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Old June 4th 11, 07:31 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries

Dear all

I need to pick brains urgently re impact of the Olympics and their
Travel Plan. I'm concerned that we may find travel to wok and
deliveries disrupted. Here's the detail:

We are based at Cherry Garden Pier in Bermondsey. That's off Jamaica
Road, which is part of the Olympic Road Network.

We are committed to intensifying our Westminster-Tower-Greenwich
service during the Olympics.

That means about 70-80 people coming in to work at Bermondsey between
0600 and 0900 and more at intervals throughout the day. Departures run
from about 1600 to 2400.

We also have deliveries including spares and supplies, perishables and
other food and drink, which typically arrive 0800-1100 - and of course
all the rubbish from the boats [thousands of passengers], pier and
offices is collected daily.

I'm told that there is a risk of delay to any bus service which touches
the Olympic Road Network, and delays to 'non-Oly travellers' using the
Jubilee and rail routes., all of which are well-used by staff.

I'm planning a survey to find out staff travel routes etc and logging
delivery times/volumes. And of course talking to the local council /
TfL etc. What else?

Any / all suggestions welcome

Ken


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Old June 4th 11, 04:08 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries

Thanks, Paul

I do hope you're right. My worry is that Jamaica Road is the
alternative to the A2 which is already very busy, which may make Olys
switch, potentially holding up deliveries and buses.

But the real area of concern is public transport. There are large
numbers of us who use the JLE and various rail and Underground routes.
Personally I will come in from Woolwich by Clippers to either Greenland
or London Bridge - or DLR to Shadwell and then ELLX to Rotherhithe,
which is walking distance when I'm feeling well.

We must do our contingency planning well in advance.

Ken

On 2011-06-04 12:41:54 +0100, Paul Terry said:

In message , lid writes

We are based at Cherry Garden Pier in Bermondsey. That's off Jamaica
Road, which is part of the Olympic Road Network.


Jamaica Road is specified as an alternative route: "Only used if there
is a problem on other routes – minimal traffic management measures
anticipated".

I therefore doubt that you will see much disruption unless something
goes badly wrong with the main road network. The Jubilee Line, though,
is a different matter - it could well struggle. I'd look at
alternatives such as using the ELLX to Rotherhithe and then getting the
C10 or 381 to Jamaica Road.



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Old June 5th 11, 04:49 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries


"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 4 Jun 2011 08:31:26 +0100, bearded wrote:

Dear all

I need to pick brains urgently re impact of the Olympics and their
Travel Plan. I'm concerned that we may find travel to wok and
deliveries disrupted. Here's the detail:

We are based at Cherry Garden Pier in Bermondsey. That's off Jamaica
Road, which is part of the Olympic Road Network.

We are committed to intensifying our Westminster-Tower-Greenwich
service during the Olympics.

That means about 70-80 people coming in to work at Bermondsey between
0600 and 0900 and more at intervals throughout the day. Departures run
from about 1600 to 2400.


The Olympic events are not scheduled to start at a time which will
affect AM peak travel flows.


Many events do start at 9 am. This will require arrivals at mainline London
stations about 8.00. This looks to me to be well inside the normal AM
commute time. The idea that these are fringe events that will not attract
many visitors is silly. If (as hoped) all of the events sell out there will
be as many people travelling to these sessions as any other and as they are
"morining only" sessions most people will be wanting to arrive at the start.


Therefore people arriving in the time
window you state should be fine. Note also that the Olympics coincide
with the main school holidays so peak demand levels will be lower.

The biggest issues will be around the off peak, PM peak plus a third
peak in the evening when people start leaving Olympic events. This is
one of the reasons for the later finish to tube and some train
services - to get people away from venues.


I don't understand this "night" peak.

AIUI about 6 million people create the normal London peak flows. Even if
all of the Olympic venues finish late it isn't going to be more than
250,000, a fraction of the normal peak so why's it a problem?

tim




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Old June 5th 11, 05:52 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries

In message , at 17:49:58 on Sun, 5 Jun
2011, tim.... remarked:

Many events do start at 9 am. This will require arrivals at mainline London
stations about 8.00.


Which means departures from much of the country at 6am... and
unavailable departures before that from the rest.

I don't understand this "night" peak.

AIUI about 6 million people create the normal London peak flows. Even if
all of the Olympic venues finish late it isn't going to be more than
250,000, a fraction of the normal peak so why's it a problem?


Because many Intercity routes shut down too early. On the ECML, the last
train to Newcastle is 10pm, and the next and last train (also serving
intermediate stations of course) is 11.30pm to Leeds.

People trying to get to those trains from an event typically finishing
at 10pm in the Olympic Park would miss the Newcastle one and all be
shoehorned on the Leeds one.

I'm sure the timings are similar for many other routes, which will often
be further from the Park than Kings Cross.

The railways have another solution (on top of the extra late trains) -
make tickets transferable to the morning of the next day. What I haven't
seen is any idea where those passengers will spend the night.
--
Roland Perry
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Old June 6th 11, 02:21 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries



"Roland Perry" wrote in message ...

In message , at 17:49:58 on Sun, 5 Jun
2011, tim.... remarked:

Many events do start at 9 am. This will require arrivals at mainline
London
stations about 8.00.


Which means departures from much of the country at 6am... and
unavailable departures before that from the rest.

I don't understand this "night" peak.

AIUI about 6 million people create the normal London peak flows. Even if
all of the Olympic venues finish late it isn't going to be more than
250,000, a fraction of the normal peak so why's it a problem?


Because many Intercity routes shut down too early. On the ECML, the last
train to Newcastle is 10pm, and the next and last train (also serving
intermediate stations of course) is 11.30pm to Leeds.

People trying to get to those trains from an event typically finishing
at 10pm in the Olympic Park would miss the Newcastle one and all be
shoehorned on the Leeds one.

I'm sure the timings are similar for many other routes, which will often
be further from the Park than Kings Cross.

The railways have another solution (on top of the extra late trains) -
make tickets transferable to the morning of the next day. What I haven't
seen is any idea where those passengers will spend the night.
--
Roland Perry


If I can add some experience from the Sydney Olympics. Before the event
there was widespread alarm about the disruption. However things worked out
rather well, if fact people now look back on that period with fondness.
Trains ran on time and everything worked. The effort put in to make it work
was enormous and the city has never recovered- so much was spent that 10
years later we are still suffering from the money spend on those 14 days.

I expect London and the Organising committee will do just as good a job.
There was very little disruption because double or three times the transport
that was needed was provided, and peak hours services (trains and bus) ran
24 hrs per day for the games period.
Yes I think late night services will be organised, as someone mentioned a
lot of events finish late, 10 to 11pm and people are not ready to go home so
eating venues and party venues are just commencing. (hence the 24 hrs
services). The city will really become a 24 hr city and in Sydney it not
unusual to see peak hour crowds at 3 am.
A lot of business did close down for the period and school holidays were
rearranged to coincide, we even had daylight saving (in our winter) to help
with the safe movement of people.

Have a fun games.

Peter
Sydney


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Old June 6th 11, 09:08 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries

In message , tim....
writes

If (as hoped) all of the events sell out there will
be as many people travelling to these sessions as any other


No there won't. With the exception of the 9th August, any events
starting before 10am are in much smaller venues than the main Olympic
Stadium.
--
Paul Terry
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Old June 6th 11, 12:21 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries


"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message , at 17:49:58 on Sun, 5 Jun
2011, tim.... remarked:

Many events do start at 9 am. This will require arrivals at mainline
London
stations about 8.00.


Which means departures from much of the country at 6am... and unavailable
departures before that from the rest.

I don't understand this "night" peak.

AIUI about 6 million people create the normal London peak flows. Even if
all of the Olympic venues finish late it isn't going to be more than
250,000, a fraction of the normal peak so why's it a problem?


Because many Intercity routes shut down too early.


Oh I see the need for extra trains.

It's any justification in calling it a "peak" flow that I can't see!

It just a later last train as is normal on New Year's eve. No-one calls
that a third peak.

tim





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Old June 6th 11, 01:49 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Olympic impact on commuters and deliveries - serious worries

In message , at 13:21:40 on Mon, 6 Jun
2011, tim.... remarked:
I don't understand this "night" peak.

AIUI about 6 million people create the normal London peak flows. Even if
all of the Olympic venues finish late it isn't going to be more than
250,000, a fraction of the normal peak so why's it a problem?


Because many Intercity routes shut down too early.


Oh I see the need for extra trains.

It's any justification in calling it a "peak" flow that I can't see!


It's because everyone will be leaving the Olympic venues at pretty much
the same time, creating a genuine "peak" flow at about 11pm, it having
been quiet since maybe 8pm.

It just a later last train as is normal on New Year's eve. No-one calls
that a third peak.


I hope it's more than just one extra train! For one thing, as in my
examples up thread, they need to be taking people further from London
than is traditional on a train starting at 9pm+ (I recall when the last
train home to Westbury from Paddington was a party-pooping 8.30pm, which
isn't so much an issue of Westbury's distance from London (approx 80
minutes) but because it was going to Plymouth and was expected to turn
into a pumpkin at midnight.
--
Roland Perry


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