"chunky munky" wrote in message
ups.com...

Don't forget that the entire Sub-Surface Railway will be very very
different in 10-15 years tim to what it currently is, including the
District running to Uxbridge instead of the Piccadilly


Presumably this will allow the future signalling upgrade on the Piccadilly
to increase train frequency without buying more tube stock - do the SSL
stock replacement contract numbers allow for District services returning to
Uxbridge?

Paul S

On Wed, 3 Jan 2007, asdf wrote:

On Tue, 2 Jan 2007 22:44:12 +0000, Tom Anderson wrote:

Note that because of the new shape of the H&C (which, AIUI, entirely
replaces the current Circle service), at Paddington, no trains on the
Circle/District platform will go beyond Edgware Road, so should that
way lie your destination, your only option is to go to the H&C
platform, which is easier than the choice you face at present.

Also, the frequency of trains from the H&C platforms to Liverpool Street
will be increased (doubled?). If that didn't happen (i.e. the only
change was that trains from the Circle platforms terminated at Edgware
Road) then it wouldn't be much of an improvement

Well, quite!

- although, as you say, the choice would be easier. ;-)

Yes - take the flipping Bakerloo.

Random PS - why didn't the Bakerloo get called the Regent Line, since it
runs via Regent's Park and Regent Street? That would be a much better
name. 'Bakerloo' makes me cringe every time i hear it.

Having said that, I'd hazard a guess that the Hammersmith-Aldgate
service won't run off-peak (otherwise why send the Met to Barking?),

Hang on, what? What do you mean by the 'Hammersmith-Aldgate service'? Why
won't it run off-peak? How is this related to the Met?

tom

--
If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed.

On Wed, 3 Jan 2007, chunky munky wrote:

Don't forget that the entire Sub-Surface Railway will be very very
different in 10-15 years tim to what it currently is, including the
District running to Uxbridge instead of the Piccadilly

First i've heard of it, other than as fanfic here. What makes you think
this is going to happen?

tom

--
If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed.

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
.li...
On Wed, 3 Jan 2007, chunky munky wrote:

Don't forget that the entire Sub-Surface Railway will be very very
different in 10-15 years tim to what it currently is, including the
District running to Uxbridge instead of the Piccadilly

First i've heard of it, other than as fanfic here. What makes you think
this is going to happen?

tom

--
If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed.

Whats to be gained from having District line trains as opposed to Picadilly
line trains running to Uxbridge?

This should throw up some interesting things

- on the linear map of the Hammersmith and City line
Paddington and Edgware Road appear twice

- Two different ways to go from Paddington to Edgware Road via
Hammersmith and City - from totally seperate platforms

- Idea of going from Embankment to Monument via Westbound Hammersmith &
City - just weird

- You could walk between Royal Oak and Bayswater in ten minutes, or
take tube - over an hour Id guess

- Three lines to choose from between Gloucester Road and Hammersmith,
two stops on Piccadilly, three on the district, or 31 on the
Hammersmith and City

- If they build the tunnel connecting Euston Sq and Euston three ways
to get from Euston to Kings Cross - Eastbound H&C Northbound Victoria
or Southbound Northern

Rob



"Metropolitan trains would run through from Liverpool Street to Barking,
and the Hammersmith & City service would run partially to Aldgate, and
partially all the way around the Circle terminating at Edgware Road - i.e.
Hammersmith - Edgware Road - Aldgate - Victoria - Edgware Road and
reverse.

C wrote:

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
.li...
On Wed, 3 Jan 2007, chunky munky wrote:

Don't forget that the entire Sub-Surface Railway will be very very
different in 10-15 years tim to what it currently is, including the
District running to Uxbridge instead of the Piccadilly

First i've heard of it, other than as fanfic here. What makes you think
this is going to happen?

tom

--
If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed.

Whats to be gained from having District line trains as opposed to Picadilly
line trains running to Uxbridge?

A higher frequency on the rest of the Piccadilly I guess, because the
line will be shorter in the end, while there would be enough
sub-surface stock to extend the District back to Uxbridge.
This would be a very unattractive service for everyone from North
Ealing to Uxbridge though, since virtually all of those people will
want to get on the express. It doesn't make much sense to make the
longer line the slowest one here, and the shorter (Ealing Broadway)
line the express.

sweek wrote:

It doesn't make much sense to make the
longer line the slowest one here, and the shorter (Ealing Broadway)
line the express.

Surely Ealing Broadway would remain District too... the point of the plan is
to increase Picc frequency to Heathrow, and sending Picc trains to Ealing
Broadway would defeat the point of ceasing to serve Uxbridge.

Anyway, didn't they rebuild a Sudbury station or two to have platforms level
with the tube stock a few years ago?

John Rowland wrote:

sweek wrote:

It doesn't make much sense to make the
longer line the slowest one here, and the shorter (Ealing Broadway)
line the express.

Surely Ealing Broadway would remain District too... the point of the plan is
to increase Picc frequency to Heathrow, and sending Picc trains to Ealing
Broadway would defeat the point of ceasing to serve Uxbridge.

Anyway, didn't they rebuild a Sudbury station or two to have platforms level
with the tube stock a few years ago?

You need less trains for an Ealing Broadway picc. branch than an
Uxbridge picc. branch. Those extra trains could go towards the
increased Heathrow frequency.
I don't think complicating the District line even more is ever a good
idea.

sweek wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
sweek wrote:
It doesn't make much sense to make the longer line the slowest one here,
and the shorter (Ealing Broadway) line the express.

Surely Ealing Broadway would remain District too... the point of the plan is
to increase Picc frequency to Heathrow, and sending Picc trains to Ealing
Broadway would defeat the point of ceasing to serve Uxbridge.

Anyway, didn't they rebuild a Sudbury station or two to have platforms level
with the tube stock a few years ago?

Maybe, but District to Ealing Broadway AND Uxbridge is the only
solution that could eliminate all platforms served by trains of both
sizes. Without this change, level wheelchair access cannot be achieved
at Ealing Common or between Rayners Lane and Uxbridge.

You need less trains for an Ealing Broadway picc. branch than an
Uxbridge picc. branch. Those extra trains could go towards the
increased Heathrow frequency.
I don't think complicating the District line even more is ever a good
idea.

Arguably, when Crossrail is built, Ealing Broadway won't need both
District and Central trains to central London. The capacity might be
better used to create north-south links to Richmond and Uxbridge,
Harrow, or Willesden Junction.

Colin McKenzie

--
No-one has ever proved that cycle helmets make cycling any safer at
the population level, and anyway cycling is about as safe per mile as
walking.
Make an informed choice - visit www.cyclehelmets.org.

There are a number of reasons why the District will end up at Uxbridge
eventually (with the Picc going to Ealing Bdway?).
- The Piccadilly will benefit from the additional rolling stock, when
Terminal 5 opens. There is no new stock for many years yet.
- The platform to train heights will be "level/ step free" between
Rayners Lane and Uxbridge. As set out in the PPP Contract
- The ATO systems for Tube Lines and Metronet will be different, though
thinking about it now must be compatible for the North Ealing to Acton
Town section, unless as some have said the District runs to Ealing
Broadway.

The SSR will be different in that it will have new trains, new
signalling systems with 12 control/signalling locations being replaced
by one Command & Control centre, step free access to the trains,
changes to the lines.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6213384.stm


Colin McKenzie wrote:

sweek wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
sweek wrote:
It doesn't make much sense to make the longer line the slowest one here,
and the shorter (Ealing Broadway) line the express.

Surely Ealing Broadway would remain District too... the point of the plan is
to increase Picc frequency to Heathrow, and sending Picc trains to Ealing
Broadway would defeat the point of ceasing to serve Uxbridge.

Anyway, didn't they rebuild a Sudbury station or two to have platforms level
with the tube stock a few years ago?

Maybe, but District to Ealing Broadway AND Uxbridge is the only
solution that could eliminate all platforms served by trains of both
sizes. Without this change, level wheelchair access cannot be achieved
at Ealing Common or between Rayners Lane and Uxbridge.

You need less trains for an Ealing Broadway picc. branch than an
Uxbridge picc. branch. Those extra trains could go towards the
increased Heathrow frequency.
I don't think complicating the District line even more is ever a good
idea.

Arguably, when Crossrail is built, Ealing Broadway won't need both
District and Central trains to central London. The capacity might be
better used to create north-south links to Richmond and Uxbridge,
Harrow, or Willesden Junction.

Colin McKenzie

--
No-one has ever proved that cycle helmets make cycling any safer at
the population level, and anyway cycling is about as safe per mile as
walking.
Make an informed choice - visit www.cyclehelmets.org.