"Peter Campbell Smith" wrote in message
...
Can anyone help me understand this (from http://www.senior-
railcard.co.uk/)?

* All Senior Railcard holders will get 1/3 off Anytime Day Travelcards
(Zones 1 - 6) for journeys starting outside the London Travelcard zones.
* Existing Railcard conditions apply and discounts will be subject to
any time restrictions that apply to the Railcard, for instance
restrictions
on travel on week day mornings in the London & South East area.

An Anytime Day Travelcard is one valid at peak (and off-peak) times,
unlike
the cheaper Off-Peak one. So if I want to travel at peak time, say
starting at 8am, the first bullet point seems to suggest I get a discount.

But the second one says that the discount is subject to the usual time
restrictions, which a "However, you won't be able to enjoy a Railcard
discount when travelling peak time Monday to Friday within London and the
South East, including all South West Trains services to and from London
Waterloo."

So that seems to say that I can buy a discounted Anytime Day Travelcard,
but I can only use it off-peak. Why would I want to do that? Is there
some part of the day that is off-peak for the London and South East
restriction, but still peak from a Travelcard point of view?

You don't get a discount on Anytime tickets in London and the South East
during the morning peak. However, some TOCs (FCC, NXEA) have introduced
evening peak restrictions on Off-peak tickets. So if you want an
out-boundary Day Travelcard on these TOCs, travelling up Off-peak but
returning in the evening peak, you need an Anytime Day Travelcard - but, as
long as your up journey is on a train on which an Off-peak ticket is valid,
you can use a Senior Railcard (or after 10 am SX, a Network Card) to get a
discounted Anytime Day Travelcard.

Isn't rail ticketing complicated?

Peter

In article ,
(Peter Masson) wrote:

"Peter Campbell Smith" wrote in message
...
Can anyone help me understand this (from
http://www.senior-railcard.co.uk/)?

* All Senior Railcard holders will get 1/3 off Anytime Day
Travelcards (Zones 1 - 6) for journeys starting outside the London
Travelcard zones.
* Existing Railcard conditions apply and discounts will be subject
to any time restrictions that apply to the Railcard, for instance
restrictions on travel on week day mornings in the London & South East
area.

An Anytime Day Travelcard is one valid at peak (and off-peak) times,
unlike the cheaper Off-Peak one. So if I want to travel at peak
time, say starting at 8am, the first bullet point seems to suggest
I get a discount.

But the second one says that the discount is subject to the usual time
restrictions, which a "However, you won't be able to enjoy a
Railcard discount when travelling peak time Monday to Friday within
London and the South East, including all South West Trains services
to and from London Waterloo."

So that seems to say that I can buy a discounted Anytime Day
Travelcard, but I can only use it off-peak. Why would I want to do
that? Is there some part of the day that is off-peak for the
London and South East restriction, but still peak from a Travelcard
point of view?

You don't get a discount on Anytime tickets in London and the South
East during the morning peak. However, some TOCs (FCC, NXEA) have
introduced evening peak restrictions on Off-peak tickets. So if you
want an out-boundary Day Travelcard on these TOCs, travelling up
Off-peak but returning in the evening peak, you need an Anytime Day
Travelcard - but, as long as your up journey is on a train on which
an Off-peak ticket is valid, you can use a Senior Railcard (or
after 10 am SX, a Network Card) to get a discounted Anytime Day
Travelcard.

Isn't rail ticketing complicated?

The joke I share with my boss is that when I get to 60 shortly I'll be
able to get to work an hour earlier. :-)

The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return within the
evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day Travelcard from Ely
which is cheaper than the anytime version. Cambridge are happy to sell
tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA and not FCC selling them.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Sep 9, 9:24*pm, wrote:

[snip]

The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return within the
evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day Travelcard from Ely
which is cheaper than the anytime version. Cambridge are happy to sell
tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA and not FCC selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

FCC's off-peak restrictions and 'zones' are all explained here, along
with a link to a map of the zones:
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk...iCmsPageId=134

"Mizter T" wrote in message
...

On Sep 9, 9:24 pm, wrote:

[snip]

The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return
within the
evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day Travelcard from
Ely
which is cheaper than the anytime version. Cambridge are happy to
sell
tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA and not FCC selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

FCC's off-peak restrictions and 'zones' are all explained here, along
with a link to a map of the zones:
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk...iCmsPageId=134

Although the FCC website is clear that the restrictions do not apply to
Ely, the fares data has not been updated correctly. In The Manual the
CDR from Ely - London has the same restriction code as Cambridge -
London. Therefore online booking engines will not show this ticket for
travel during the evening peak.

Peter Smyth

In article ,
(Peter Smyth) wrote:

"Mizter T" wrote in message
...

On Sep 9, 9:24 pm, wrote:

[snip]

The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return
within the evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day
Travelcard from Ely which is cheaper than the anytime version.
Cambridge are happy to sell tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA
and not FCC selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

FCC's off-peak restrictions and 'zones' are all explained here, along
with a link to a map of the zones:
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk...iCmsPageId=134

Although the FCC website is clear that the restrictions do not
apply to Ely, the fares data has not been updated correctly. In The
Manual the CDR from Ely - London has the same restriction code as
Cambridge - London. Therefore online booking engines will not show
this ticket for travel during the evening peak.

I think FCC's printed material has it right. The Outers timetable booklet
labels two evening peak down trains as "[Relevant] tickets are not valid
during the *evening peak* for travel *from* stations tinted in red *to*
stations between Stevenage and Waterbeach/Peterborough inclusive."

The only error there is that no departure station is tinted in red but we
all know they mean King's Cross. :-)

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On Sep 9, 9:24*pm, wrote:

[snip]

The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return within
the evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day Travelcard
from Ely which is cheaper than the anytime version. Cambridge are
happy to sell tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA and not FCC
selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

It's not clear to me that FCC themselves would sell Ely tickets.

FCC's off-peak restrictions and 'zones' are all explained here, along
with a link to a map of the zones:
http://www.firstcapitalconnect.co.uk...iCmsPageId=134

Yes, byzantine complexity, isn't it? It largely passes me by personally
because the greater peak restriction for me, most of the time, is that on
bicycles which is 16:00-19:00 and not evaded by having an Ely ticket.

A number of my fellow "gentlemen (and lady) commuters" on the 10:20 in the
mornings have Bromptons so do need the Ely ruse from time to time.
Fascinating group, we are, mostly academics but not by all means all. I
think the most glamorous (occupation-wise) is a diamond dealer. :-)

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Sep 10, 12:51*am, wrote:
The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return within
the evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day Travelcard
from Ely which is cheaper than the anytime version. Cambridge are
happy to sell tickets from Ely, seeing as it's NXEA and not FCC
selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

It's not clear to me that FCC themselves would sell Ely tickets.

They're legally obliged to, if you ask for one.

--
John Band
john at johnband dot org
www.johnband.org

In article
,
(John B) wrote:

On Sep 10, 12:51*am, wrote:
The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return
within the evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day
Travelcard from Ely which is cheaper than the anytime version.
Cambridge are happy to sell tickets from Ely, seeing as it's
NXEA and not FCC selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

It's not clear to me that FCC themselves would sell Ely tickets.

They're legally obliged to, if you ask for one.

Including to someone not starting at Ely, you mean? I didn't think that
was so clear-cut. It's pretty academic as far as Cambridge and Ely are
concerned (though at busy times FCC staff do sell tickets at Cambridge
from portable machines). Local stations towards Royston might be more
interesting.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote in message
...
In article
,
(John B) wrote:

On Sep 10, 12:51 am, wrote:
The standard FCC ruse at Cambridge for those who want to return
within the evening peak is the buy an Off-Peak Day Return or Day
Travelcard from Ely which is cheaper than the anytime version.
Cambridge are happy to sell tickets from Ely, seeing as it's
NXEA and not FCC selling them.

Interesting - thanks for that, that's one to remember. For those not
clued up on these things (and I had to check!), FCC created the
concept of "zones A to E" so as to apply their off-peak evening
restrictions - Ely is in zone E whilst Cambridge is in zone D - and
yes, return journeys to zone E are exempt from the restrictions,
whilst zone D isn't.

It's not clear to me that FCC themselves would sell Ely tickets.

They're legally obliged to, if you ask for one.

Including to someone not starting at Ely, you mean? I didn't think that
was so clear-cut.

It is. TOCs were told that they must abandon any previous policy of
refusing such requests and were obliged to sell any NR ticket from A to B,
regardless of where A and B are. AIUI they are not obliged to sell PTE
tickets out of area.

tim