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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and
unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote:
.... Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...). I'd like to know the travelling times between King's Cross and Green Park on the Piccadilly Line and the Victoria Line. I'll bet it's about 10 minutes difference. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 04:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp wrote: On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote: .... Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...). I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On 2017\09\19 12:04, Offramp wrote:
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote: ... Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...). I'd like to know the travelling times between King's Cross and Green Park on the Piccadilly Line and the Victoria Line. I'll bet it's about 10 minutes difference. The working timetables are all online at https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables (it uses the TfL alphabet, in which Piccadilly comes before Northern) Krapy Rubsnif to Kings Cross: Vic = 310 seconds N/B or 315 seconds S/B Picc = 7.5 minutes N/B or 8 minutes S/B About 2.5 minutes difference KX to Green Park: Vic = 400 seconds N/B or 390 seconds S/B Picc = 10 minutes N/B or 9.5 minutes S/B About 3.5 minutes difference |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\09\19 14:13, Robin wrote: On 19/09/2017 12:14, wrote: On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 04:04:43 -0700 (PDT) Offramp wrote: On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, Â* wrote: .... Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...). I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The next nearest was closed in 1994, though that one was always an anachronism. I think that Covent Garden station has always been reasonably well used, unlike the three central London Piccadilly line stations (one on Piccadilly itself) that were closed early in the line's life. Of those three, York Road might do much better if it reopened, but I'd say that was highly unlikely, because of the high cost, slowing the line down, and probably failing to attract many net new customers. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at
14:13:20 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Robin remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, Unlike the rest of the country, are London business rates kept by the local authority, or are they just general revenue kept by the Treasury? add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message
-sept ember.org, at 14:05:01 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Roland Perry wrote:
In message -sept ember.org, at 14:05:01 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 19:49:53 on Tue, 19
Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 19:49:53 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? The Ongar branch closed on the same day as Aldwych. They could well have closed Covent Garden on the same day, had there been a desire to do so. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
wrote:
Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? Here's an interesting article about how the Victoria line, with new automatic trains and signalling, achieves its very high frequency: https://www.londonreconnections.com/2017/ninety-second-railway-making-victoria-frequent-metro-world/ Maybe, when the Piccadilly line also has state of the art trains and signalling, it will do the same. But it will still have a route with curvier tunnels and more stops than the much newer Victoria line, opened more than 60 years later. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
wrote:
In article , (Recliner) wrote: Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 19:49:53 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum _ wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? The Ongar branch closed on the same day as Aldwych. They could well have closed Covent Garden on the same day, had there been a desire to do so. And if the government was willing after a formal closure application to allow it to do so. Covent Garden was far busier than Aldwych/Ongar by 1994. Exactly. It may be close to Leicester Square station underground, but Covent Garden station is nevertheless a busy station in its own right. And the surface route between them isn't direct or obvious. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 00:45:22 GMT, Recliner
wrote: Exactly. It may be close to Leicester Square station underground, but Covent Garden station is nevertheless a busy station in its own right. And the surface route between them isn't direct or obvious. It looks pretty straight on Google maps along Cranbourn St and Long Acre, but I don't think I have walked that way when I've been in London. -- jhk |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 21:08:35 on Tue, 19
Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? The Ongar branch closed on the same day as Aldwych. They could well have closed Covent Garden on the same day, had there been a desire to do so. The Ongar branch is the same kind of completely different closure as the 'Aldwych Branch'. There's no synergy whatsoever with closing just one intermediate station on a line that's still operating fully. -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 00:45:22 on Wed, 20
Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: wrote: In article , (Recliner) wrote: Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 19:49:53 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum _ wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? The Ongar branch closed on the same day as Aldwych. They could well have closed Covent Garden on the same day, had there been a desire to do so. And if the government was willing after a formal closure application to allow it to do so. Covent Garden was far busier than Aldwych/Ongar by 1994. Exactly. It may be close to Leicester Square station underground, but Covent Garden station is nevertheless a busy station in its own right. The suggestion was that it might have closed because it was *too* busy. In fact I think it does get turned into an arrivals-only station sometimes. And the surface route between them isn't direct or obvious. Nonsense! Not only is it a straight and direct route, there's signage right outside the station entrance: https://goo.gl/maps/cpuGjitWyNt -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 08:20:32 on
Wed, 20 Sep 2017, Jarle Hammen Knudsen remarked: Exactly. It may be close to Leicester Square station underground, but Covent Garden station is nevertheless a busy station in its own right. And the surface route between them isn't direct or obvious. It looks pretty straight on Google maps along Cranbourn St and Long Acre, but I don't think I have walked that way when I've been in London. Perhaps because of the talcum powder? Joking apart, I've walked down there a hundred times, and that's without ever having lived or worked in the vicinity. -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 00:33:23 GMT
Recliner wrote: wrote: Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? Here's an interesting article about how the Victoria line, with new automatic trains and signalling, achieves its very high frequency: https://www.londonreconnections.com/...aking-victoria frequent-metro-world/ Maybe, when the Piccadilly line also has state of the art trains and signalling, it will do the same. But it will still have a route with curvier tunnels and more stops than the much newer Victoria line, opened more than 60 years later. The picc only has sharp curves at holborn and kensington. The rest of the line is pretty straight with a long no stopping section between hammersmith and acton that should in theory allow drivers to catch up if they're running late. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On 19/09/2017 18:28, wrote:
In article , (Roland Perry) wrote: In message , at 14:13:20 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Robin remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, Unlike the rest of the country, are London business rates kept by the local authority, or are they just general revenue kept by the Treasury? Not really, though it does sort of come back to local authorities now. Without wanting to get into a Boris-style battle, since 2013 it is not all paid over gross to central government. Broadly, LAs handed over half and kept half, but the half they keep is subject to various reductions adjustments (levies? circumcisions?) and additions. A government Bill in 2016 proposed 100 percent retention but that fell with the General Election. -- Robin reply-to address is (intended to be) valid |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
wrote:
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 00:33:23 GMT Recliner wrote: wrote: Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? Here's an interesting article about how the Victoria line, with new automatic trains and signalling, achieves its very high frequency: https://www.londonreconnections.com/...aking-victoria frequent-metro-world/ Maybe, when the Piccadilly line also has state of the art trains and signalling, it will do the same. But it will still have a route with curvier tunnels and more stops than the much newer Victoria line, opened more than 60 years later. The picc only has sharp curves at holborn and kensington. The rest of the line is pretty straight with a long no stopping section between hammersmith and acton that should in theory allow drivers to catch up if they're running late. Not really. They're scheduled to run fast on that section anyway, and the old signalling doesn't allow them to run closer. Mostly they run slower than they theoretically could on that section because they're following another train. And they may slow down to a crawl towards Hammersmith or Acton Town as the platform is still occupied by the previous train (that happened to me yesterday). So there's little or no scope to catch up if "they're running late". |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
wrote on 20 Sep 2017 at 09:41 ...
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 00:33:23 GMT Recliner wrote: wrote: Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? Here's an interesting article about how the Victoria line, with new automatic trains and signalling, achieves its very high frequency: https://www.londonreconnections.com/...aking-victoria frequent-metro-world/ Maybe, when the Piccadilly line also has state of the art trains and signalling, it will do the same. But it will still have a route with curvier tunnels and more stops than the much newer Victoria line, opened more than 60 years later. The picc only has sharp curves at holborn and kensington. The rest of the line is pretty straight with a long no stopping section between hammersmith and acton that should in theory allow drivers to catch up if they're running late. How do you catch up if you're normally running at the 45mph limit for that section? In practice, if the service is running late, the westbound Picc trains often queue up to get into Acton Town. It's ironic that at a 4-platform station they manage to make it a bottleneck by changing drivers there and not always using the extra platform. -- Richard J. (to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address) |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Richard J. wrote:
wrote on 20 Sep 2017 at 09:41 ... On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 00:33:23 GMT Recliner wrote: wrote: Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes the rush hour? Trains? Drivers? Signalling? Dwell times? Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping? All of the above? Here's an interesting article about how the Victoria line, with new automatic trains and signalling, achieves its very high frequency: https://www.londonreconnections.com/...aking-victoria frequent-metro-world/ Maybe, when the Piccadilly line also has state of the art trains and signalling, it will do the same. But it will still have a route with curvier tunnels and more stops than the much newer Victoria line, opened more than 60 years later. The picc only has sharp curves at holborn and kensington. The rest of the line is pretty straight with a long no stopping section between hammersmith and acton that should in theory allow drivers to catch up if they're running late. How do you catch up if you're normally running at the 45mph limit for that section? In practice, if the service is running late, the westbound Picc trains often queue up to get into Acton Town. It's ironic that at a 4-platform station they manage to make it a bottleneck by changing drivers there and not always using the extra platform. Northfields trains tend to use the westbound District platform 1; Rayners Lane trains use 1 or 2; and Heathrow trains normally use 2. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 08:39:13 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote: In message , at 21:08:35 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO. IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map) and get there. I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed. Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the nearest station to it? The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton Rd etc? Almost fifty years earlier I think. I was suggesting that it survived the 1990s closures partly for that reason. I dare say that there were suggestions to close it rather than replacing the lifts. Apart from Aldwych that closed for very different reasons, what others were shuttered up in the 90's? The Ongar branch closed on the same day as Aldwych. They could well have closed Covent Garden on the same day, had there been a desire to do so. The Ongar branch is the same kind of completely different closure as the 'Aldwych Branch'. There's no synergy whatsoever with closing just one intermediate station on a line that's still operating fully. The synergy is that they could have slipped it in to the closures list had they really wanted to close it. But they didn't. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 12:55:41 on
Wed, 20 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: The Ongar branch is the same kind of completely different closure as the 'Aldwych Branch'. There's no synergy whatsoever with closing just one intermediate station on a line that's still operating fully. The synergy is that they could have slipped it in to the closures list had they really wanted to close it. But they didn't. You'll need to cite rather more about the process of closures to make that opinion stick. -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 11:30:02 +0100
"Richard J." wrote: wrote on 20 Sep 2017 at 09:41 ... is pretty straight with a long no stopping section between hammersmith and acton that should in theory allow drivers to catch up if they're running late. How do you catch up if you're normally running at the 45mph limit for that Except in my experience they don't. section? In practice, if the service is running late, the westbound Picc trains often queue up to get into Acton Town. It's ironic that at a 4-platform station they manage to make it a bottleneck by changing drivers there and not always using the extra platform. They manage that at arnos grove too. Its quite an achievement really to get something so simple so arse about face. I guess they just let the clockwork computer at earls court to do its thing and no one bothers to override it, easier to just let the line block up and read The Sun. -- Spud |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 13:48:24 +0100
David Cantrell wrote: On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 08:44:25AM +0000, wrote: Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on the victoria line putting added strain on that. It couldn't be that people are changing trains because the Victoria line goes where they want to go could it? That's the reason that *I* change at Finsbury Park pretty much every time I use the Piccadilly line. I doubt all the people who get off the picc at finsbury are specifically going to a victoria line station. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wednesday, 20 September 2017 14:07:03 UTC+1, wrote:
I doubt all the people who get off the picc at finsbury are specifically going to a victoria line station. I can imagine someone who lives at Cockfosters and works at Hyde Park Corner travelling Cockfosters - Finsbury Park, FP (Vic) - Green Park and walking. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wed, 20 Sep 2017 13:57:41 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote: In message , at 12:55:41 on Wed, 20 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: The Ongar branch is the same kind of completely different closure as the 'Aldwych Branch'. There's no synergy whatsoever with closing just one intermediate station on a line that's still operating fully. The synergy is that they could have slipped it in to the closures list had they really wanted to close it. But they didn't. You'll need to cite rather more about the process of closures to make that opinion stick. Huh? I'm saying they didn't want to close it, so what has the process of closures got to do with anything? |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
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Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
In message , at 14:44:51 on
Wed, 20 Sep 2017, Recliner remarked: The Ongar branch is the same kind of completely different closure as the 'Aldwych Branch'. There's no synergy whatsoever with closing just one intermediate station on a line that's still operating fully. The synergy is that they could have slipped it in to the closures list had they really wanted to close it. But they didn't. You'll need to cite rather more about the process of closures to make that opinion stick. Huh? I'm saying they didn't want to close it, so what has the process of closures got to do with anything? I'm contesting the "could have if they wanted to". -- Roland Perry |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On 2017\09\20 14:41, Offramp wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 September 2017 14:07:03 UTC+1, wrote: I doubt all the people who get off the picc at finsbury are specifically going to a victoria line station. I can imagine someone who lives at Cockfosters and works at Hyde Park Corner travelling Cockfosters - Finsbury Park, FP (Vic) - Green Park and walking. Was that "can" supposed to be "can't"? Oggy Circus and Victoria are two of the four busiest tube stations: Waterloo is another, and the easiest route from Cockfosters involves taking the Vic from Finny P to Oggy C. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\09\20 14:41, Offramp wrote: On Wednesday, 20 September 2017 14:07:03 UTC+1, wrote: I doubt all the people who get off the picc at finsbury are specifically going to a victoria line station. I can imagine someone who lives at Cockfosters and works at Hyde Park Corner travelling Cockfosters - Finsbury Park, FP (Vic) - Green Park and walking. Was that "can" supposed to be "can't"? Oggy Circus and Victoria are two of the four busiest tube stations: Waterloo is another, and the easiest route from Cockfosters involves taking the Vic from Finny P to Oggy C. If I'd got a seat on the Picc from Cockfosters, I'd stay seated in reasonable comfort on the train all the way to Hyde Park corner, rather than having to stand on a packed Victoria line train from Finsbury Park to Green Park, and then having a 10 min walk to Hyde Park Corner (maybe in the rain) that more than wasted the few minutes I'd saved standing on the Victoria line train. |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Wednesday, 20 September 2017 21:12:33 UTC+1, Recliner wrote:
If I'd got a seat on the Picc from Cockfosters, I'd stay seated in reasonable comfort on the train all the way to Hyde Park corner, rather than having to stand on a packed Victoria line train from Finsbury Park to Green Park, and then having a 10 min walk to Hyde Park Corner (maybe in the rain) that more than wasted the few minutes I'd saved standing on the Victoria line train. Is this not what this thread is about? |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
Offramp wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 September 2017 21:12:33 UTC+1, Recliner wrote: If I'd got a seat on the Picc from Cockfosters, I'd stay seated in reasonable comfort on the train all the way to Hyde Park corner, rather than having to stand on a packed Victoria line train from Finsbury Park to Green Park, and then having a 10 min walk to Hyde Park Corner (maybe in the rain) that more than wasted the few minutes I'd saved standing on the Victoria line train. Is this not what this thread is about? Indeed, this is one thread that's not drifted! |
Why is the piccadilly line so slow?
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 14:34:39 UTC+1, Basil Jet wrote:
The working timetables are all online at https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables Krapy Rubsnif to Kings Cross: Vic = 310 seconds N/B or 315 seconds S/B Picc = 7.5 minutes N/B or 8 minutes S/B About 2.5 minutes difference KX to Green Park: Vic = 400 seconds N/B or 390 seconds S/B Picc = 10 minutes N/B or 9.5 minutes S/B About 3.5 minutes difference Those are the official times. The OP thinks that Picc trains are running much slower in real life, causing people to bail out at Finsbury. Does anyone here have Trackernet or a similar program that might give a real, rush hour timing for Picc trains? |
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