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Old September 19th 17, 08:44 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

Its got to the point where its just painful to use in the mornings and
unsurprisingly the vast majority of people bail out at Finsbury and get on
the victoria line putting added strain on that.

Why is it so slow and so unreliable with frequent train gaps of 5 or 6 minutes
the rush hour?

Trains?
Drivers?
Signalling?
Dwell times?
Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping?
All of the above?



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Old September 19th 17, 11:04 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote:
....
Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping?


That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...).

I'd like to know the travelling times between King's Cross and Green Park on the Piccadilly Line and the Victoria Line. I'll bet it's about 10 minutes difference.
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Old September 19th 17, 11:14 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 04:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp wrote:
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote:
....
Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping?


That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road
to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to
Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd,
Down St...).


I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station that can't
really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to
leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO.

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Old September 19th 17, 01:34 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

On 2017\09\19 12:04, Offramp wrote:
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, wrote:
...
Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping?


That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance, Caledonian Road to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few (Brompton Rd, Down St...).

I'd like to know the travelling times between King's Cross and Green Park on the Piccadilly Line and the Victoria Line. I'll bet it's about 10 minutes difference.


The working timetables are all online at
https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/publica...ing-timetables
(it uses the TfL alphabet, in which Piccadilly comes before Northern)

Krapy Rubsnif to Kings Cross:
Vic = 310 seconds N/B or 315 seconds S/B
Picc = 7.5 minutes N/B or 8 minutes S/B
About 2.5 minutes difference

KX to Green Park:
Vic = 400 seconds N/B or 390 seconds S/B
Picc = 10 minutes N/B or 9.5 minutes S/B
About 3.5 minutes difference


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Old September 19th 17, 02:05 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\09\19 14:13, Robin wrote:
On 19/09/2017 12:14, wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2017 04:04:43 -0700 (PDT)
Offramp wrote:
On Tuesday, 19 September 2017 09:44:27 UTC+1, * wrote:
....
Stations too close together in the centre with too much stopping?

That has always got on my nerves. There is this huge distance,
Caledonian Road
to King's Cross, then the stops bunch right up together. Leicester Sq to
Covent Garden is the worst example. Thank god they closed a few
(Brompton Rd,
Down St...).

I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station
that can't
really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to
leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO.


IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and
restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not
to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map)
and get there.


I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden
was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed.


Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the
nearest station to it? The next nearest was closed in 1994, though that
one was always an anachronism.

I think that Covent Garden station has always been reasonably well used,
unlike the three central London Piccadilly line stations (one on Piccadilly
itself) that were closed early in the line's life.

Of those three, York Road might do much better if it reopened, but I'd say
that was highly unlikely, because of the high cost, slowing the line down,
and probably failing to attract many net new customers.
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Old September 19th 17, 04:29 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

In message , at
14:13:20 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Robin remarked:
I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station
that can't
really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4 minute walk to
leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO.


IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and
restaurants, who pay lots of business rates,


Unlike the rest of the country, are London business rates kept by the
local authority, or are they just general revenue kept by the Treasury?

add up to a good case not to make it harder for tourists to find Covent
Garden (on the tube map) and get there.


--
Roland Perry
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Old September 19th 17, 04:33 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Why is the piccadilly line so slow?

In message
-sept
ember.org, at 14:05:01 on Tue, 19 Sep 2017, Recliner
remarked:

I wonder why covent garden was spared? Its a small cramped station
that can't really cope with evening crowds and its literally a 3-4
minute walk to leicester square. Its a bit of an anomoly IMO.


IMO the explanation is lots of tourists, who support lots of shops and
restaurants, who pay lots of business rates, add up to a good case not
to make it harder for tourists to find Covent Garden (on the tube map)
and get there.


I suspect the opera house is more likely to be the reason. Covent Garden
was still a fruit market when the other Picc stations closed.


Not to mention the LT Museum — wouldn't it be embarrassing to close the
nearest station to it?


The museum opened in 1980, when were the closures of York Rd, Brompton
Rd etc?

Almost fifty years earlier I think.
--
Roland Perry
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