On Fri, 14 May 2004 20:31:13 +0100, "Clive D. W. Feather"
wrote:


But I can well imagine that someone could play half an hour of squash
*knowing that you can stop at any time* but not spend 3 hours driving a
train *unable to stop*.

So if a driver becomes unwell he has to carry on til it is convenient
for hime to stop working? I'd call that extremely dangerous
procedures.

k wrote:
On Fri, 14 May 2004 20:31:13 +0100, "Clive D. W. Feather"
wrote:


But I can well imagine that someone could play half an hour of squash
*knowing that you can stop at any time* but not spend 3 hours
driving a train *unable to stop*.

So if a driver becomes unwell he has to carry on til it is convenient
for hime to stop working? I'd call that extremely dangerous
procedures.

That is a hazard of one person operation. When there was a guard on the
train, the guard could take the train forward to the next relieveing point
albeit out of service.

In article ,
k wrote:
So if a driver becomes unwell he has to carry on til it is convenient
for hime to stop working? I'd call that extremely dangerous
procedures.

How else could you do things?

Suppose a driver became unwell, and required immediate relief. You
would need to:
a) get a replacment driver from whereever she is to the nearest
access point (read: from depot to station, or similar);
b) get the driver from the access point to the train (by, say,
discharging the current so it's safe to walk down the tunnel,
and then walk from the tunnel to the train).

Even if there were a replacement driver at every station, ready to
press the magic dischange-the-current button and sprint down the
tunnel, you could be looking at leaving a stalled train in the
middle of the tunnel waiting for perhaps 10 minutes or so.

The cost of doing so would be quite large. Even if you had the
fully-qualified driver doing station-assistant type work in the
meantime, I would bet that the salary differential between a driver
and a station assistant would reach 10k/year. [1]

Of course, you would either have to be prepared to shut the station
should the drivers services be required, because it is undermanned
for the section 12 (or whatever) requirments of the relevant
legislation [2], or you'd need a whole extra head (as opposed to a
more qualified head). Much fun could be had considering a station
serving multiple lines - you'd need a driver qualified for both the
district line and the central line at mile end, for example.

Alternativly, you could not bother. And trust that drivers who
are a bit 'iffy' say so, don't drive, and you take the increased
sick-pay bill - and should a driver get it wrong, you add the time
taken to taxi driver from the nearest point you can find one to the
time taken to deal with the problem.

I wonder which approach would cost less? I'm honestly not sure;
10k per year per station sounds like a lot of money - but a minutes
delay on a busy line during the rush hour costs alot, too, if one
starts counting the fact that folk'll drive rather than 'take the
unreliable tube'. Its clear which approach would give customers a
better service - but would it cost so much more it'd be cheaper for
me to buy an Alpha?

My personal conclusion is that its quite complicated, and I don't
really have a clue - but I suspect I have more of one than you

Cheers,
Mike

[1] I expect that station assistant and driver salaries are publicly
available, so feel free to correct me - with references!

[2] introduced post-kings-cross, IIRC.


--
You dont have to be illiterate to use the Internet, but it help's.

In message , Mike Bristow
writes
Suppose a driver became unwell, and required immediate relief. You
would need to:
a) get a replacment driver from whereever she is to the nearest
access point (read: from depot to station, or similar);
b) get the driver from the access point to the train (by, say,
discharging the current so it's safe to walk down the tunnel,
and then walk from the tunnel to the train).

There is a whole procedure in place for such an eventuality.

Basically this involves using the driver of the following train (either
in or out of service, depending upon where it happens) and repeating
this until an extra driver is made available.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

In article ,
Steve Fitzgerald junk@[ wrote:
There is a whole procedure in place for such an eventuality.

Basically this involves using the driver of the following train (either
in or out of service, depending upon where it happens) and repeating
this until an extra driver is made available.

Oh! That makes a whole lot of sense. How often does it happen,
roughtly?

--
You dont have to be illiterate to use the Internet, but it help's.

In message , Mike Bristow
writes

There is a whole procedure in place for such an eventuality.

Basically this involves using the driver of the following train (either
in or out of service, depending upon where it happens) and repeating
this until an extra driver is made available.

Oh! That makes a whole lot of sense. How often does it happen,
roughtly?

Never that I know of in the past two years, although we did have an
exercise doing it last year.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

"Steve Fitzgerald" ] wrote in message
...
In message , Mike Bristow
writes

There is a whole procedure in place for such an eventuality.

Basically this involves using the driver of the following train (either
in or out of service, depending upon where it happens) and repeating
this until an extra driver is made available.

Oh! That makes a whole lot of sense. How often does it happen,
roughtly?

Never that I know of in the past two years, although we did have an
exercise doing it last year.

As far as I can recall, it has never been used in anger since the procedure
was introduced with the demise of guards on the Picc. It's been practiced in
exercises, IIRC, 3 times.
--
Cheers, Steve.
If The Good Lord had meant for us to be fiscally prudent, He would not have
given us the platinum credit card...
Change colour to PC Plod's lights to reply.

In article , k
writes
But I can well imagine that someone could play half an hour of squash
*knowing that you can stop at any time* but not spend 3 hours driving a
train *unable to stop*.

So if a driver becomes unwell he has to carry on til it is convenient
for hime to stop working?

No. But if he expects it to be not unlikely in 3 hours, he shouldn't be
driving.

--
Clive D.W. Feather | Home:
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