On Sat, 25 Jul 2009, Tom Barry wrote:

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Fri, 24 Jul 2009, John B wrote:

On Jul 24, 3:34 pm, wrote:
[accurate and correct things]

Bloody hell, that's a Boltar post that I completely, 100% agree with.
Must be the end times...

I chafed a bit at 'idiot cyclists', but if you read that as saying that
cyclists who complain about bendies are idiots, rather than that all
cyclists are idiots and complain about bendies, then it's spot on.

I read it as being 'zealot cyclists who think the road should be rearranged
for their benefit',

Add 'and have mistaken ideas about what arrangement would be most to
their benefit'.

which Boris definitely is,

Yup.

leavened by old-fashioned Tory car-worship*.

Are motorismists anti-bendy?

Tom (not a cyclist, just a bloke who owns a bike and occasionally
chooses it when it's the best option).

A, a 'person on a bike', we call people like you!

* Like thinking that the car was the single biggest contributor to
women's liberation in the 20th century, a view he's expressed in my
hearing.

Oh what a card he is!

tom

--
Science Never Sleeps

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Sat, 25 Jul 2009, Tom Barry wrote:

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Fri, 24 Jul 2009, John B wrote:

On Jul 24, 3:34 pm, wrote:
[accurate and correct things]

Bloody hell, that's a Boltar post that I completely, 100% agree with.
Must be the end times...

I chafed a bit at 'idiot cyclists', but if you read that as saying
that cyclists who complain about bendies are idiots, rather than that
all cyclists are idiots and complain about bendies, then it's spot on.

I read it as being 'zealot cyclists who think the road should be
rearranged for their benefit',

Add 'and have mistaken ideas about what arrangement would be most to
their benefit'.

The dreaded 'common sense' of the selfish individual, as expressed by a)
I don't like waiting at traffic lights b) therefore I should be allowed
to ignore them c) therefore I shall arrive at my destination faster d)
therefore the world is a better place. This is often allied to a hatred
of 'experts', possibly because there's an unconscious fear of being
shown up to be a loud-mouthed know-nothing, possibly because that
implies intellectualism, which is associated with undesirable foreign
things like the French. Boris, famously, got his bottom firmly smacked
by London's businessmen over portraying Ken's spending on overseas
embassies as waste, and still maintains that adding a bend to a Citaro
makes it fit only for 'Scandinavian airports'. As I understand it,
Scandinavian airports work rather well, not that I've ever used one, so
it's just rhetorical xenophobia and wilful refusal to examine how the
modern world works. The candidate for the fearful ignorant who want to
be lied to soothingly, is our Boris.


leavened by old-fashioned Tory car-worship*.

Are motorismists anti-bendy?


Yes, certainly the more militant ones - poking a few random people on
Twitter who were applauding Boris on the bendy issue, it turned out very
quickly that they were basically motorists (or in one case a
motorcyclist) for whom a bendy is an impediment to getting about London
in their tin cans - obviously there's sa strong Clarkson
'why-should-the-poor-get-about-faster-than-me' element to this. What's
notable is that they use the same bendy myths ('not built for London's
roads', 'great in Berlin/Amsterdam/wherever, but not British') when what
they actually mean is 'I don't like 100+ people of lower social class in
a bus getting in my way when I'm driving'. Obviously 72 slow-boarding
double deckers on the 38 from November isn't really going to help them,
but it requires more faith in their self-awareness than I can currently
summon up to suppose they'll actually notice what's holding them up.

On the other hand, perhaps spending millions on bendy replacements every
year helps selfish motorists by drying up funds for the expansion of the
network? Maybe that's the plan?

Tom

On 25 July, 15:47, Tom Barry wrote:
Are motorismists anti-bendy?

Yes, certainly the more militant ones - poking a few random people on
Twitter who were applauding Boris on the bendy issue, it turned out very
quickly that they were basically motorists (or in one case a
motorcyclist) for whom a bendy is an impediment to getting about London
in their tin cans - obviously there's sa strong Clarkson
'why-should-the-poor-get-about-faster-than-me' element to this. *What's
notable is that they use the same bendy myths ('not built for London's
roads', 'great in Berlin/Amsterdam/wherever, but not British') when what
they actually mean is 'I don't like 100+ people of lower social class in
a bus getting in my way when I'm driving'.

I will never applaud the idiot Boris, nor the hardline Tories who are
hiding behind him, but the silly characterisation of the objections to
bendy buses is disingenuous.

Never mind class or party politics; what about "I don't like to have a
totally unsuitable vehicle blocking the pedestrian crossings, forcing
me to risk my life to get across the road"?

Surely we can do better than choose between a seventy-year old design
and a design that is only suitable for airports and boulevards?

What about a design of bus suitable for modern-day London? Is that so
bluddy difficult to imagine?

In message
, at
06:52:36 on Sun, 26 Jul 2009, MIG
remarked:
What about a design of bus suitable for modern-day London? Is that so
bluddy difficult to imagine?

The routemaster was perfect. I always feel somewhat "trapped" on a bus
where the driver has the power to stop me getting off (especially when
stuck in traffic and I'd rather continue on foot).
--
Roland Perry

In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:

In message
,
at 06:52:36 on Sun, 26 Jul 2009, MIG
remarked:
What about a design of bus suitable for modern-day London? Is that so
bluddy difficult to imagine?

The routemaster was perfect. I always feel somewhat "trapped" on a
bus where the driver has the power to stop me getting off
(especially when stuck in traffic and I'd rather continue on foot).

That is the key point and why Boris' vendetta against bendies has got
traction. However, the new single deckers will be no better in your regard.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:


The routemaster was perfect. I always feel somewhat "trapped" on a bus
where the driver has the power to stop me getting off (especially when
stuck in traffic and I'd rather continue on foot).

My word - bet you really hate air travel.

E.

In message
, at
21:58:17 on Mon, 27 Jul 2009, eastender
remarked:
The routemaster was perfect. I always feel somewhat "trapped" on a bus
where the driver has the power to stop me getting off (especially when
stuck in traffic and I'd rather continue on foot).

My word - bet you really hate air travel.

In case you hadn't noticed, it's not practical to get off a plane or
train and walk the rest of the way. What I object to with buses is being
stuck in a jam and trapped until the next bus stop with the clock
ticking away.

There *are* equivalents with air travel, which is being forced to wait
for a bus, and until every last person has got on, before being driven
to the airport building a hundred yards away. Of course, if it's raining
they make you walk
--
Roland Perry

On Sun, 26 Jul 2009 06:52:36 -0700 (PDT), MIG
wrote:

I will never applaud the idiot Boris, nor the hardline Tories who are
hiding behind him, but the silly characterisation of the objections to
bendy buses is disingenuous.

Never mind class or party politics; what about "I don't like to have a
totally unsuitable vehicle blocking the pedestrian crossings, forcing
me to risk my life to get across the road"?


What about it? It's emotive nonsense, no more.

On 26 July, 17:07, Bruce wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jul 2009 06:52:36 -0700 (PDT), MIG

wrote:

I will never applaud the idiot Boris, nor the hardline Tories who are
hiding behind him, but the silly characterisation of the objections to
bendy buses is disingenuous.

Never mind class or party politics; what about "I don't like to have a
totally unsuitable vehicle blocking the pedestrian crossings, forcing
me to risk my life to get across the road"?

What about it? *It's emotive nonsense, no more.

I was coming up with an alternative statement that might better
characterise genuine objections to bendys, based on something that
happens frequently.

I suggest that it sums up what far more people feel about them than
the statement about objecting to people of a "lower social class" that
I was responding to.

On Sun, 26 Jul 2009 10:17:35 -0700 (PDT), MIG
wrote:

On 26 July, 17:07, Bruce wrote:
On Sun, 26 Jul 2009 06:52:36 -0700 (PDT), MIG

wrote:

I will never applaud the idiot Boris, nor the hardline Tories who are
hiding behind him, but the silly characterisation of the objections to
bendy buses is disingenuous.

Never mind class or party politics; what about "I don't like to have a
totally unsuitable vehicle blocking the pedestrian crossings, forcing
me to risk my life to get across the road"?

What about it? *It's emotive nonsense, no more.

I was coming up with an alternative statement that might better
characterise genuine objections to bendys, based on something that
happens frequently.

I suggest that it sums up what far more people feel about them than
the statement about objecting to people of a "lower social class" that
I was responding to.


I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I thought you actually believed that
rubbish. Thanks for making it clear.