On 9 Sep, 14:00, wrote:
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 12:46:57 +0100

"Paul Scott" wrote:
250m long? That'll produce some interesting bunching of passengers down
one end. I doubt many people will spend 3 minutes walking down the length
of the platform.

Why should it? The central underground stations are double ended, (eg
Farringdon/Barbican, *Moorgate/Liverpool St) with access to the platforms

Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart then passengers
are going to have to walk those 250 metres at some point , whether its on
the platform or in a connecting tunnel.


But all the stations will have two entrances at street level. For
central London at least one of these will be an existing Underground
station with the other usually at a new site, but a couple will be
another Underground site. The distance that passengers will walk may
be considerably less than currently; consider a passenger at the rear
of a 12 car set at Liverpool Street at the moment (a 12 car class 321
formation is ~240m), they will have no choice but to walk considerably
more than 250m to get anywhere near the Underground to continue their
journey.

wrote in message ...
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 12:46:57 +0100
"Paul Scott" wrote:
250m long? That'll produce some interesting bunching of passengers down
one end. I doubt many people will spend 3 minutes walking down the
length
of the platform.

Why should it? The central underground stations are double ended, (eg
Farringdon/Barbican, Moorgate/Liverpool St) with access to the platforms

Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart then
passengers
are going to have to walk those 250 metres at some point , whether its on
the platform or in a connecting tunnel.


They are spaced a reasonable distance apart, eg Farringdon and Barbican,
Moorgate and Liverpool St, Bond St and Hanover Square, and Tottenham Court
Rd (Centre Point and Dean St)

Effectively there will be 8 entrances and ticket halls on the surface, for
the 4 central area stations...

Paul S

wrote:
On Wed, 09 Sep 2009 14:41:14 +0100
Bruce wrote:

The cost of the tunnelling machine increases quite dramatically with
tunnel diameter; the cost of the excavation and of the tunnel lining
increases approximately with the square of the excavated diameter.

*sigh* I hate to break this pre-GCSE news to you, but the area of the
shaft of a cylinder increases *linearly* with increasing radius, not
as the square of it so the cost of the lining will not go up like
that. The formula you want incidentaly is 2*pi*r*h. So before you
post anymore bull**** pretending your in-the-biz you might want to
revisit your school books first.

It's a good job you didn't write those schoolbooks, otherwise they'd say
that a one-inch diameter pipe and a five-metre diameter pipe need walls
which are the same thickness.

On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 16:06:03 +0100
"Basil Jet" wrote:
wrote:
*sigh* I hate to break this pre-GCSE news to you, but the area of the
shaft of a cylinder increases *linearly* with increasing radius, not
as the square of it so the cost of the lining will not go up like
that. The formula you want incidentaly is 2*pi*r*h. So before you
post anymore bull**** pretending your in-the-biz you might want to
revisit your school books first.

It's a good job you didn't write those schoolbooks, otherwise they'd say
that a one-inch diameter pipe and a five-metre diameter pipe need walls
which are the same thickness.

Remind me how a 10% increase in diameter size required to fit UIC gauge trains
in the tunnel in mostly self supporting london clay is going to cost so much
more because of huge extra lining thickness apparently required.

B2003

On Sep 9, 3:58*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

wrote:

Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart then
passengers are going to have to walk those 250 metres at some
point, whether its on the platform or in a connecting tunnel.

They are spaced a reasonable distance apart, eg Farringdon and Barbican,
Moorgate and Liverpool St, Bond St and Hanover Square, and Tottenham Court
Rd (Centre Point and Dean St)

Effectively there will be 8 entrances and ticket halls on the surface, for
the 4 central area stations...

Sorry Paul but Boltar doesn't do facts, he just does 'common sense'.

On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 08:26:58 -0700 (PDT)
Mizter T wrote:
On Sep 9, 3:58=A0pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

wrote:

Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart then
passengers are going to have to walk those 250 metres at some
point, whether its on the platform or in a connecting tunnel.

They are spaced a reasonable distance apart, eg Farringdon and Barbican,
Moorgate and Liverpool St, Bond St and Hanover Square, and Tottenham Cour=
t
Rd (Centre Point and Dean St)

Effectively there will be 8 entrances and ticket halls on the surface, fo=
r
the 4 central area stations...

Sorry Paul but Boltar doesn't do facts, he just does 'common sense'.

Which bit of "Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart"
did you have trouble reading? They apparently are going to be spaced a
reasonable distance apart. I didn't know this. End of discussion.

B2003

On Sep 9, 4:44*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 08:26:58 -0700 (PDT)

Mizter T wrote:

[snip]

Sorry Paul but Boltar doesn't do facts, he just does 'common sense'.

Which bit of "Unless the entrances are spaced a reasonable distance apart"
did you have trouble reading? They apparently are going to be spaced a
reasonable distance apart. I didn't know this. End of discussion.

OK, enough on this topic.

Paul Scott wrote:
"DW downunder" reply@newsgroup wrote in message
...

I'm not sure of the logic of platform doors restricting rollingstock to
dedicated Xrail only; in which case one should be planning enough loading
gauge for well-type DD cars once the eastern and western arms are cleared
through.

The expansion plan is to extend from 10 - 12 cars, the stations are 250m
long for that reason. I'd expect fixed formation trains (rather than 5+5 as
previously stated), with a Thameslink layout, ie with through gangways. But
the Crossrail tunnels are AFAICS UK gauge,


In a moment of boredom I once phoned them and asked. They confirmed UK
single-deck sized tunnels, and told me the size in metres but not in
terms of UIC ABC123+-~ gauge or whatever. No provision for double
deckers, because of cost and not being able to send the trains somewhere
else and/or sell them second-hand afterwards.

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 10:55:13 +0000 (UTC), wrote:

250m long? That'll produce some interesting bunching of passengers down
one end. I doubt many people will spend 3 minutes walking down the length
of the platform.

They don't need to, if platform access is properly planned. Go check
out the MTR in Hong Kong, or the RER in Paris. Both systems run
trains over 200 metres long.

On Wed, 9 Sep 2009 14:20:42 +0000 (UTC), wrote:
*sigh* I hate to break this pre-GCSE news to you, but the area of the
shaft of a cylinder increases *linearly* with increasing radius, not as the
square of it so the cost of the lining will not go up like that.


But as someone with experience of tunnel lining design, manufacture
and installation I can tell you with authority that the larger the
diameter of the tunnel, the thicker the lining needs to be.

So, unfortunately for ****wits like you, the cost of the lining goes
up approximately with the square of the diameter, as I said.

You are so profoundly ignorant that you don't appear to have the
slightest understanding of just how ignorant you are.

Have a(nother) dumb day. ;-)