In message , Wolfgang Schwanke
writes

The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I
thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out
of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing
over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down
fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing?


Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch for
it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of you
offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the barrier
and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader, just as they
get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through (on your card)
and you get left there looking like a lemon.

I now hold back and wait for the person in front to fully exit the
barrier before I put my Oyster anywhere near the reader. On two
occasions I've had people with the "seek assistance" screen look back at
me, and look at my card.... obviously waiting to be let out. Oh no, now
I just glare at them until they go elsewhere.

Then you still get the people who try to keep about an inch away from
you and go through the barrier on your ticket. All extremely annoying
and I'd like to see a few of them named and shamed on bill boards
outside the stations. One main cause of this is the train routes (like
the old WAGN line into Moorgate) where there are still no barriers to
entry or exit !!


--
Edward Cowling London UK

Edward Cowling London UK wrote:

Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch for
it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of you
offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the barrier
and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader, just as they
get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through (on your card)
and you get left there looking like a lemon.

Seems like this would be easy enough to deal with if the gate buzzed
upon an exception like this.
--
Michael Hoffman

In message , Michael Hoffman
writes
Edward Cowling London UK wrote:

Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch
for it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of
you offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the
barrier and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader,
just as they get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through
(on your card) and you get left there looking like a lemon.

Seems like this would be easy enough to deal with if the gate buzzed
upon an exception like this.

Any sort of audible, or visible acceptance would be nice. All you get is
the pale green "Exit" come up. There may already be an audible signal,
but who could hear it at a busy station. A nice big green or red light
on top of the barrier would remove any ambiguity.


--
Edward Cowling London UK

On Feb 10, 2:11 pm, Edward Cowling London UK
wrote:
In message , Wolfgang Schwanke
writes



The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I
thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out
of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing
over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down
fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing?

Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch for
it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of you
offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the barrier
and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader, just as they
get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through (on your card)
and you get left there looking like a lemon.

I now hold back and wait for the person in front to fully exit the
barrier before I put my Oyster anywhere near the reader. On two
occasions I've had people with the "seek assistance" screen look back at
me, and look at my card.... obviously waiting to be let out. Oh no, now
I just glare at them until they go elsewhere.


It's easily done. I once grabbed the wrong ticket out my wallet and by
the time I was getting seek assistance, the woman behind had put her
ticket in and opened the gate. I had no choice but to go through and
then lend her my travelcard to get out with.

On the original point, sometimes I see ticket checks accompanied by
large numbers of police resulting in people being trapped dangerously
in a subway. There is obviously cooperation, but are the police there
to protect the inspectors, or are the inspectors slowing the crowd
down so the police can search for someone they are after?

It often looks much more like the latter.



Then you still get the people who try to keep about an inch away from
you and go through the barrier on your ticket. All extremely annoying
and I'd like to see a few of them named and shamed on bill boards
outside the stations. One main cause of this is the train routes (like
the old WAGN line into Moorgate) where there are still no barriers to
entry or exit !!

MIG wrote:
On Feb 10, 2:11 pm, Edward Cowling London UK
wrote:
In message , Wolfgang Schwanke
writes



The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I
thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out
of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing
over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down
fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing?
Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch for
it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of you
offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the barrier
and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader, just as they
get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through (on your card)
and you get left there looking like a lemon.

I now hold back and wait for the person in front to fully exit the
barrier before I put my Oyster anywhere near the reader. On two
occasions I've had people with the "seek assistance" screen look back at
me, and look at my card.... obviously waiting to be let out. Oh no, now
I just glare at them until they go elsewhere.


It's easily done. I once grabbed the wrong ticket out my wallet and by
the time I was getting seek assistance, the woman behind had put her
ticket in and opened the gate. I had no choice but to go through and
then lend her my travelcard to get out with.

No choice? When that happens to me, I turn round, come back out (with
the gates waiting open) and let the person who the gate "belongs" to go
through. And then re-do mine.

On Feb 10, 6:46 pm, Dave Newt wrote:
MIG wrote:
On Feb 10, 2:11 pm, Edward Cowling London UK
wrote:
In message , Wolfgang Schwanke
writes

The part I don't understand is why they do this in the first place. I
thought the LU system is rather "fraud safe". You can't get in or out
of the system without some form of valid ticket (except by climbing
over the gates or taking a detour to a DLR station), so hunting down
fare dodgers should be pointless. What am I missing?
Several times I've been caught by this trick, so perhaps they watch for
it. Everyone hurtles up to the barrier and the person in front of you
offers up their ticket / card. They start striding through the barrier
and you follow up behind and put your Oyster on the reader, just as they
get the "seek assistance" screen. They carry on through (on your card)
and you get left there looking like a lemon.

I now hold back and wait for the person in front to fully exit the
barrier before I put my Oyster anywhere near the reader. On two
occasions I've had people with the "seek assistance" screen look back at
me, and look at my card.... obviously waiting to be let out. Oh no, now
I just glare at them until they go elsewhere.

It's easily done. I once grabbed the wrong ticket out my wallet and by
the time I was getting seek assistance, the woman behind had put her
ticket in and opened the gate. I had no choice but to go through and
then lend her my travelcard to get out with.

No choice? When that happens to me, I turn round, come back out (with
the gates waiting open) and let the person who the gate "belongs" to go
through. And then re-do mine


How long do you suppose the gates remain open? Anyway, with people
jammed up behind, it's not easy to turn round, and by the time you
could shuffle out, the gates would definitely be closed.

My ticket would then still have worked, but hers wouldn't.

In message . com, MIG
writes


How long do you suppose the gates remain open? Anyway, with people
jammed up behind, it's not easy to turn round, and by the time you
could shuffle out, the gates would definitely be closed.

My ticket would then still have worked, but hers wouldn't.

I can feel a big chorus of...

Shame on you MIG, Shame on you !!

--
Edward Cowling London UK

On 10 Feb 2007 11:55:19 -0800, "MIG"
wrote:

How long do you suppose the gates remain open? Anyway, with people
jammed up behind, it's not easy to turn round, and by the time you
could shuffle out, the gates would definitely be closed.

My ticket would then still have worked, but hers wouldn't.

Don't they stay open until someone goes through them?

James Farrar wrote:
On 10 Feb 2007 11:55:19 -0800, "MIG"
wrote:

How long do you suppose the gates remain open? Anyway, with people
jammed up behind, it's not easy to turn round, and by the time you
could shuffle out, the gates would definitely be closed.

My ticket would then still have worked, but hers wouldn't.

Don't they stay open until someone goes through them?

Exactly.

On Feb 11, 11:56 am, Dave Newt wrote:
James Farrar wrote:
On 10 Feb 2007 11:55:19 -0800, "MIG"
wrote:

How long do you suppose the gates remain open? Anyway, with people
jammed up behind, it's not easy to turn round, and by the time you
could shuffle out, the gates would definitely be closed.

My ticket would then still have worked, but hers wouldn't.

Don't they stay open until someone goes through them?

Exactly.



I guess there are different kinds of machine operated by different
companies, but I am sure that I have been caught out by taking too
long in the past, eg when carrying something awkward, and I've seen
others caught out as well. I wouldn't want to risk it.

It's still not easy to back out when someone is so close behind you,
and the rest of the queue behind them, that they've already put their
ticket in. Easier to go through and lend them your ticket (assuming
you've got a valid one, which I did).