On Thu, 14 Aug 2003 12:27:58 -0400, Roland Perry
wrote:

In article , Dr Ivan D. Reid
writes
Is it? IWUTI that your exit had to be clear *before* venturing into
the box

Box junctions. These have criss-cross yellow lines painted on the road
(see Other road markings section). You MUST NOT enter the box until your
exit road or lane is clear. However, you may enter the box and wait when
you want to turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by oncoming
traffic, or by other vehicles waiting to turn right.
-- Highway Code

It seems to me that this advice is rather naive, because it assumes that
the only impediment to the "car in front of you that's also waiting to
turn right" is the flow of oncoming traffic - which will eventually
stop. What if the real reason that the car in front can't turn right is
a traffic queue on the road to the right. In that event, both of you
will be "marooned" in the middle of the box junction when the lights
change :-(

Then you are stopped from doing so by traffic on the right of you
blocking your turning path - and they shouldn't be waiting in a box
junction.

--Nick.
--
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In article , Nick
writes
It seems to me that this advice is rather naive, because it assumes that
the only impediment to the "car in front of you that's also waiting to
turn right" is the flow of oncoming traffic - which will eventually
stop. What if the real reason that the car in front can't turn right is
a traffic queue on the road to the right. In that event, both of you
will be "marooned" in the middle of the box junction when the lights
change :-(

Then you are stopped from doing so by traffic on the right of you
blocking your turning path - and they shouldn't be waiting in a box
junction.

Yes, but the road to the right might have been clear when you first
entered the box.

However, I suppose if we look closely, the offence is *entering* a box
junction at the worn time. Not being sat in a legally entered box
junction feeling like a prat and blocking the traffic...
--
"It used to be that what a writer did was type a bit and then stare out of the
window a bit, type a bit, stare out of the window a bit. Networked computers
make these two activities converge, because now the thing you type on and the
window you stare out of are the same thing" - Douglas Adams 28/1/99.

Roland Perry wrote in message .. .


Yes, but the road to the right might have been clear when you first
entered the box.

However, I suppose if we look closely, the offence is *entering* a box
junction at the worn time. Not being sat in a legally entered box
junction feeling like a prat and blocking the traffic...
It's interesting to observe all the discussion about the confusion
over what is allowed when turning right in a box junction. Alas, the
box junction in question on the North Circular where I received the
penalty had no right turn junction (only traffic merging from the
left, and crossing from the right) - so there is no excuse here.

Perhaps they do not have box junction cameras as such "right enabled"
box junctions?

Robin