On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 19:39:56 +0000, "Clive."
wrote:

In message , ian henden
writes

It's an MW.... see http://classicbristolbuses.thornet.co.uk/mw.htm

I recognise it, we used to call then conker-boxes because the cab was
boxed in. They had a funny gearbox. The normal H but fifth was only
accessible from forth being right (towards the driver) then forward,

That was the standard layout for a Bristol, from the J-type onwards.
Dennis Lancets had a similar arrangement, except that 5th was a
pre-selector. Push the lever forward and hit the clutch pedal when you
were ready to change up.
--
Terry Harper
Website Coordinator, The Omnibus Society
http://www.omnibussoc.org

On Tue, 20 Mar 2007 00:40:53 -0000, "Peter Corser"
wrote:

The trains you are thinking of are common in Europe, USA, Canada, China (I
think), at least.

They are, however, only double deckers in practice. The middle levels are
only over the wheels and are usually used for entrance/exit and standing
customers only (there may be tip up emergency seats in some instances),
there is still only room for two sets of seated passengers even within other
countries extended loading gauges.

Definitely in China. I've travelled on them from Shanghai to Nanjing.
3-a-side seating upstairs and down, with moulded plastic seats.
--
Terry Harper
Website Coordinator, The Omnibus Society
http://www.omnibussoc.org

"Clive." wrote in message
...
In message , ian henden
writes

"Clive." wrote in message
...
In message , ian henden
writes
If the
engine were under the centre floor (an ideal location for stability, if
not
servicing access), then the lower deck aisle would be too high (look at
1960s single deck Bristol MW, for example.) Can't get wheelchairs and
buggies up steps.
I've never heard of an MV,
It's an MW.... see http://classicbristolbuses.thornet.co.uk/mw.htm
I recognise it, we used to call then conker-boxes because the cab was
boxed in. They had a funny gearbox. The normal H but fifth was only
accessible from forth being right (towards the driver) then forward,

"Dog-leg" fifth.

On ECOC, all the MW had them, but only the newer LFS had them - the
remainder had normal 4-speed boxes.

but in the mix of buses we had, our mainstay
was the Bristol/Lodeka double-deckers (crash boxes) and the Bristol RE
single-deckers (pre selector boxes)
Semi automatic
I don't know what you call semi automatic,

Semi - automatic: Tiny gear lever, no clutch. Change gear by actually moving
the gear lever. As per VR, RE, some LH, some FLF, some Leyland Leoprds
("pudding stick") and Tigers, and many others.

Pre-select : (usually tiny) gear lever. Put the lever in the gear you intend
to use next, but the vehicle continues to drive in it's previously selected
gear until you operate a "clutch" - it's actually called a gear-change
pedal! - on the floor. As per RM original equipment, I beleive, BICBW.

Never driven a pre-select bus (although plenty existed) apart from the
computer-controlled 10-speed version (scania?) a few years ago, but Ferret
scout cars and also Gainsborough medium wheeled tractors in the Army had
pre-selects, and I drove them there.

--
IanH

In message , ian henden
writes
Semi - automatic: Tiny gear lever, no clutch. Change gear by actually moving
the gear lever. As per VR, RE, some LH, some FLF, some Leyland Leoprds
("pudding stick") and Tigers, and many others.

Pre-select : (usually tiny) gear lever. Put the lever in the gear you intend
to use next, but the vehicle continues to drive in it's previously selected
gear until you operate a "clutch" - it's actually called a gear-change
pedal! - on the floor. As per RM original equipment, I beleive, BICBW.
Now I'm confused, the RE had a 1 inch long lever in a tiny gate on a
substantial mounting that stuck out of the steering wheel column on the
left, you changed gear but nothing happened until you lifted off of the
gas pedal, then the gear box would up change or other as required. So
the gear was pre selected but you got the change by "flashing" the pedal
up and down. What would you call it?
--
Clive.

Peter Corser wrote:
"Arthur Figgis" wrote in message
...

Now quite the same thing, but there are trains on the Continent with seats
on three levels (downstairs, upstairs, and a middle level at the ends over
the wheels), and I suppose a bus could be arranged in a similar manner if
someone thought of a reason to bother.
--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

Arthur

The trains you are thinking of are common in Europe, USA, Canada, China (I
think), at least.

They are, however, only double deckers in practice.

Indeed.

The middle levels are
only over the wheels and are usually used for entrance/exit and standing
customers only (there may be tip up emergency seats in some instances),
there is still only room for two sets of seated passengers even within other
countries extended loading gauges.

I've seen some with seating over the bogies. I'd guess either DB or PKP.

As for stories of everyone in a bus dying, it could just be a tour
guide's tall story.


--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

"Clive." wrote in message
...
In message , ian henden
writes
Semi - automatic: Tiny gear lever, no clutch. Change gear by actually
moving
the gear lever. As per VR, RE, some LH, some FLF, some Leyland Leoprds
("pudding stick") and Tigers, and many others.

Pre-select : (usually tiny) gear lever. Put the lever in the gear you
intend
to use next, but the vehicle continues to drive in it's previously
selected
gear until you operate a "clutch" - it's actually called a gear-change
pedal! - on the floor. As per RM original equipment, I beleive, BICBW.
Now I'm confused, the RE had a 1 inch long lever in a tiny gate on a
substantial mounting that stuck out of the steering wheel column on the
left, you changed gear but nothing happened until you lifted off of the
gas pedal, then the gear box would up change or other as required. So
the gear was pre selected but you got the change by "flashing" the pedal
up and down. What would you call it?

The RE had a semi-automatic gear box. (apart from the many manual RELH
coaches - their air clutch was a pig IIRC!!)

Standard set up was as you say mechanically, but, unless your REs were
different from ours, it went into gear as soon as you moved the lever
(provided air prsssure was up - the lever was electrical, but worked
solenoids at the gearbox to send air to tighten the bands).

The bus still stood still until you released brakes and give it some welly,
because there was a fluid coupling (same as you have on an automatic). But
it was driven as normal, which gear being selected was under the control of
the driver, all he had to do was shove the gear lever from one gate position
to the next.

Better drivers waited in neutral for a second ot two as they passed upwards,
and also in neutral, revving appropriately, as they changed downwards, to
match roadspeed/gear ratio and give a smooth ride. The gear lever usually
had a slide plate to stop inadvertent selection of reverse.

None of the RE on ECOC, Provincial, or the exW&D DP that I drove last year,
involved the gas pedal in actually selecting the gear. Ocassionally, some
companies had interlocks from the rear doors on two-door buses which
disabled the gearbox so you couldn't drive with the rear doors open. With
an electrically signalled gearbox, it is simple to build all sorts of
interlocks in, locally. I suppose it was possible (but not probable) that
your company had vehicles modified thus..
--
IanH

On Mar 20, 4:16 pm, "ian henden" wrote:
using manual gearboxes. It's only the remote location of the engine that
prompted first, semi-automatics, and latterly, fullly automatic gearboxes.
Saves having complicated linkages under the floor (where ther isn't much

I always thought having an autobox was simply to make the drivers
lives a bit easier in stop start traffic. I've never driven a bus but
I'd imagine having to change gear constantly on a 6 hour (or however
long it is) shift would become a right pain in the backside. Certainly
this is why cabbies almost always have autos.

You must have noticed some buses can overtake your lorry on the flat, but
then you can overtake them on an uphill?

Isn't that just because most bus engines are rather underpowered for
the weight of the vehicle? Presumably for fuel economy reasons and I
guess the presumption that in most situations they won't need to go
very fast anyway.

B2003

In message , ian henden
writes
Ocassionally, some
companies had interlocks from the rear doors on two-door buses which
disabled the gearbox so you couldn't drive with the rear doors open. With
an electrically signalled gearbox, it is simple to build all sorts of
interlocks in, locally. I suppose it was possible (but not probable) that
your company had vehicles modified thus..
The gear lever had the slide plate you mention, but the front double
folding doors were operated on the same gate as the gears, from neutral,
left then forward, so it was not possible to have the doors open whilst
in gear and vice versa. They were a favourite of mine because you got
feedback from the brakes through your foot, the Lodeka's just had a
pedal against a spring and as no two were the same you had to drive a
few feet and test to see where the brake take up was. The REs could
shift as well, given space they were good for 60 whereas the Lodeka's
were only good for 35 down hill with a back wind.
--
Clive.

"Clive." wrote in message
...
In message , ian henden
writes
Ocassionally, some
companies had interlocks from the rear doors on two-door buses which
disabled the gearbox so you couldn't drive with the rear doors open. With
an electrically signalled gearbox, it is simple to build all sorts of
interlocks in, locally. I suppose it was possible (but not probable) that
your company had vehicles modified thus..
The gear lever had the slide plate you mention, but the front double
folding doors were operated on the same gate as the gears, from neutral,
left then forward, so it was not possible to have the doors open whilst in
gear and vice versa. They were a favourite of mine because you got
feedback from the brakes through your foot, the Lodeka's just had a pedal
against a spring and as no two were the same you had to drive a few feet
and test to see where the brake take up was. The REs could shift as well,
given space they were good for 60 whereas the Lodeka's were only good for
35 down hill with a back wind.

Some buses did indeed have the doors on the gears. Others were air doors,
sometimes turnvalve to drivers right, sometimes a floor pedal. Depended
entirely on what the original owner specified. Some RE had a low ratio
axle: others, a high ratio axle. Made the difference between 40mph and 50
mph on the open road.

True of early FS - the 4speed ones were a bit ponderous ( I drove one on Jan
1st this year) , but later (5speed) ones were good for an indicated 50.

--
IanH

In article ,
(ian henden) wrote:

There is quite a movement of vehicles within the larger groups,
from one part of the country to another.... nothing new there, NBC
were doing it in the 1970s, swapping ECOC FLFs with Scottish bus
group VRs.

The VR gearboxes couldn't cope with the hills, I remember a bus fitter
telling me at the time.

--
Colin Rosenstiel