I heard on LBC this morning that apparently the toll gates will be gone by 2014
and a "free flow" system will be implemented. How does this work? Is everyone
who every uses the bridge going to have to by an electronic tag or will they
just do it by number plate recognition and send you a bill for 2 quid in the
post? Or will they use ANPR to send you a fine of 100 quid if you don't
buy a tag (no doubt expensive) and just drive through?

Will probably be a free for all for foreign registered vehicles and trucks.

B2003

wrote in message
...
I heard on LBC this morning that apparently the toll gates will be gone by
2014
and a "free flow" system will be implemented. How does this work? Is
everyone
who every uses the bridge going to have to by an electronic tag or will
they
just do it by number plate recognition and send you a bill for 2 quid in
the
post? Or will they use ANPR to send you a fine of 100 quid if you don't
buy a tag (no doubt expensive) and just drive through?

Will probably be a free for all for foreign registered vehicles and
trucks.

I think that this is new territory for everybody and that the system of
collecting is almost certainly going to evolve over time. Other countries
are experimenting with free flow charging and no one system has proved to be
entirely satisfactory. Most seem to work on a pre-payment "honesty" basis
with police enforcement and fines if they catch you where you haven't paid
to be, but that isn't going to work here.

It will have to be enforced by ANPR but there is also going to have to be a
mechanism for people to "automatically" pay without them having to have a
tag in the car.

I suspect that some sort of pre-registration of a payment method, as is now
available for the congestion charge, will have to be used for people who use
the crossing many times a year (but not enough to "invest" in a tag), but
that's not going to work for the once-in-a-lifetime users.

It would help, of course, if all of the tolling systems used the same method
so that once registered, for example, for auto payment of the congestion
charge you automatically get registered for the Dartford crossing (and the
Severn crossing, the Humber bridge, Mersey tunnels, etc, etc), but it will
be ages before the various agencies can agree upon that.

Personally, I think that "Europe" should get involved in developing a common
system so that once I am registered in the UK I can freely drive on, for
example, an Austrian Autobahn without having to worry about where to buy a
little sticker (or even: having to find out if I need to buy a little
sticker in the first place!).

On the down side of this, this will mean that there is far less of a barrier
to entry for new charges to be introduced, as if everybody is already
registered with a nationwide auto-payment system, there will be no need to
put one in place for this new piece of road that you are considering
building :-(.

As to foreigners, this is going to be an issue of HMG's willingness to
enforce. There is already a mechanism in place where foreigners can be
billed in they own country by a local agency (who get to keep the money) and
many other countries do indeed do this for Brits (and others) using their
auto tolled roads, but HMG doesn't seem to be interested in doing this
(BICBW).

Perhaps we could start an online petition to ensure that whatever is done on
the Crossing foreigners don't "get away with it"!

tim

On 08/10/2012 10:52, tim..... wrote:

wrote in message
...
I heard on LBC this morning that apparently the toll gates will be gone
by 2014
and a "free flow" system will be implemented. How does this work? Is
everyone
who every uses the bridge going to have to by an electronic tag or will they
just do it by number plate recognition and send you a bill for 2 quid in the
post? Or will they use ANPR to send you a fine of 100 quid if you don't
buy a tag (no doubt expensive) and just drive through?

Will probably be a free for all for foreign registered vehicles and trucks.

I think that this is new territory for everybody and that the system of
collecting is almost certainly going to evolve over time. Other countries
are experimenting with free flow charging and no one system has proved to
be entirely satisfactory.

I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over 15
pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20 pounds, and
pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol stations based
on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro Car Parks.

On Mon, 08 Oct 2012 11:19:20 +0100
Nick Finnigan wrote:
I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over 15
pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20 pounds, and
pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol stations based
on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro Car Parks.

What happens if you take a UK reg vehicle over there and don't pay - do they
catch up with you?

B2003

On 08/10/2012 11:51, d wrote:
On Mon, 08 Oct 2012 11:19:20 +0100
Nick Finnigan wrote:
I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over 15
pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20 pounds, and
pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol stations based
on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro Car Parks.

What happens if you take a UK reg vehicle over there and don't pay - do they
catch up with you?

ECP send you an invoice.

On Mon, 08 Oct 2012 12:06:51 +0100
Nick Finnigan wrote:
On 08/10/2012 11:51, d wrote:
On Mon, 08 Oct 2012 11:19:20 +0100
Nick Finnigan wrote:
I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over 15
pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20 pounds, and
pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol stations based
on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro Car Parks.

What happens if you take a UK reg vehicle over there and don't pay - do they
catch up with you?

ECP send you an invoice.

Are they a UK company? If not what can they do if you don't pay?

B2003

On 08/10/2012 11:19, Nick Finnigan wrote:
On 08/10/2012 10:52, tim..... wrote:

wrote in message
...
I heard on LBC this morning that apparently the toll gates will be gone
by 2014
and a "free flow" system will be implemented. How does this work? Is
everyone
who every uses the bridge going to have to by an electronic tag or
will they
just do it by number plate recognition and send you a bill for 2 quid
in the
post? Or will they use ANPR to send you a fine of 100 quid if you don't
buy a tag (no doubt expensive) and just drive through?

Will probably be a free for all for foreign registered vehicles and
trucks.

I think that this is new territory for everybody and that the system of
collecting is almost certainly going to evolve over time. Other
countries
are experimenting with free flow charging and no one system has proved to
be entirely satisfactory.

I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over
15 pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20
pounds, and pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol
stations based on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro
Car Parks.

You can also pay online.

"Nick Finnigan" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 08/10/2012 10:52, tim..... wrote:

wrote in message
...
I heard on LBC this morning that apparently the toll gates will be gone
by 2014
and a "free flow" system will be implemented. How does this work? Is
everyone
who every uses the bridge going to have to by an electronic tag or will
they
just do it by number plate recognition and send you a bill for 2 quid in
the
post? Or will they use ANPR to send you a fine of 100 quid if you don't
buy a tag (no doubt expensive) and just drive through?

Will probably be a free for all for foreign registered vehicles and
trucks.

I think that this is new territory for everybody and that the system of
collecting is almost certainly going to evolve over time. Other
countries
are experimenting with free flow charging and no one system has proved to
be entirely satisfactory.

I'd say Norway had got beyond the experimental stage (and charge over 15
pounds for the Finnøy Tunnel). Apparently you buy a tag for 20 pounds, and
pre-load it using a credit card. Visitors can pay at petrol stations based
on ANPR within 3 days, or wait for an invoice from Euro Car Parks.

I didn't mean that individual countries were experimenting, I meant that
each county has a different system, which they think is right for their
current circumstances, but which may not be right going forwards.

I note that the Norwegian system does not do away with manual payments,
which doesn't make it suitable as a solution where that is required.

tim

On Mon, 8 Oct 2012 10:52:05 +0100, tim..... wrote:
It would help, of course, if all of the tolling systems used the same method
so that once registered, for example, for auto payment of the congestion
charge you automatically get registered for the Dartford crossing (and the
Severn crossing, the Humber bridge, Mersey tunnels, etc, etc), but it will
be ages before the various agencies can agree upon that.

Personally, I think that "Europe" should get involved in developing a common
system so that once I am registered in the UK I can freely drive on, for
example, an Austrian Autobahn without having to worry about where to buy a
little sticker (or even: having to find out if I need to buy a little
sticker in the first place!).

Something like the European Electronic Toll Service? There is a little
about it at http://www.highways.gov.uk/our-road-...olling-service

"David Walters" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 8 Oct 2012 10:52:05 +0100, tim.....
wrote:
It would help, of course, if all of the tolling systems used the same
method
so that once registered, for example, for auto payment of the congestion
charge you automatically get registered for the Dartford crossing (and
the
Severn crossing, the Humber bridge, Mersey tunnels, etc, etc), but it
will
be ages before the various agencies can agree upon that.

Personally, I think that "Europe" should get involved in developing a
common
system so that once I am registered in the UK I can freely drive on, for
example, an Austrian Autobahn without having to worry about where to buy
a
little sticker (or even: having to find out if I need to buy a little
sticker in the first place!).

Something like the European Electronic Toll Service? There is a little
about it at
http://www.highways.gov.uk/our-road-...olling-service


Um no!

It's the "one piece of electronic equipment " bit that fails my expectation

I was thinking of a system with zero pieces of electronic equipment (in the
car).

tim