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fare dodgers
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:09:43 +0100, Wolfgang Schwanke
wrote: Hello again, during my last London trip I witnessed a group of police and LU staff "guarding" the exits of the station. They caught one man just coming out of the station when I was there, he seemed rather upset (I didn't see how he got through the fare gates). Also inside the station I saw a policeman taking down the ID of some passenger. My interpretation was that they were on hunt for fare dodgers. The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing? The event was in Archway BTW. The LU system is not free of fraud. There are a number of things that can happen [1] so a human presence to trap people is used. A further tactic has been to use police (with sniffer dogs) as well because it can be the case that people dodging fares may be in possession of weapons or drugs or materials to graffiti the system. On top of all of that we have the threat of attack to the system. We have had a reasonable number of these checks at Walthamstow Central and the police have been kept busy interviewing and detaining people. We have also had the mobile metal detector / walk through scanner used too. [1] I'm not publishing details of potential frauds on usenet. -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
fare dodgers
On Feb 10, 1:41 pm, Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:09:43 +0100, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote: Hello again, during my last London trip I witnessed a group of police and LU staff "guarding" the exits of the station. They caught one man just coming out of the station when I was there, he seemed rather upset (I didn't see how he got through the fare gates). Also inside the station I saw a policeman taking down the ID of some passenger. My interpretation was that they were on hunt for fare dodgers. The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing? The event was in Archway BTW. The LU system is not free of fraud. There are a number of things that can happen [1] so a human presence to trap people is used. A further tactic has been to use police (with sniffer dogs) as well because it can be the case that people dodging fares may be in possession of weapons or drugs or materials to graffiti the system. On top of all of that we have the threat of attack to the system. We have had a reasonable number of these checks at Walthamstow Central and the police have been kept busy interviewing and detaining people. We have also had the mobile metal detector / walk through scanner used too. [1] I'm not publishing details of potential frauds on usenet. Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. Guy in the "ticket office" (which doesnt sell ticket) wasn't bothered though, too busy reading the paper. The guy in the ticket office |
fare dodgers
Paul Weaver wrote:
Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. Not to mention making you an unwitting accomplice if she does it right on your heels as you said. -- Michael Hoffman |
fare dodgers
On 10 Feb 2007 06:13:19 -0800, "Paul Weaver"
wrote: Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. If, and it's a big if, you detect you are to be subjected to "a lambada" through a gate then it's quite fun to stop before the end of the aisle and make loud shouty noises about what on earth is going on. ;-) This sort of fraud can be dealt with if there are plain clothes inspectors and police waiting in the ticket hall area. Local staff will know if there is a prevalence for such behaviour at particular times and suitable observation and checks can be put in place. CCTV coverage at gatelines also assists in identifying the problem. I accept, though, that a proportion of such fraud is opportunistic which is harder to deal with. -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
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Paul Weaver wrote:
they had followed through the barrier on my heels I always check before inserting my ticket that there is no-one behind me... but this might be impossible in rush hour. |
fare dodgers
In message , John Rowland
writes Paul Weaver wrote: they had followed through the barrier on my heels I always check before inserting my ticket that there is no-one behind me... but this might be impossible in rush hour. If they get it wrong you can find yourself up against a locked barrier in close proximity to a very dodgy individual. Not the best way to treat loyal customers and there must be a better way of doing it. How about a photo card, a weekly ticket and gates with human being on them ? :-) -- Edward Cowling London UK |
fare dodgers
"John Rowland" typed
Paul Weaver wrote: they had followed through the barrier on my heels I always check before inserting my ticket that there is no-one behind me... but this might be impossible in rush hour. I suddenly get very slow and wobbly when I'm tailgated; shame about trading on toes... -- Helen D. Vecht: Edgware. |
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On Feb 10, 2:13 pm, "Paul Weaver" wrote:
Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. Perhaps for your next trick you could take your public spirited stand to the GLA offices and do the same to Ken LIvingstone and his cronies who have raised the price of travelcards to absurd levels. I have every sympathy with fare dodgers these days since the travelling public in london is being completely and utterly shafted by sky high fares and a 3rd world service run by a bunch of thick witted management and bone idle, indifferent staff. B2003 |
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On Feb 11, 6:27 pm, "Boltar" wrote:
On Feb 10, 2:13 pm, "Paul Weaver" wrote: Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. Perhaps for your next trick you could take your public spirited stand to the GLA offices and do the same to Ken LIvingstone and his cronies who have raised the price of travelcards to absurd levels. I have every sympathy with fare dodgers these days since the travelling public in london is being completely and utterly shafted by sky high fares and a 3rd world service run by a bunch of thick witted management and bone idle, indifferent staff. Vote with your pounds then, and don't use it! And remember to vote someone else in to Mayoral office next time, perhaps stand yourself if noone else fits the bill. You could campaign on a platform of "free tube travel for scum, but make everyone getting off at canary wharf pay £50." There are alternatives, they might not be as convienient, quick, or nice, however you can 1) Walk 2) Bike 3) Bus 4) Car 5) Not go Everyone chooses the best value of time/money/convienience for them. In most cases you don't need a travel card (especially a peak time one) Ken's done wonders in moving scum to the buses leaving the tubes, on the most part (save for the drug dealers and fare dodgers) free for normal hard working people. |
fare dodgers
On 11 Feb, 18:27, "Boltar" wrote:
On Feb 10, 2:13 pm, "Paul Weaver" wrote: Some I can't see how you can catch, even with checks on trains. I accosted a middle-class fare dodger at my local station the other day, they had followed through the barrier on my heels so I loudly informed them that fare dodging was illegal and punishable by a £1000 fine. She insisted that she had a valid ticket but it wasn't valid until after 09:30 (it was 0900), and it was no buisness of mine, to which I responded if it's valid, it would open the barrier, and if you're fare dodging you're increasing my fare and making my station seem less used than it is, leading to possible closure. Perhaps for your next trick you could take your public spirited stand to the GLA offices and do the same to Ken LIvingstone and his cronies who have raised the price of travelcards to absurd levels. I have every sympathy with fare dodgers these days since the travelling public in london is being completely and utterly shafted by sky high fares and a 3rd world service run by a bunch of thick witted management and bone idle, indifferent staff. B2003 It is a shame that Boltar didn't end his comments at Mayor Livingstone, he then decided to slag the staff that mostly agree that fares are exorbibant. We are on our feet for between 5 and 8 hours a day and have to take not only verbal but also now becoming more frequent physical abuse. If he thinks our job is easy, why not spend a shift at a central London station and experience the delightful travelling public. Also if something goes wrong, be it fire, explosion or any number of possibilities, he will rely on the training of the staff to get him out. I hope he takes that on board the next time he chooses to slag off the staff. |
fare dodgers
On Feb 12, 11:53 am, "Paul Weaver" wrote:
Vote with your pounds then, and don't use it! And remember to vote Sorry , the don't use it argument is a non starter. Some of us don't have a choice. Everyone chooses the best value of time/money/convienience for them. In most cases you don't need a travel card (especially a peak time one) In most cases except when you're travelling to work? Isn't it funny how travelcards are more expensive before 9.30. However I'm sure this is purely for operational reasons and has nothing to do with fleeceing the public. Ken's done wonders in moving scum to the buses leaving the tubes, on the most part (save for the drug dealers and fare dodgers) free for normal hard working people. Well you have to be hard working to afford the fares now. B2003 |
fare dodgers
On Feb 12, 12:00 pm, "doctorcrippin"
wrote: It is a shame that Boltar didn't end his comments at Mayor Livingstone, he then decided to slag the staff that mostly agree that fares are exorbibant. We are on our feet for between 5 and 8 hours a day and have to take not only verbal but also now becoming more frequent physical abuse. If he thinks our job is easy, why not spend a shift at a central London station and experience the delightful travelling public. Also if something goes wrong, be it fire, explosion or any number of possibilities, he will rely on the training of the staff to get him out. I hope he takes that on board the next time he chooses to slag off the staff. I was going to write a long reply , but I can't be bothered. 3 points: - Station staff who know nothing about whats going on and vanish as soon as theres a delay giving us sod all information even over the tannoy (the Finsbury Park staff seem to be especially good at this). - Drivers who make exorbitant demands for money. - Signallers who don't seem to know where a train is going which ends up sitting at a red light for ages. B2003 |
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On 12 Feb, 14:51, "Boltar" wrote:
Vote with your pounds then, and don't use it! And remember to vote Sorry , the don't use it argument is a non starter. Some of us don't have a choice. Rubbish. Are you genuinely incapable of getting a job within cycling/ walking/bussing distance of your house? Are your skills so niche that you wouldn't be able to find any employment outside of London? If not, then you have a choice. And your decision has been to pay for the Tube rather than make these lifestyle changes. Go figure... -- John Band john at johnband dot org www.johnband.org |
fare dodgers
On Feb 12, 4:34 pm, "John B" wrote:
On 12 Feb, 14:51, "Boltar" wrote: Vote with your pounds then, and don't use it! And remember to vote Sorry , the don't use it argument is a non starter. Some of us don't have a choice. Rubbish. Are you genuinely incapable of getting a job within cycling/ walking/bussing distance of your house? No , I'm sure could get a job flipping burgers in the local McDonalds. If not, then you have a choice. And your decision has been to pay for the Tube rather than make these lifestyle changes. Go figure... No mate , when I started working in london the fares were reasonable. I didn't get a job here *knowing* how bad the fares were because they *weren't* that bad. They been slowly forced on me as the years went by. And you saying I've made some sort of liftstyle choice so should put up with the fares is just specious defeatist bull**** - you could use that sort of argument to justify anything and let the people responsible get away with it. Don't like the way the country is being run? Go live somewhere else. Don't agree with the bombing of Iraq? Go live somewhere else. Don't like the cost of stamps? Go live somewhere else. Etc etc. B2003 |
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On 12 Feb, 16:47, "Boltar" wrote:
If not, then you have a choice. And your decision has been to pay for the Tube rather than make these lifestyle changes. Go figure... No mate , when I started working in london the fares were reasonable. I didn't get a job here *knowing* how bad the fares were because they *weren't* that bad. They been slowly forced on me as the years went by. This is simply not true (unless you started working in the middle of Fares Fair, in which case that's rather unfortunate but a fairly obvious one-off...) In 1992, a monthly z1-6 Travelcard cost £91.40. The same card now costs £165.20. [1] Based on inflatiion (RPI), £91.40 in 1992 is the same as £126.71 in 2005. As a share of median earnings, £91.40 is the same as £152.12 in 2005. And as a share of GDP per capita, £91.40 is the same as £174.94 in 2005 (this is much higher than the earnings figure because of the increase in income inequality...) [2] Trending things forward to mid-2007, inflation has been running at about 2.5% for 2 years, so the figure now would be £133. Earnings growth has been running at about 5% (including inflation) so the figure would be £168ish. In orther words, if you've got a job where you've seen the same kind of rise in earnings as the average UK worker, then you're spending the same share of your income on your Travelcard that you would have spent in 1992 (and I've actually rigged the figures against myself here, because fares rose 14% between 1992 and 1993 - if I'd started a year later then the calculation would have shown today as noticeably cheaper). [1] http://www.publications.parliament.u...0001/cmhansrd/ vo010409/text/10409w07.htm [2] http://www.measuringworth.com/ukcompare/ -- John Band john at johnband dot org www.johnband.org |
fare dodgers
Perhaps the staff at Finsbury Park are the exception,cant comment on drivers
and pay however if the ballot is returned with a solid yes vote expect to see several strike days. "Boltar" wrote in message oups.com... On Feb 12, 12:00 pm, "doctorcrippin" wrote: It is a shame that Boltar didn't end his comments at Mayor Livingstone, he then decided to slag the staff that mostly agree that fares are exorbibant. We are on our feet for between 5 and 8 hours a day and have to take not only verbal but also now becoming more frequent physical abuse. If he thinks our job is easy, why not spend a shift at a central London station and experience the delightful travelling public. Also if something goes wrong, be it fire, explosion or any number of possibilities, he will rely on the training of the staff to get him out. I hope he takes that on board the next time he chooses to slag off the staff. I was going to write a long reply , but I can't be bothered. 3 points: - Station staff who know nothing about whats going on and vanish as soon as theres a delay giving us sod all information even over the tannoy (the Finsbury Park staff seem to be especially good at this). - Drivers who make exorbitant demands for money. - Signallers who don't seem to know where a train is going which ends up sitting at a red light for ages. B2003 |
fare dodgers
On Feb 12, 6:00 pm, "John B" wrote:
In 1992, a monthly z1-6 Travelcard cost £91.40. The same card now costs £165.20. [1] Based on inflatiion (RPI), £91.40 in 1992 is the same as £126.71 in 2005. As a share of median earnings, £91.40 is the same as £152.12 in 2005. And as a share of GDP per capita, £91.40 is the same as £174.94 in 2005 (this is much higher than the earnings figure because of the increase in income inequality...) [2] Trending things forward to mid-2007, inflation has been running at about 2.5% for 2 years, so the figure now would be £133. Earnings growth has been running at about 5% (including inflation) so the figure would be £168ish. Thats all very fascinating and I'm sure you and your Casio had a great time. What I can tell you is that my monthly travelcard cost me about 95 quid 3 years ago (which is as far back as I can remember, I've been using the tube to go to work on and off for 10 years) , this month its over 120. For 3 years with inflation of say 3% that 95 quid should now be 95 * 1.03 ^ 3 = 103.80. So where has that other 17 quid come from then? B2003 |
fare dodgers
On 12 Feb 2007 06:51:07 -0800, "Boltar"
wrote: Isn't it funny how travelcards are more expensive before 9.30. However I'm sure this is purely for operational reasons and has nothing to do with fleeceing the public. Day travelcards are more expensive before 0930 to discourage tourists from adding extra congestion to the morning rush hour. |
fare dodgers
Boltar wrote:
Don't like the way the country is being run? Go live somewhere else. Don't agree with the bombing of Iraq? Go live somewhere else. Don't like the cost of stamps? Go live somewhere else. Don't like anything that TfL or LUL do? Go post somewhere else. |
fare dodgers
Paul Weaver wrote:
Ken's done wonders in moving scum to the buses leaving the tubes, on the most part (save for the drug dealers and fare dodgers) free for normal hard working people. What a delightfully backward opinion. |
fare dodgers
On Feb 12, 11:25 pm, "Boltar" wrote:
Thats all very fascinating and I'm sure you and your Casio had a great time. What I can tell you is that my monthly travelcard cost me about 95 quid 3 years ago (which is as far back as I can remember, I've been using the tube to go to work on and off for 10 years) , this month its over 120. For 3 years with inflation of say 3% that 95 quid should now be 95 * 1.03 ^ 3 = 103.80. So where has that other 17 quid come from then? A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... The additional increase is fair enough, because the UK economy is currently showing substantial deflation in goods prices combined with inflation in services prices. The Tube's cost base is primarily based on services and wages rather than goods, so its costs will be rising faster than inflation too... -- John Band john at johnband dot org www.johnband.org |
fare dodgers
On 13 Feb, 08:56, "John B" wrote:
On Feb 12, 11:25 pm, "Boltar" wrote: Thats all very fascinating and I'm sure you and your Casio had a great time. What I can tell you is that my monthly travelcard cost me about 95 quid 3 years ago (which is as far back as I can remember, I've been using the tube to go to work on and off for 10 years) , this month its over 120. For 3 years with inflation of say 3% that 95 quid should now be 95 * 1.03 ^ 3 = 103.80. So where has that other 17 quid come from then? A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... The additional increase is fair enough, because the UK economy is currently showing substantial deflation in goods prices combined with inflation in services prices. The Tube's cost base is primarily based on services and wages rather than goods, so its costs will be rising faster than inflation too... -- John Band john at johnband dot orgwww.johnband.org You just don't get it John - what's evidence got to do with it? It's all about sheer assertion of the facts. ;) |
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On Feb 13, 1:22 am, "John Rowland"
wrote: Boltar wrote: Don't like the way the country is being run? Go live somewhere else. Don't agree with the bombing of Iraq? Go live somewhere else. Don't like the cost of stamps? Go live somewhere else. Don't like anything that TfL or LUL do? Go post somewhere else. And there was me thinking this group was about general transport in london issues. Or is it just for the LUL fan club? B2003 |
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On Feb 13, 8:56 am, "John B" wrote:
A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... Really? Where'd you get that information from. Post a link. I know for a fact mine was 100 3 years back and now its over 120. B2003 |
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On 13 Feb, 09:35, "Boltar" wrote:
On Feb 13, 8:56 am, "John B" wrote: A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... Really? Where'd you get that information from. Post a link. I know for a fact mine was 100 3 years back and now its over 120. B2003 2007: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick...card-adult.asp 2004: http://web.archive.org/web/200406102...es.pdf#page=17 -- John Band john at johnband dot org www.johnband.org |
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On Feb 13, 9:50 am, "John B" wrote:
On 13 Feb, 09:35, "Boltar" wrote: On Feb 13, 8:56 am, "John B" wrote: A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... Really? Where'd you get that information from. Post a link. I know for a fact mine was 100 3 years back and now its over 120. B2003 2007:http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick...ard-adult..asp 2004:http://web.archive.org/web/200406102...k/common/downl... Hmm , theres something odd there. The rate it gives for my travelcard in 2004 is much higher than I used to pay (I'm self employed so I have to keep records of expenses) and in fact the rate it gives for 2007 is more than I payed this month, only by 4 pounds but its still wrong. Or maybe the guy at the ticket office got it wrong. Strange. B2003 |
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"Mizter T" typed
The additional increase is fair enough, because the UK economy is currently showing substantial deflation in goods prices combined with inflation in services prices. The Tube's cost base is primarily based on services and wages rather than goods, so its costs will be rising faster than inflation too... You just don't get it John - what's evidence got to do with it? It's all about sheer assertion of the facts. ;) Anyway, with judicious use of Oyster, my partner's fare expenditure is much less than in 2004. He made a little trip from Preston Road to Uxbridge yesterday evening, cycling to the station. £1 each way, rather cheaper than the £1.70 each way on Oyster in 2004... -- Helen D. Vecht: Edgware. |
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On Feb 13, 10:14 am, "Boltar" wrote:
On Feb 13, 9:50 am, "John B" wrote: On 13 Feb, 09:35, "Boltar" wrote: On Feb 13, 8:56 am, "John B" wrote: A z1-3 Travelcard cost £91.40 in 2004 and now costs £105.30, which is only slightly above the inflation-adjusted increase you suggest above. I'm not sure what kind of exotic ticket you're using... Really? Where'd you get that information from. Post a link. I know for a fact mine was 100 3 years back and now its over 120. B2003 2007:http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick...card-adult.asp 2004:http://web.archive.org/web/200406102...k/common/downl... Hmm , theres something odd there. The rate it gives for my travelcard in 2004 is much higher than I used to pay (I'm self employed so I have to keep records of expenses) and in fact the rate it gives for 2007 is more than I payed this month, only by 4 pounds but its still wrong. Or maybe the guy at the ticket office got it wrong. Strange. B2003 Is it from NR with a (non)punctuality discount? |
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On Feb 13, 11:12 am, "MIG" wrote:
Is it from NR with a (non)punctuality discount? No , its tube. No idea where the discrepancy comes from , but if I'm getting it cheaper I'm not complaining though its still far too high given the service. B2003 |
fare dodgers
If, and it's a big if, you detect you are to be subjected to "a lambada"
through a gate then it's quite fun to stop before the end of the aisle and make loud shouty noises about what on earth is going on. ;-) But the staff seem barely bothered. On a couple of occasions I have complained to the guard about this and they just shrug their shoulders. A short while back (about 6 months ago) at North Greenwich a man bundled in behind my girlfriend and was shoving so hard he bundled her over - he was a big bloke with 2 friends so the incident was fairly alarming - I immediately approached the guard who told them not to do it again but took no further action. This will go on being a problem until LU takes it seriously. |
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whos2091 wrote:
If, and it's a big if, you detect you are to be subjected to "a lambada" through a gate then it's quite fun to stop before the end of the aisle and make loud shouty noises about what on earth is going on. ;-) But the staff seem barely bothered. On a couple of occasions I have complained to the guard about this and they just shrug their shoulders. A short while back (about 6 months ago) at North Greenwich a man bundled in behind my girlfriend and was shoving so hard he bundled her over - he was a big bloke with 2 friends so the incident was fairly alarming - I immediately approached the guard who told them not to do it again but took no further action. This will go on being a problem until LU takes it seriously. FWIW, when some little teenage oik tried to follow me in at East Croydon, and I blocked him in, and turned round to shout "oi wodyerfinkyerdoin", a large BTP officer appeared from nowhere in seconds and took him for "a word" :-) -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
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Arthur Figgis wrote:
whos2091 wrote: If, and it's a big if, you detect you are to be subjected to "a lambada" through a gate then it's quite fun to stop before the end of the aisle and make loud shouty noises about what on earth is going on. ;-) But the staff seem barely bothered. On a couple of occasions I have complained to the guard about this and they just shrug their shoulders. A short while back (about 6 months ago) at North Greenwich a man bundled in behind my girlfriend and was shoving so hard he bundled her over - he was a big bloke with 2 friends so the incident was fairly alarming - I immediately approached the guard who told them not to do it again but took no further action. This will go on being a problem until LU takes it seriously. FWIW, when some little teenage oik tried to follow me in at East Croydon, and I blocked him in, and turned round to shout "oi wodyerfinkyerdoin", a large BTP officer appeared from nowhere in seconds and took him for "a word" :-) I was waiting for a friend at Embankment the other day and watched in interest as a rather eccentric guy staked out near the station entrances, picked a target heading for the gates, strode after them quickly, got stuck in the gates and effed and blinded for a few moments, then went back to the entrances and tried exactly the same thing another time before succeeding the third time. The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. -- Dave Arquati www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
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The gateline staff didn't seem too interested.
I told gateline staff about someone I saw doubling up at KX suburban as he was heading for KX tube, he did the same there in front of both of us. The staffer just said they would catch him eventually during one of the regular stings there. The impression I got is that the gateline staff are just there to make sure no-one gets stuck and to let people through manual barriers who are carrying luggage etc. They have no interest in revenue and are probably not authorised to issue PF's and would not be in the game of detaining someone who didn't have a ticket. In fact they would probably open the gates if you asked nicely enough, lest they be acqused of "false imprisonment" or kidnap? D |
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On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote:
The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. The (Silverlink) "security" guard backed him up shouting "What's it to do with you? How is it your business if he's got a ticket?" at me. -- Rob |
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In article ,
DaveP wrote: They have no interest in revenue and are probably not authorised to issue PF's and would not be in the game of detaining someone who didn't have a ticket. In fact they would probably open the gates if you asked nicely enough, lest they be acqused of "false imprisonment" or kidnap? More likely they are instructed to avoid confrontation for obvious reasons. E. |
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Rob Hamadi wrote:
On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote: The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. Tip for the future. In London NEVER confront anybody! Let him squeeze through, and the authorities deal with him if they see him. As you really could end up getting stabbed by a nutter. |
fare dodgers
On Feb 17, 3:52 pm, "Stevo" wrote:
Rob Hamadi wrote: On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote: The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. Tip for the future. In London NEVER confront anybody! Let him squeeze through, and the authorities deal with him if they see him. As you really could end up getting stabbed by a nutter. Thanks for the concern Stevo, but the fact that the man turned out to be a sh*t didn't really come as much of a surprise. What did annoy me was the attitude of the so-called security operative, who basically made the decision to come out in support of the criminal who was defrauding his employers and threatening one of their customers. -- Rob |
fare dodgers
Rob Hamadi wrote:
On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote: The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. The (Silverlink) "security" guard backed him up shouting "What's it to do with you? How is it your business if he's got a ticket?" at me. If he was definitely a security guard, and the above is an accurate portrayal of what he said, then I am surprised. Perhaps the security guard and the guy knew each other, or perhaps the security guard has sussed out his ground and knew whom to leave alone if he was after an easy life. Out of interest where did this happen? |
fare dodgers
On 17 Feb, 15:52, "Stevo" wrote:
Rob Hamadi wrote: On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote: The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. Tip for the future. In London NEVER confront anybody! Let him squeeze through, and the authorities deal with him if they see him. As you really could end up getting stabbed by a nutter. I disagree. If your policy is to never confront anyone (and when I say confront this can merely mean a polite and queit word with someone) then it's carte blanche for anyone who feels like it to take the **** with no come. Obviously any one situation has to be addressed individually according to specific circumstances - note that I'm not saying one should *always* confront the person(s), just saying that I think it's a bit pathetic to decide that one will *never* confront anyone. |
fare dodgers
On Feb 17, 7:14 pm, "Mizter T" wrote:
Rob Hamadi wrote: On Feb 16, 11:07 pm, Dave A wrote: The gateline staff didn't seem too interested. Last time I confronted a guy for squeezing through behind me he threatened to stab me. The (Silverlink) "security" guard backed him up shouting "What's it to do with you? How is it your business if he's got a ticket?" at me. If he was definitely a security guard, and the above is an accurate portrayal of what he said, then I am surprised. He was, it is and so was I. Perhaps the security guard and the guy knew each other, or perhaps the security guard has sussed out his ground and knew whom to leave alone if he was after an easy life. I got the impression that they knew each other. Out of interest where did this happen? Camden Road. Incidentally, when I appealed to the Silverlink employee in the ticket office, he seemed terrified of the "security" man and eventually lost all command of the English language in an effort to make me go away. -- Rob |
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