London Transport (uk.transport.london) Discussion of all forms of transport in London.

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Old October 21st 06, 01:22 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

There was an item on driving offence cameras (e.g. box junction
offences, red light offences, right turn offences, bus lane offences
etc), as following successful trials in London they are now being
rolled out nationally. Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on this
group) was interviewed and argued against such measures stating his
view that that they did not *prevent * such offences, merely *punished*
but did not reduce the number of offices. He also disputed figures from
London that had shown congestion had been reduced by their
introduction. He said the figures could be interpreted in different
ways.

Well Paul I disagree with your argument. I think that in the trail
area they have made drivers think twice about stopping in box
junctions, red-light running, illegal turns and driving in bus lanes.
Since my box junction offence fine (from the North Circular documented
on these groups) I have been extra vigilant to ensure I do not commit
further offences. Furthermore when I visited some friends in Muswell
Hill (a number who had also received fines) they all admitted they had
committed offences and said that they were all extra careful when
driving around Haringey now as this council had put in a significant
number of cameras in the area, and people were aware of the fines and
being more careful.

This is my opinion only, but in my experience offence cameras do make
people think more carefully about their driving, and drive more
carefully. I can't understand the argument that says this is not the
case. Paul: Perhaps you can explain how the figures that show reduced
congestion since the introduction of such cameras can be interpreted to
not show reduced congestion.

I have an open mind and am genuinely interested to understand.

David


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Old October 21st 06, 01:59 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

In article .com,
David from Oz says...

Well Paul I disagree with your argument.


Situation Normal then.


I have an open mind and am genuinely interested to understand.

Unlike blinkered Paul.


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Old October 21st 06, 02:24 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

David from Oz wrote:
There was an item on driving offence cameras (e.g. box junction
offences, red light offences, right turn offences, bus lane offences
etc), as following successful trials in London they are now being
rolled out nationally. Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on this
group) was interviewed and argued against such measures stating his
view that that they did not *prevent * such offences, merely
*punished* but did not reduce the number of offices.


Hmmm , so an increased chance of being caught doesn't act as a deterrent at
all........

I'd be interested to know what he would propose that could prevent someone
blocking a box junction.

--
Alex

"I laugh in the face of danger. Then I hide until it goes away"

www.drzoidberg.co.uk www.ebayfaq.co.uk


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Old October 21st 06, 02:36 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving OffenceCameras

Conor wrote:
In article .com,
David from Oz says...

Well Paul I disagree with your argument.


Situation Normal then.


I have an open mind and am genuinely interested to understand.

Unlike blinkered Paul.



I don't know about all the detail issues, but I think Paul's overall
approach to road safety is a good and positive one. We tend to have our
own pet ideas as to how we think things ought to work, so probably we
could all be accused of being blinkered to some extent, and a bit biased
now and again.

Best wishes all,
Dave.
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Old October 21st 06, 02:39 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving OffenceCameras

Dr Zoidberg wrote:
David from Oz wrote:

There was an item on driving offence cameras (e.g. box junction
offences, red light offences, right turn offences, bus lane offences
etc), as following successful trials in London they are now being
rolled out nationally. Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on this
group) was interviewed and argued against such measures stating his
view that that they did not *prevent * such offences, merely
*punished* but did not reduce the number of offices.



Hmmm , so an increased chance of being caught doesn't act as a deterrent at
all........

I'd be interested to know what he would propose that could prevent someone
blocking a box junction.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:T...achine_gun.jpg

would probably work. Bit messy though.


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Old October 21st 06, 04:02 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

Tosspot wrote:
Dr Zoidberg wrote:
David from Oz wrote:

There was an item on driving offence cameras (e.g. box junction
offences, red light offences, right turn offences, bus lane offences
etc), as following successful trials in London they are now being
rolled out nationally. Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on
this group) was interviewed and argued against such measures
stating his view that that they did not *prevent * such offences,
merely *punished* but did not reduce the number of offices.



Hmmm , so an increased chance of being caught doesn't act as a
deterrent at all........

I'd be interested to know what he would propose that could prevent
someone blocking a box junction.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:T...achine_gun.jpg

would probably work. Bit messy though.


Nice idea in theory , but the wreckage could end up blocking the junction
for far longer than a three series....

--
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Zoidberg: "They took away my credit cards!"

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Old October 21st 06, 04:04 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

In article , TripleS says...
Conor wrote:
In article .com,
David from Oz says...

Well Paul I disagree with your argument.


Situation Normal then.


I have an open mind and am genuinely interested to understand.

Unlike blinkered Paul.



I don't know about all the detail issues, but I think Paul's overall
approach to road safety is a good and positive one. We tend to have our
own pet ideas as to how we think things ought to work, so probably we
could all be accused of being blinkered to some extent, and a bit biased
now and again.


My problem with Paul is that despite clear evidence to the contrary, he
will fudge whatever figures he has to to suite what is needed to get
him on TV/Radio/in the papers.

--
Conor

I'm really a nice guy. If I had friends, they would tell you.

Earn commission on online purchases, 2.50 just for signing up:
http://www.TopCashBack.co.uk/Conor/ref/index.htm
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Old October 21st 06, 04:16 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

David from Oz wrote:

Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on this group)


Paul hasn't posted on this group for a considerable period of time, not
under his own name anyway.


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Old October 21st 06, 04:21 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving OffenceCameras

David from Oz wrote:

rolled out nationally. Paul from Safe Speed (a regular poster on this
group)


Which group? Has he been using an alias?
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Old October 21st 06, 04:28 PM posted to uk.rec.driving,uk.transport,uk.transport.london
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Default Paul from SafeSpeed on BBC Breakfast today on Driving Offence Cameras

Conor wrote:

I don't know about all the detail issues, but I think Paul's overall
approach to road safety is a good and positive one. We tend to have our
own pet ideas as to how we think things ought to work, so probably we
could all be accused of being blinkered to some extent, and a bit biased
now and again.


My problem with Paul is that despite clear evidence to the contrary, he
will fudge whatever figures he has to to suite what is needed to get
him on TV/Radio/in the papers.


Unlike the government which consistently fudges figures to justify yet
more automated revenue cameras?
--
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Alfa 156 TSpark - B6 Passat 2.0TDI SE - COSOC KOTL
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