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Old October 9th 03, 08:44 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos?? If its
affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains manually through the
affected section? Or has more than just a signal gone wrong and they don't
want to tell us?

Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.
Still , if the powers that be there had brains they wouldn't have been working
for LU in the first place I guess...

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Old October 9th 03, 08:59 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup


"Boltar" wrote in message
om...
How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos?? If its
affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains manually through

the
affected section? Or has more than just a signal gone wrong and they don't
want to tell us?

Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.
Still , if the powers that be there had brains they wouldn't have been

working
for LU in the first place I guess...


i think i heard that they were repairing a rail section this morning....


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Old October 9th 03, 11:21 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup


"Boltar" wrote in message
om...
How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos?? If its
affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains manually through

the
affected section? Or has more than just a signal gone wrong and they don't
want to tell us?


Bear in mind that the Green Park - Charing Cross section contains both the
change-over from 'original' to 'new' signalling and the junction to Charing
Cross. I don't know the full details of the failure, but suspending the
service isn't something considered lightly, despite what some people think.

Tell us what you mean by "just a signal gone wrong" and perhaps you'll be
told more...

Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.


Money?

Still , if the powers that be there had brains they wouldn't have been

working
for LU in the first place I guess...


Oh change the record, please! Perhaps the people who had brains were working
for that wonderful private company Westinghouse Signals, or then again,
obviously not!


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Old October 9th 03, 12:51 PM posted to uk.transport.london
K K is offline
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Default Jubilee line screwup

On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 12:21:02 +0100, "Robin Mayes"
wrote:



Tell us what you mean by "just a signal gone wrong" and perhaps you'll be
told more...


Well, you tell us - it was reported to be a signal failure which
caused it


Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.


Money?


It cost them money to do those things which it wouldn't have cost if
they hadn't


Oh change the record, please! Perhaps the people who had brains were working
for that wonderful private company Westinghouse Signals, or then again,
obviously not!

Well if the company which supplies the signals is no good then use a
differnt company! After all, underground systems in plenty of other
cities around the world can manage it.


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Old October 9th 03, 04:04 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

In message , Robin May
writes

How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos??
If its affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains
manually through the affected section? Or has more than just a
signal gone wrong and they don't want to tell us?


The Jubilee doesn't have ATO, does it?


No it doesn't. Only the Victoria and Central line have it currently.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)
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Old October 9th 03, 05:51 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

Alot of which is provided by Westinghouse (or has their invlovement).
Alot of the companies used my Rail owners, are under contract, thuse they
provide what their told.


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"K" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 12:21:02 +0100, "Robin Mayes"
wrote:



Tell us what you mean by "just a signal gone wrong" and perhaps you'll be
told more...


Well, you tell us - it was reported to be a signal failure which
caused it


Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were

saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.


Money?


It cost them money to do those things which it wouldn't have cost if
they hadn't


Oh change the record, please! Perhaps the people who had brains were

working
for that wonderful private company Westinghouse Signals, or then again,
obviously not!

Well if the company which supplies the signals is no good then use a
differnt company! After all, underground systems in plenty of other
cities around the world can manage it.



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Old October 9th 03, 05:51 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

Thanks.. i work for Westinghouse Rail system

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security information. If you are not the intended recipient,
please notify the sender immediately and destroy all copies of this
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"Robin Mayes" wrote in message
.. .

"Boltar" wrote in message
om...
How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos?? If

its
affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains manually through

the
affected section? Or has more than just a signal gone wrong and they

don't
want to tell us?


Bear in mind that the Green Park - Charing Cross section contains both the
change-over from 'original' to 'new' signalling and the junction to

Charing
Cross. I don't know the full details of the failure, but suspending the
service isn't something considered lightly, despite what some people

think.

Tell us what you mean by "just a signal gone wrong" and perhaps you'll be
told more...

Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were

saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.


Money?

Still , if the powers that be there had brains they wouldn't have been

working
for LU in the first place I guess...


Oh change the record, please! Perhaps the people who had brains were

working
for that wonderful private company Westinghouse Signals, or then again,
obviously not!




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Old October 9th 03, 05:57 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

No, the Jubilee Line does not use Full ATO, all Trains are driven by
Drivers. The JL does thogh use ATP, which will be affected by a signal
Failer.
Should a signal Fail to a restrictive Aspect (Red/Off) the trainstops will
rise, and prohibit the movements of trains past them.
The Safe working of the signaling system is designed to bring things to a
safe situation in the event of a failere of any kind, most of which can be
fixed fairly quickly.

As signal failer omn its own in unlikely to be the cause of a services
suspension, but i certainetly havent seen any reports of anythig majr with
the signalling/safety systems
It is more likely that there are other factore included (LUL dont close
lines likely.. its bloody awfull trying to get trackside to do anything!!)
It all depends on what definition of "Signal failer" you use:
-- Was it a Sole Signal failer, or multiple
-- Was it a Track Circuit Failer which resulted in a signal showing a Red
-- Was it a signaliing system Comms Error
-- Was it an Error on the Signal Control Center
or any other of a wide range.

Darren Wiltshire
Westinghouse Rail Systems Ltd - An Invensys Company



"Steve Fitzgerald" ] wrote in message
...
In message , Robin May
writes

How can a signal failure on the jubilee line cause so much chaos??
If its affecting the ATO why can't they just drive the trains
manually through the affected section? Or has more than just a
signal gone wrong and they don't want to tell us?


The Jubilee doesn't have ATO, does it?


No it doesn't. Only the Victoria and Central line have it currently.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)



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Old October 9th 03, 08:49 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Jubilee line screwup

"Robin Mayes" wrote in message ...
Tell us what you mean by "just a signal gone wrong" and perhaps you'll be
told more...


That was the official LU excu^H^H reason. Given that I'm not clairvoyant
I can't tell you anymore.

Plus it would have been nice if LU had listened to what people were saying
about using Charing X as a backup terminus instead of just closing the
jubilee platforms and walling up the escalators for no good reason.


Money?


How much money would it have cost to kept the station mothballed? A bit of
maintenance now and then and some cleaning? Not a lot. Instead they decided
to spend loads of cash walling up the escalators and ripping all the fittings
down (or so I've been told, obviously I haven't seen it myself though I have
seen the wall). And its not like it was another Ongar , it was a connection to
a major london railway terminus.


Still , if the powers that be there had brains they wouldn't have been

working
for LU in the first place I guess...


Oh change the record, please! Perhaps the people who had brains were working
for that wonderful private company Westinghouse Signals, or then again,
obviously not!


What have westinghouse got to do with whether LU closed Charing X? Do try
and keep up.

B2003


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