now 9 served the down fast.
The up fast was a through line with no platform, but there was an up
passenger loop served by a platform more or less on the site of present 6/8.
This was further east than the other platforms, which were of course in the
fork between the Colchester and Cambridge lines, as west of this platform
there were connections to the goods depot and a double- (or even
triple-)track spur from the Ilford to the North Woolwich direction. This
platform presumably linked with the low level platforms. There was also a
double-track spur east of the station from the Liverpool Street to the North
Woolwich direction; this was used by through passenger trains which could
not therefore call at Stratford but instead served Stratford Market station.
Two short bay platforms are apparent, a down bay as the opposite face of the
up passsenger loop platform, and a bay, more of a dock really, in the fork
between platforms 10a and 11. It's not at all clear where the main entrance
and ticket office were - the station was served by Station Road, leading
from Angel Lane into the fork between the Colchester and Cambridge lines,
and by Station Street, leading from the High Street to the south side of the
station.

In understanding this, it needs to be remembered that in 1949 Ilford flyover
was built, and west of there what had been the slow lines became the Main
Lines, and what had been the Fast Lines became the Electric (or Slow) Lines,
which served the new platforms at Stratford. It's also worth remembering
that, until LT took over the Loughton lines, platforms 11-13 were served by
an intensive steam suburban service from Liverpool Street and Fenchurch
Street to Loughton, Epping and Ongar (well, never that intensive out to
Ongar), while trains to Newbury Park and Chigwell diverged between Ilford
and Seven Kings.

Peter

Peter Masson wrote:

From what I can make out of an old (1915) drawing, what are now platforms 10
and 10a served the old slow lines, and what is now 9 served the down fast.
The up fast was a through line with no platform, but there was an up
passenger loop served by a platform more or less on the site of present 6/8.
This was further east than the other platforms, which were of course in the
fork between the Colchester and Cambridge lines, as west of this platform
there were connections to the goods depot and a double- (or even
triple-)track spur from the Ilford to the North Woolwich direction.

That sounds like the map/drawing that I've seen; it used to be on sale
at the North Woolwich Old Station Museum. They also sold a small
booklet in which there was a photoraph of a Diesel locomotive coming
off the Eastern spur at low-level. the track was behind the buildings
on platform 2, and the trackbed was still visible until fairly recent
times. I don't think there were ever platforms on these lines.

Don't forget the fourth route from the North Woolwich/Beckton/Gallions
direction, the one which diverged from the present one at Fork
Junction, just North of where the line passes under the high level, and
ran through the centre of Stratford Works.

Two short bay platforms are apparent, a down bay as the opposite face of the
up passsenger loop platform, and a bay, more of a dock really, in the fork
between platforms 10a and 11. It's not at all clear where the main entrance
and ticket office were - the station was served by Station Road, leading
from Angel Lane into the fork between the Colchester and Cambridge lines,
and by Station Street, leading from the High Street to the south side of the
station.

In understanding this, it needs to be remembered that in 1949 Ilford flyover
was built, and west of there what had been the slow lines became the Main
Lines, and what had been the Fast Lines became the Electric (or Slow) Lines,
which served the new platforms at Stratford. It's also worth remembering
that, until LT took over the Loughton lines, platforms 11-13 were served by
an intensive steam suburban service from Liverpool Street and Fenchurch
Street to Loughton, Epping and Ongar (well, never that intensive out to
Ongar), while trains to Newbury Park and Chigwell diverged between Ilford
and Seven Kings.

So much has changed since the War in this area; the takeover of the
Loughton line by the Central, and the extension of that like from
Liverpool street, the closure of the Beckton and Gallions branches,
also the Silvertown tramway, and the old route over the swing bridge.
The removal otf the old connection to Ilord, The withdrawal of the
Broad Street to Poplar service, the closure of the Palace Gates branch,
the re-opening of the line through Hackney to passengers, the joining
of what had been parts of the Broad Street - Poplar and Palace Gates -
North Woolwich services to the Richmond service west of Dalston when
Broad Street closed. The closure of the docks lines, the closure, and
partial re-instatement, of one pair of tracks between Camden and
Dalston, The coming of the DLR and the JLE. I first went to North
Woolwich just after the Camden Road service was introduced; you can't
recognise the area today.

Stephen Furley wrote:
wrote:

Thanks - it certainly is. Interesting to see the old subway will be
brought back into use and extended. I wonder if this will include
re-opening the original ticket hall - at least as an exit.

They're re-opening the old subway which used to be the only access to
platforms 9-13 as they used to be, but not the long subway under
platform 3/5, which used to be the access to all of the other
platforms. People who complain about the long walk between 5 and 10
must have either never used the station in those days, or forgotten
about it.

I remember it well.

Stratford station was a real dump in the '70s and '80s, but it used to
absolutely fascinate me. I remember when I first went through the
place, being puzzled by what seemed to be a four-platform station, with
the platforms numbered 3,5,6 and 8. then one day I got out, and
discovered the low-level 1 and 2, 2 reached directly from the old
subway, and 1 over the old concrete footbridge, still there I think,
alongside the new one. Later I found 9, 10 (now 10a) and 11. There
was no way of getting to 12 and 13, it was an island then, as the
subway had been long bricked up beyond the stairs to 11.

The entrance was just behind where the tank loco is now displayed, and
there was a subway under Great Eastern Road, which came up inside the
shopping centre. This was the only normal entrance to the shopping
centre at this end, there was a door, roughly where the present ones
are, but that was just a fire exit. When you walked out of the old
booking hall, and up the stairs there were the remains of two old
posters high up about Easter train services. The exit must have been
at street level before the exit subway was built.

There was also a ramp up to street level here as well as the subway
leading to the shopping centre - in fact it is still there albeit
disused. There was also another subway entrance leading to the loco
depot but I think this is now blocked.

Looking at this plan now it amazes me how tiny the original ticket hall
was compared to the current and proposed facilities! Thanks too for
jogging my memory about all the other passageways and stairs through
this amazing place.


Are the large areas at each end of the mezzanine level, beyond the
stairs, to serve some useful purpose at last? They're totally wasted
space at the moment.


It has always seemed to me that these must have been provided in
anticipation of future extensions or alterations. From the plans it
appears the western end of the mezzanine will connect to the new DLR
platforms and the eastern end to a new entrance on the proposed
pedestrian link bridge.

wrote:

There was also a ramp up to street level here as well as the subway
leading to the shopping centre - in fact it is still there albeit
disused. There was also another subway entrance leading to the loco
depot but I think this is now blocked.

That's right; the ramp had a curved roof, made of glass blocks I think;
skateboarders used to make use of it. I think there must originally
have been steps to street level within the building,; this would
explain the posters high up at the entrance. If you looked down at the
trackbed between 10 (now 10a) and 11 you could see where two subways
passed underneath; the 'old' one as I call it, and the depot one. I
think the passageway leading off to the East from the old subway must
have led into the depot subway, but I'm not sure. It was certainly in
use by staff when the old subway was open to the public.

There were various mystery doors leading off the old ticket hall as
well. One of them which was on your right as you left the station I do
know the function of; it led to a sump. I know this because many years
ago the pumps failed at a time when there had been very heavy rainfall,
and temporary portable pumps had to be brought in, with the hoses taken
in through this door.

Looking at this plan now it amazes me how tiny the original ticket hall
was compared to the current and proposed facilities! Thanks too for
jogging my memory about all the other passageways and stairs through
this amazing place.

Asmzing it certainly was, and is. It's a pity that the old part of the
station was allowed to decay so badly after it largely went out of use.
It's not only the station that's amazing; the whole area is. It has a
very important place in the industrial history of Britain, some fine
architecture, and the Bow Back Rivers are well worth exploring. I
first did so nearly thirty years ago, when they were so overgrown that
it was only just about possible to fight you way through the overgrowth
on the towpaths in the depths of Winter. There were major changes made
to the rivers under the River Lee (Flood Relief &c.) Act, (1930),
partly for flood relief, and partly to improve navigation; just about
in time to see the end of commercial navigation on most a the back
rivers! Quite similar in some ways to much of the modernisation of the
railways.

It's very difficult to get into, but the old Abbey Mills Pumping
Station is well worth a visit. The main 'A' station still contains the
8 electric pumps installed in the early '30s when the steam plant was
removed. At least I think they're still there on standby, they were a
couple of years ago. The Diesels in a couple of the other buildings
were removed at about the time that the new station opened. The old
station has some very fine cast iron work. The new station is quite an
interesting building from the outside, but there's nothing inside woth
seeing, everything except some large pipes is underground.

It has always seemed to me that these must have been provided in
anticipation of future extensions or alterations. From the plans it
appears the western end of the mezzanine will connect to the new DLR
platforms and the eastern end to a new entrance on the proposed
pedestrian link bridge.

I think they could have been used for small shops or stalls, exhibition
space, or maybe even a space for live musicians to perform; The area
has had a long history of involvment with the arts.

In article .com,
Stephen Furley writes
There was also another passage leaing off to the East, still in use by
staff, I think this may have led to the depot.

I think it did.

In the 1970s I went on a school trip that included Stratford Depot. My
memory is that we followed a subway from the main station.

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Clive D. W. Feather wrote:
In article .com,
Stephen Furley writes
There was also another passage leaing off to the East, still in use by
staff, I think this may have led to the depot.

I think it did.

In the 1970s I went on a school trip that included Stratford Depot. My
memory is that we followed a subway from the main station.

The main entrance to the depot subway was on the front of the building,
to the right of the passenger entrance. Between the two was the BTP
office (though it didn't seem to deter many trainspotters from making
their way down the tunnel).