On 21/06/2015 10:43, wrote:

ICBW but wasn't one of the continental test tracks given a fourth rail
to test some tube stock? But it could have been on a circuit with no
overhead.

Are you thinking of the third rail EMU which went to Wildenrath?

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

Roland Perry wrote:
In message -septembe
r.org, at 21:03:03 on Sat, 20 Jun 2015, Recliner remarked:
I've seen the tube trains under test at Old Dalby (last time I drove up
to the East Midlands a month ago). Unfortunately there wasn't anywhere
convenient for me to stop to take a photo.

The other odd thing about the line is the OHL a long way from any
electrified service lines. https://goo.gl/maps/Q70Uo

I think it's the only section of track, anywhere, with both fourth rail and
overhead electrification.

Might they perhaps have some short stretches at the factory in Derby too?

Yes, Chris Dixon correctly pointed that out.

On 20.06.15 22:03, Recliner wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 17:31:34 on Sat, 20 Jun 2015,
" remarked:
I wonder if they employ trippers on that stretch or if they fit the test trains with AWS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29110845

I've seen the tube trains under test at Old Dalby (last time I drove up
to the East Midlands a month ago). Unfortunately there wasn't anywhere
convenient for me to stop to take a photo.

The other odd thing about the line is the OHL a long way from any
electrified service lines. https://goo.gl/maps/Q70Uo

I think it's the only section of track, anywhere, with both fourth rail and
overhead electrification. I think that it's currently being used for both S
stock and IEP testing. Old Dalby is also where the currently surplus S7
stick waiting to enter service is being stored.

One unusual location for ex-LU stock the BBC missed is Long Marston:
http://www.railtechnologymagazine.co...e-this-anymore

It looks like they are simply stripping out everything on the D-78s, and
keeping only the bodies. They did a similar thing with the Soviet
railcars on the Prague Metro.

" wrote:
On 20.06.15 22:03, Recliner wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 17:31:34 on Sat, 20 Jun 2015,
" remarked:
I wonder if they employ trippers on that stretch or if they fit the
test trains with AWS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29110845

I've seen the tube trains under test at Old Dalby (last time I drove up
to the East Midlands a month ago). Unfortunately there wasn't anywhere
convenient for me to stop to take a photo.

The other odd thing about the line is the OHL a long way from any
electrified service lines. https://goo.gl/maps/Q70Uo

I think it's the only section of track, anywhere, with both fourth rail and
overhead electrification. I think that it's currently being used for both S
stock and IEP testing. Old Dalby is also where the currently surplus S7
stick waiting to enter service is being stored.

One unusual location for ex-LU stock the BBC missed is Long Marston:
http://www.railtechnologymagazine.co...e-this-anymore

It looks like they are simply stripping out everything on the D-78s, and
keeping only the bodies. They did a similar thing with the Soviet
railcars on the Prague Metro.

They're keeping the aluminium bodies and modern bogies with motors. It's
possible that some of the interior fittings will be retained, but that's
the buyer's choice. Apart from the traction motors, all the electrics will
be new, as will, of course, the power rafts. The cab ends are also being
strengthened for main line use.

With the new cab ends, probably new interiors, new diesel noise, two or
three car lengths and all-new liveries, they won't be recognisable as
ex-District line trains.

On 21.06.15 12:07, Recliner wrote:
" wrote:
On 20.06.15 22:03, Recliner wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 17:31:34 on Sat, 20 Jun 2015,
" remarked:
I wonder if they employ trippers on that stretch or if they fit the
test trains with AWS.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29110845

I've seen the tube trains under test at Old Dalby (last time I drove up
to the East Midlands a month ago). Unfortunately there wasn't anywhere
convenient for me to stop to take a photo.

The other odd thing about the line is the OHL a long way from any
electrified service lines. https://goo.gl/maps/Q70Uo

I think it's the only section of track, anywhere, with both fourth rail and
overhead electrification. I think that it's currently being used for both S
stock and IEP testing. Old Dalby is also where the currently surplus S7
stick waiting to enter service is being stored.

One unusual location for ex-LU stock the BBC missed is Long Marston:
http://www.railtechnologymagazine.co...e-this-anymore

It looks like they are simply stripping out everything on the D-78s, and
keeping only the bodies. They did a similar thing with the Soviet
railcars on the Prague Metro.

They're keeping the aluminium bodies and modern bogies with motors. It's
possible that some of the interior fittings will be retained, but that's
the buyer's choice. Apart from the traction motors, all the electrics will
be new, as will, of course, the power rafts. The cab ends are also being
strengthened for main line use.

With the new cab ends, probably new interiors, new diesel noise, two or
three car lengths and all-new liveries, they won't be recognisable as
ex-District line trains.

I saw a similar situation in Prague. I imgaine that people here would be
able to notice certain things.

Were else could LUL railcars find potential revenue use outside of the
network in London, besides where the D-78s are going and the Isle of
Wight? Is there any place up for consideration?

BTW, I've seen that the DK4s in Pyongyang have found use as regional
rail trains. Are there any other such instances in the world?

wrote:
On Sun, 21 Jun 2015 09:59:33 +0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On Sat, 20 Jun 2015 21:03:03 +0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

ICBW but wasn't one of the continental test tracks given a fourth rail
to test some tube stock? But it could have been on a circuit with no
overhead.

Which stock would that be? The only tube trains built outside the UK for a
very long time would be the extra Jubilee line 1996 stock

That was probably the stock I was thinking of but as I said ICBW ,
The suggestion by Arthur Figgis that the third rail laid at
Wildenrath was what seeded the idea is most likely.


but I don't know
if that was put on an Italian test track. With such a small order (four
train sets and 59 trailer cars), I doubt that it was worth equipping an
Italian track with a fourth rail electrification system.

Wasn't the stock both original and later build constructed in Spain?
Not sure if was actually built complete abroad or if it was bodies
fitted out later like the 95 stock.

The original orders were assembled by GEC-Alsthom in Washwood Heath (the
old Met Cam works). By the time of the top-up order, that plant had closed,
so they were built by Alstom, I thought in Savigliano, Italy, like the
extra Pendolino order. But maybe they were assembled in Spain and I was
getting confused with the Pendolino order?

Wherever it was can soon expect another top-up order for updated 95TS
trains for the Northern and Jubilee lines.

Recliner wrote:

Chris J Dixon wrote:

How about this then:

Bombardier test track at Derby.

Yes, you're right, I'd forgotten that one. Incidentally, that link doesn't
take me to it, but I found this YouTube video:
http://youtu.be/oYoHGSdcQpE

My fault, looks like my clipboard had not refreshed, and your
link was exactly what I had intended to post.

For some time my office was within about 40 metres of that track.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On Sun, 21 Jun 2015 23:38:18 +0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
The original orders were assembled by GEC-Alsthom in Washwood Heath (the
old Met Cam works). By the time of the top-up order, that plant had closed,
so they were built by Alstom, I thought in Savigliano, Italy, like the
extra Pendolino order. But maybe they were assembled in Spain and I was
getting confused with the Pendolino order?

Wherever it was can soon expect another top-up order for updated 95TS
trains for the Northern and Jubilee lines.

I imagine a few new trains will be needed for the new battersea branch
on the northern, but why will the jubilee need new trains? The service
is pretty frequent already, I can't see how they'll squeeze any more trains
onto the line.

--
Spud

On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 10:54:24 +0100
Recliner wrote:
The Northern needs five more for the Battersea extension plus up to 45
more to increase frequencies to up to 30 tph on the rest of the line.

Incidentally, Battersea will run as an extension of the Charing Cross
route, not as a separate branch.

https://www.tfl.gov.uk/info-for/medi...lu-to-source-a
ditional-tube-trains

Thats a lot of trains. I wonder if they'll keep essentially the same train
or will go for something all new under the skin? Also couldn't do any harm
to make the windows larger.

--
Spud

wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 10:54:24 +0100
Recliner wrote:
The Northern needs five more for the Battersea extension plus up to 45
more to increase frequencies to up to 30 tph on the rest of the line.

Incidentally, Battersea will run as an extension of the Charing Cross
route, not as a separate branch.

https://www.tfl.gov.uk/info-for/medi...lu-to-source-a
ditional-tube-trains

Thats a lot of trains. I wonder if they'll keep essentially the same train
or will go for something all new under the skin? Also couldn't do any harm
to make the windows larger.

Yes, it is a surprisingly large order. In fact, if they go for the full
number, it's more than the total 2009 TS Victoria line stock.

There's obviously some constraints on the design: the doors must be in the
same position as on the current Victoria line stock, and they must be
available in six and seven car lengths for the two lines. One possibility
might be to cascade existing Northern line 95 TS to the Jubilee,
re-marshalled as seven-car units, with all the new trains going to the
Northern Line, so they're kept together (or vice versa). The 95TS isn't
compatible with the older technology 96TS Jubilee line stock, but they look
almost the same and the cars are the same size. So one train must be made
up of one type or the other card, but trains of both type should be able to
mix on a line.

I would think that with such a large order, the new trains will have newer
technology than the existing stock, which will be about 25 years older. But
TfL may want them to look the same for passengers, so the windows may be
the same. The performance will probably also be the same as they will have
to run together on the same line, unless they're all put on one branch of
the Northern line (see below).

Alstom must be the favourite to win the order, but I assume there will have
to be a competitive tender, so Bombardier, say, could win. Maybe it'll be a
variant of your favourite thick-walled 2009 stock?

And if they go ahead with the proposal to split the Northern into two
separate lines, we could imagine all of this new fleet being on one of
those branches, the 95TS on the other branch, and the Jubilee having a mix
of its older 96TS and cascaded 95TS from the Northern.