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#1
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
Jonathan Morris wrote:
Matt Wheeler wrote: When you say "full" do you mean that all standard class areas have fully occupied seats and no standing room, or the more usual, no desirable seats available (occupied by people/bags) and the rear carriage is half empty as it means a long walk at the destination to leave the station. I've been on a couple of services where I could genuinely say that it was full (all seats). This is more likely in the rush hour, where people will ask passengers to move bags and coats off otherwise empty seats. You're a lucky man if you've only been on a couple of trains where there are no available seats - it's not an unusual situation in the rush hour! At most other times, it's a case of people trying to keep empty seats next to them - and people are too scared to ask them to move whatever it is they've put there. Should this count as a full to capacity train? It's certainly the majority. I have no hesitation to ask someone to move something, but you will often get the look that says 'That's MY seat - how dare you take it'. You just have to get on with it, or be willing to stand. People can be pathetic wilting violets in such situations - as you say just ask! |
#2
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
Mizter T wrote:
You're a lucky man if you've only been on a couple of trains where there are no available seats - it's not an unusual situation in the rush hour! Depends on the route, obviously. Some morning trains will be packed, but others start from just one station back and are pretty empty. By the time it gets to Finsbury Park, it's pretty packed but not ridiculously so. People can be pathetic wilting violets in such situations - as you say just ask! I can sort of understand a family or group considering a train to be full when you can't get seats together, but few trains (bar the rush hour) are literally packed as people say (such as those who moan to the media about how our trains are always overcrowded). It's just that you may have to split up to get seated. In some rare instances, people will volunteer to move so people can sit together. I think even I might be a little too shy to ask people to swap seats! Jonathan |
#3
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
A long time ago (1984 ish) I was on a First Class Only service from
Crewe I seem to rembember. Do such things still exist. The RPI let me of on the grounds that it was the only train to get me to where I was going but he said I should technically have not got on it at all! mysteryflyer |
#4
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
"Mystery Flyer" wrote in message ... A long time ago (1984 ish) I was on a First Class Only service from Crewe I seem to rembember. Do such things still exist. The RPI let me of on the grounds that it was the only train to get me to where I was going but he said I should technically have not got on it at all! That was presumably the Manchester Pullman. It, and its predecessor the Midland Pullman, were the only first class only scheduled daytime trains of the BR era, and between them ran from about 1960 to 1984. There were also a few trains formed of first class sleeping cars only, such as the 'Night Limited' (Euston - Glasgow). In the Victorian era first class only trains were not unusual - the Great North of Scotland Railway even ran a train which was advertised as first class only, but third class accommodation available for servants accompanying passengers travelling first class. AFAIK there haven't been any first class only scheduled trains since 1984. Peter |
#5
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
"Peter Masson" wrote in message ... "Mystery Flyer" wrote in message ... A long time ago (1984 ish) I was on a First Class Only service from Crewe I seem to rembember. Do such things still exist. The RPI let me of on the grounds that it was the only train to get me to where I was going but he said I should technically have not got on it at all! That was presumably the Manchester Pullman. It, and its predecessor the Midland Pullman, were the only first class only scheduled daytime trains of the BR era, and between them ran from about 1960 to 1984. There were also a few trains formed of first class sleeping cars only, such as the 'Night Limited' (Euston - Glasgow). In the Victorian era first class only trains were not unusual - the Great North of Scotland Railway even ran a train which was advertised as first class only, but third class accommodation available for servants accompanying passengers travelling first class. AFAIK there haven't been any first class only scheduled trains since 1984. Peter The only first class only we worked on the Southern was the Boat Trains Waterloo/Southampton Docks where my guards at Clapham Jct and RPI's at Cannon Street at a later date were employed in 'Cap doffing duties' |
#6
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
"4sub" wrote The only first class only we worked on the Southern was the Boat Trains Waterloo/Southampton Docks where my guards at Clapham Jct and RPI's at Cannon Street at a later date were employed in 'Cap doffing duties' In the 1960s the Southern also ran first class only trains from Waterloo to Ascot for the Royal Ascot Race Meeting - using 4CORs, with the second class seats reclqassified by the simple expedient of adding antimacassars. The Western ran a 'First Class and Members' Special' from Paddington to Newbury Racecourse, and included a couple of 'Ocean Saloons' in teh rake. Peter |
#7
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
Peter Masson wrote: "4sub" wrote The only first class only we worked on the Southern was the Boat Trains Waterloo/Southampton Docks where my guards at Clapham Jct and RPI's at Cannon Street at a later date were employed in 'Cap doffing duties' In the 1960s the Southern also ran first class only trains from Waterloo to Ascot for the Royal Ascot Race Meeting - using 4CORs, with the second class seats reclqassified by the simple expedient of adding antimacassars. The Western ran a 'First Class and Members' Special' from Paddington to Newbury Racecourse, and included a couple of 'Ocean Saloons' in teh rake. Peter Around 1990 when I lived in Bristol, there was an unadvertised Bristol-Paddington relief laid on for employees of a major bank which had moved part if not all of its offices from London to Bristol. It ran about 15 minutes behind the normal HST service, called at Bath and Reading (I think) and was hauled by a BR long range 47. I'm not sure whether it was intentionally all first class, however on occasion I did notice that it was formed of all first class coaches. |
#8
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
Peter Masson wrote:
"Mystery Flyer" wrote in message ... A long time ago (1984 ish) I was on a First Class Only service from Crewe I seem to rembember. Do such things still exist. The RPI let me of on the grounds that it was the only train to get me to where I was going but he said I should technically have not got on it at all! That was presumably the Manchester Pullman. It, and its predecessor the Midland Pullman, were the only first class only scheduled daytime trains of the BR era, and between them ran from about 1960 to 1984. There were also a few trains formed of first class sleeping cars only, such as the 'Night Limited' (Euston - Glasgow). Thank you it was indeed the Manchester Pullman. I remember it more clearly now! mysteryflyer |
#9
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Penalty fares for sitting in First Class
Jonathan Morris wrote: Mizter T wrote: You're a lucky man if you've only been on a couple of trains where there are no available seats - it's not an unusual situation in the rush hour! Depends on the route, obviously. Some morning trains will be packed, but others start from just one station back and are pretty empty. By the time it gets to Finsbury Park, it's pretty packed but not ridiculously so. True - the notion that all rush-hour trains are packed to the gills is an incorrect one. People can be pathetic wilting violets in such situations - as you say just ask! I can sort of understand a family or group considering a train to be full when you can't get seats together, but few trains (bar the rush hour) are literally packed as people say (such as those who moan to the media about how our trains are always overcrowded). It's just that you may have to split up to get seated. In some rare instances, people will volunteer to move so people can sit together. I think even I might be a little too shy to ask people to swap seats! If you're with children then I don't think it unreasonable to ask passengers if they might be willing to swap so at least some of your group can sit together. And I'm quite receptive to moving so that a family, or perhaps another group, can all sit together - indeed I will volunteer, unprompted, to do just that. Dare I suggest that some members of this group, having found their 'ideal' seat, would not be so willing! The other thing that amuses of course is, on an Intercity service, the one or two passengers who install themselves at a table, spread out all over it and then seem most perturbed when others wish to intrude on their private patch and utilise one or more of the spare seats. Table seats are great, so long as one remembers they are for sharing! |
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