PRAR wrote in message . ..
On 12 Oct 2004 19:50:55 GMT, Robin May
wrote:

(TheOneKEA) wrote the following in:
. com

Today (Sun Oct 10, 2004), the Epping Ongar Railway Preservation
Society ran a train service using a single class 117 DMU from
Ongar to North Weald and back; a week previously, almost 10 years
to the day since the Central Line service was withdrawn, a test
service was run on Oct 3.

http://www.eorailway.co.uk/news.htm

I wonder if this means that the EOR actually has a future. I also
wonder about that DMU livery, and the precise relationship between
the original EOR company that bought the line and this new EORPS
that ran the trains today.

Am I right in thinking that it is currently only Ongar to North Weald
without any stop at Epping? If so, that's pretty inconvenient and a bit
of a shame.

Correct. There's no space at Epping (even on a Sunday) to accomodate a
heritage service. Also the line is blocked by trees/undegrowth and
needs clearing between North Weald and Epping.

PRAR

http://www.trainweb.org/tubeprune/Ep...20&%20Sigs.gif

LU has also retained the siding and double crossover to the east of
Epping as part of the signalling overlap (LW12/LW22 to LW2), which
means that even if EOR could find the funds to construct a platform
(say between LW3 and LW20), not only would it need Central Line ATP
but it would also force a much slower approach to Epping.

Any EOR station at Epping would thus end up being an unreasonable
distance from the LU station.

"Dr. Sunil" wrote in message
om...
Tom Anderson wrote in message
...
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, simon wrote:

with the almost certain expansion of Stansted airport, in the long
term,
returning the Epping-Ongar route might make sense.

Hang on, just how much are they planning to extend Stansted? I make it
about 20 km from the airport to Ongar ...

tom


http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...em.bc.ic.ac.uk

From: Sunil )
Subject: Epping to Ongar: expected to open by Easter 2000, six
months early
Newsgroups: uk.railway, uk.transport.london
Date: 1999/10/22

[Madcap Plan alert!]

How about *somehow* building a 'South Essex Railway' from Harlow,
south to Epping, utilise the old Ongar route and continue eastwards to
Brentwood and Shenfield, thus enabling a Cambridge/Stansted to
Southend service to be run?

[ducks for cover]

Sunil

The 2002 'London - Ipswich Multi-Modal Study' (LOIS) for the Department for
Transport identified a new Stratford-Chelmsford route as a possible future
rail development. This might take over the Stratford-Epping part of the
central line and the disused bit to Ongar. There could also be a new line
from Epping to Stanstead via Harlow.

This LOIS (like all the others) has been largely ignored by the government.
But the only reason for Essex County Council being willing to buy the line
is to preserve the route (not necessarily as a railway) for future transport
needs. Other daft schemes such as 'guided busways' have been mentioned from
time to time.

Essex still haven't bought the line but, if they do, the preservationists
will need to establish it as a major tourist attraction if they don't want
to be evicted when the council either gets bored with the idea; wants to
build a road over part of it - or needs the money and decides to sell the
land again.

PRAR wrote:
On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 00:18:22 +0100, Dave Arquati
wrote:


Shame that on Sunday it costs £4 to get from Ongar to Epping, but £2 to
get from there to West Ruislip :-)


On Sunday your £4 got you a return to North Weald, not Epping. IIRC
the return fare Epping - West Ruislip is £3.80.

I was thinking of the Oyster Prepay discount (which is actually £1.80
single so I got it wrong anyway - I was thinking of the 2005 fares!).
The standard single is £3.80.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, John Rowland wrote:

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, simon wrote:

with the almost certain expansion of Stansted
airport, in the long term, returning the
Epping-Ongar route might make sense.

Hang on, just how much are they planning to extend
Stansted? I make it about 20 km from the airport to Ongar ...

I believe he meant that a bigger Stansted will need more staff, and they
will have to live somewhere and have a way of travelling from their
homes to Stansted.

Ongar to Stansted via Liverpool Street doesn't seem a completely brilliant
idea. Ongar to Stansted via Stratford (using the planned Lea Valley Line
service) isn't hugely better. A direct coach is going to beat that pretty
easily.

tom

--
POTATO POWER IS UNTRACEABLE POWER

"John Rowland" wrote in message ...
"Boltar" wrote in message
m...

Well its taken 10 years just to get a DMU to run.
And unlike other preserved
lines they didn't even have to relay any track!

They lowered the alignment beneath the M11 - not a small task.

That never prevented them running services from North Weald to Ongar
which is all they're doing now anyway.
B2003

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, John Rowland wrote:


"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
...

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, simon wrote:


with the almost certain expansion of Stansted
airport, in the long term, returning the
Epping-Ongar route might make sense.

Hang on, just how much are they planning to extend
Stansted? I make it about 20 km from the airport to Ongar ...

I believe he meant that a bigger Stansted will need more staff, and they
will have to live somewhere and have a way of travelling from their
homes to Stansted.


Ongar to Stansted via Liverpool Street doesn't seem a completely brilliant
idea. Ongar to Stansted via Stratford (using the planned Lea Valley Line
service) isn't hugely better. A direct coach is going to beat that pretty
easily.

tom

Have you ever tried to get anywhere from Ongar by bus?

umpston wrote:
"Dr. Sunil" wrote in message
om...

Tom Anderson wrote in message

...

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004, simon wrote:


with the almost certain expansion of Stansted airport, in the long

term,

returning the Epping-Ongar route might make sense.

Hang on, just how much are they planning to extend Stansted? I make it
about 20 km from the airport to Ongar ...

tom

[Madcap Plan alert!]

How about *somehow* building a 'South Essex Railway' from Harlow,
south to Epping, utilise the old Ongar route and continue eastwards to
Brentwood and Shenfield, thus enabling a Cambridge/Stansted to
Southend service to be run?

[ducks for cover]

Sunil


The 2002 'London - Ipswich Multi-Modal Study' (LOIS) for the Department for
Transport identified a new Stratford-Chelmsford route as a possible future
rail development. This might take over the Stratford-Epping part of the
central line and the disused bit to Ongar. There could also be a new line
from Epping to Stanstead via Harlow.
(snip)

One plan for Crossrail 2 was to send it to Epping, taking over the
Central Line from Leytonstone to Epping via Woodford. Given the
will-power, a new alignment could be found from Epping to Harlow (either
a longer route to the west of Harlow which could serve southwest Harlow
as well as the existing stations to the north, or a more direct route
along the M11 route) with trains continuing to Stansted. Probably more
expensive than just running Crossrail 2 trains directly up the WA line
from Hackney or Stratford though!

A second branch from Epping via Ongar could continue to Chelmsford -
allowing journeys from there to Stansted with a change at Epping (or put
in a new junction near Coopersale Common and you have a direct route).

I think it would be way too expensive though.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Dave Arquati wrote in message ...
The 2002 'London - Ipswich Multi-Modal Study' (LOIS) for the Department for
Transport identified a new Stratford-Chelmsford route as a possible future
rail development. This might take over the Stratford-Epping part of the
central line and the disused bit to Ongar. There could also be a new line
from Epping to Stanstead via Harlow.
(snip)

One plan for Crossrail 2 was to send it to Epping, taking over the
Central Line from Leytonstone to Epping via Woodford. Given the
will-power, a new alignment could be found from Epping to Harlow (either
a longer route to the west of Harlow which could serve southwest Harlow
as well as the existing stations to the north, or a more direct route
along the M11 route) with trains continuing to Stansted. Probably more
expensive than just running Crossrail 2 trains directly up the WA line
from Hackney or Stratford though!

Has anyone thought this through? Why would a passenger from Stansted if
given the choice of a direct stansted express or a train that stops at 20
odd stations going via epping, choose the latter to get to london? Unless
they add 2 new tracks they won't be able to run an express service so it'll
just be a pottering commuter train and moreover it'll mean that people who
live on the eastern part of the central line won't be able to get a tube to
london without changing. So it would probably **** off a lot more people than
it would please.

B2003

In article , Boltar wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote in message ...
One plan for Crossrail 2 was to send it to Epping
[...]
with trains continuing to Stansted.

Has anyone thought this through? Why would a passenger from Stansted if
given the choice of a direct stansted express or a train that stops at 20
odd stations going via epping, choose the latter to get to london?

To avoid the exorbitant SEx[0] fares? I usually prefer the Picc from LHR
and Southern from LGW for similar reasons.

Niklas

[0] couldn't resist
--
"I want to live in Theory. Everything works in Theory."
-- Robert Sneddon

Boltar wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote in message ...

The 2002 'London - Ipswich Multi-Modal Study' (LOIS) for the Department for
Transport identified a new Stratford-Chelmsford route as a possible future
rail development. This might take over the Stratford-Epping part of the
central line and the disused bit to Ongar. There could also be a new line
from Epping to Stanstead via Harlow.

(snip)

One plan for Crossrail 2 was to send it to Epping, taking over the
Central Line from Leytonstone to Epping via Woodford. Given the
will-power, a new alignment could be found from Epping to Harlow (either
a longer route to the west of Harlow which could serve southwest Harlow
as well as the existing stations to the north, or a more direct route
along the M11 route) with trains continuing to Stansted. Probably more
expensive than just running Crossrail 2 trains directly up the WA line
from Hackney or Stratford though!


Has anyone thought this through? Why would a passenger from Stansted if
given the choice of a direct stansted express or a train that stops at 20
odd stations going via epping, choose the latter to get to london? Unless
they add 2 new tracks they won't be able to run an express service so it'll
just be a pottering commuter train and moreover it'll mean that people who
live on the eastern part of the central line won't be able to get a tube to
london without changing. So it would probably **** off a lot more people than
it would please.

B2003

It's more to get communities along the M11 corridor linked up better
given the government's desire to create lots of new housing and
employment along that corridor, rather than create a new route from
Stansted to London. If people want to use CR2 all the way because it's
cheaper, then that's up to them. Also don't forget that although there
will be many stops further out, there will be fewer further in. I
believe the CR2 plan from King's Cross is to tunnel to Dalston, then
stop at NLL stations to Stratford and then up the Central line. Dalston
to Tottenham Court Road or Victoria would have a very fast journey time.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London