In message
,
Mizter T writes

The T4 trains will actually display T4 & 123 as a destination; the T5
trains will show T123 & 5 as a destination.

So for people heading to T123 in a hurry, and the first train is to T4
& 123, perhaps the best strategy is to board it anyway and then lean
out of the carriage at Hatton Cross to see if the platform departure
indicator (assuming that there is one) shows a T123 & 5 train less
than (say) eight minutes behind.

PaulO

I'm not sure there is a "train describer" (in endearing LU lingo) at
Hatton Cross - but if there isn't one, there needs to be!

There is now - it went in a month or two ago when the signalling work
was being done for T5.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

On Jan 24, 1:57 pm, Paul Oter wrote:
On 23 Jan, 11:11, Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote:



All (Heathrow) trains do call at T123, just that
the T4 ones take about 10 minutes longer to get there.

(snip)

The T4 trains will actually display T4 & 123 as a destination; the T5
trains will show T123 & 5 as a destination.

So for people heading to T123 in a hurry, and the first train is to T4
& 123, perhaps the best strategy is to board it anyway and then lean
out of the carriage at Hatton Cross to see if the platform departure
indicator (assuming that there is one) shows a T123 & 5 train less
than (say) eight minutes behind.

PaulO

As some posters here will know it is very rare to have a Picc line
train less than 10 mins late!

Steve Fitzgerald wrote:
In message
,
Mizter T writes

The T4 trains will actually display T4 & 123 as a destination;
the T5 trains will show T123 & 5 as a destination.

So for people heading to T123 in a hurry, and the first train is
to T4 & 123, perhaps the best strategy is to board it anyway and
then lean out of the carriage at Hatton Cross to see if the
platform departure indicator (assuming that there is one) shows a
T123 & 5 train less than (say) eight minutes behind.

PaulO

I'm not sure there is a "train describer" (in endearing LU lingo)
at Hatton Cross - but if there isn't one, there needs to be!

There is now - it went in a month or two ago when the signalling
work was being done for T5.

Last Thursday it was showing "Check front of train" for all trains,
which wasn't much use, especially if, as someone said earlier, even the
T4 trains say HEATHROW T1,2,3 on the front. Is that true? If so, it's
typical of the shambles that LU have made of the Heathrow change.

Last week, none of the line diagrams in the trains or on the platforms
had been changed, so they all showed Hatton Cross - T4 - T123 in a
straight line, highly misleading for T4 passengers.

There were some posters in Piccadilly Line ticket halls saying vaguely
that there were some changes in the Heathrow area, and that people
should listen for announcements at Hounslow West and Hatton Cross.
These posters would not be seen by people joining the Picc from another
line.

The arrangement was quite well covered by the auto-announcer on the
trains. After leaving Hounslow West, it said that T4 passengers should
change at the next station, Hatton Cross, and wait for a train to T4.
This is sensible as it gives passengers a couple of minutes' notice that
they have to collect their baggage and leave the train. But this plan
was scuppered by the station assistant on the platform at Hounslow West
announcing that "this train will not call at Terminal 4. Passengers for
Terminal 4 should alight here ..." So all the T4 passengers are told
this without any notice, having been kept in ignorance until then and
lied to by the line diagrams.

I spoke to the SA at Hounslow West, who was reluctantly acting under
instructions but thought it was daft. He had been told to make the
announcement if the driver didn't. And he even had a sheet on which he
had to record which train drivers didn't make an announcement. This is
crazy, as the auto-announcer is set to make the announcement AFTER
leaving Hounslow West.

I haven't got round to complaining to LU, having been distracted by
events above ground at Heathrow that day. Is all the above still true?

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

In message , asdf
writes

If this is the case there could be problems if all passengers in
central London who want to go to T123 & 5 (when it opens) rather than
T4 wait for the appropriate train - the T4 loop trains could end up
rather empty and the others rather full.

I seriously doubt there are enough Heathrow passengers for it to cause
significant problems.

I would concur, although the opportunities to confuse passengers are
endless and should be avoided if at all possible.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

On 24 Jan, 21:14, Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote:
In message
,
Mizter T writes

The T4 trains will actually display T4 & 123 as a destination; the T5
trains will show T123 & 5 as a destination.

So for people heading to T123 in a hurry, and the first train is to T4
& 123, perhaps the best strategy is to board it anyway and then lean
out of the carriage at Hatton Cross to see if the platform departure
indicator (assuming that there is one) shows a T123 & 5 train less
than (say) eight minutes behind.

PaulO

I'm not sure there is a "train describer" (in endearing LU lingo) at
Hatton Cross - but if there isn't one, there needs to be!

There is now - it went in a month or two ago when the signalling work
was being done for T5.


Good, I'm glad to hear that.

In message , Richard J.
writes
Steve Fitzgerald wrote:

Last Thursday it was showing "Check front of train" for all trains,
which wasn't much use, especially if, as someone said earlier, even the
T4 trains say HEATHROW T1,2,3 on the front. Is that true? If so, it's
typical of the shambles that LU have made of the Heathrow change.

We've had discussions about this. Official instruction is that all
Heathrow trains are to display T123. We (the thinking drivers!) feel
that T4 trains should display just that, as that is the booked
destination for the train and passengers for T123 will get delayed.

Discussions continue...

The arrangement was quite well covered by the auto-announcer on the
trains. After leaving Hounslow West, it said that T4 passengers should
change at the next station, Hatton Cross, and wait for a train to T4.
This is sensible as it gives passengers a couple of minutes' notice
that they have to collect their baggage and leave the train. But this
plan was scuppered by the station assistant on the platform at Hounslow
West announcing that "this train will not call at Terminal 4.
Passengers for Terminal 4 should alight here ..." So all the T4
passengers are told this without any notice, having been kept in
ignorance until then and lied to by the line diagrams.

Assuming the DVA has been set up correctly by the driver, it will
correctly advise passengers on a T123 direct train to change at Hatton X
for the next T4 train. I always make an announcement when I'm driving a
T4 train to tell T123 passengers that we *will* call there on our return
to London but this will delay their journey by around 10 minutes and
they may wish to consider the following T123 direct train in about x (x
= the number of minutes I've noticed the following train to be) minutes.

Not all drivers set up their DVAs properly.

The thinking behind doing this business at Hounslow West is that anyone
who misses the announcements there has a second chance at Hatton X,
which I agree is a good thing.

I spoke to the SA at Hounslow West, who was reluctantly acting under
instructions but thought it was daft. He had been told to make the
announcement if the driver didn't. And he even had a sheet on which he
had to record which train drivers didn't make an announcement. This is
crazy, as the auto-announcer is set to make the announcement AFTER
leaving Hounslow West.

Now that's news to me. I now look forward to being summoned into some
manager's office to give an explanation as to why I failed to make an
appropriate announcement which wasn't needed and was perfectly addressed
by the systems they have provided - and cancelling a westbound train
into the bargain whilst we discuss this important issue!

I haven't got round to complaining to LU, having been distracted by
events above ground at Heathrow that day. Is all the above still true?
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

On 24 Jan, 22:29, "Richard J." wrote:
Steve Fitzgerald wrote:
In message
,
Mizter T writes

I'm not sure there is a "train describer" (in endearing LU lingo)
at Hatton Cross - but if there isn't one, there needs to be!

There is now - it went in a month or two ago when the signalling
work was being done for T5.

Last Thursday it was showing "Check front of train" for all trains,
which wasn't much use, especially if, as someone said earlier, even the
T4 trains say HEATHROW T1,2,3 on the front. Is that true? If so, it's
typical of the shambles that LU have made of the Heathrow change.

The describer was still showing "Check front of train" for the next
three
trains "yesterday" (Wed.)

I don't know what was on the front of the train as it was already
pulling in when I reached the bottom of the stairs - I can imagine a
spate of accidents as people start sprinting the moment they think
they hear a train.

I can't recall exactly what the internal displays said, but it
involved
T12 and 3 so I got on, and had a nice ~10 min pause at T4...

I didn't notice any change to the line diagrams, and forgot to check
for a Fantasy Piccadilly Line map.

Hth

Henry

On Thu, 24 Jan 2008 10:16:55 -0800 (PST), Steve
wrote:

On 24 Jan, 17:29, James Farrar wrote:

(Cannon Street, closed on) Sun(days), 93 million miles :-)- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Mars(ton Green) 250 million miles

I call "foul", based on the fact that the distance between Mars and
the Earth is highly variable. (the distance between the Earth and the
Sun varies by only 3.4%) :-)

Paul Terry wrote:
In message
,
Mizter T writes

Which reminds me, given the potential for confusion it has
unwittingly spawned, I must find out why Loughborough Road, on the
edge of Brixton, was so named...

Named after Lord Loughborough, who once owned a mansion there.

Does there have to be a reason for a road to be named after a place?
Manchester Rd and Prestons Rd, Gloucester Rd, Devons Rd, Belmont Road...
aren't these just arbitrary names?

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Thu, 24 Jan 2008, Mizter T wrote:

On 24 Jan, 14:47, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 14:33:58 on
Thu, 24 Jan 2008, John Rowland
remarked:

The one that started it all was Oslo (Torp) which is also 54 miles
away it seems; but Frankfurt (Hahn) is 65 miles, Stockholm
(Skavsta) 56 miles, Stockholm (Vasteras) 54 miles, Paris
(Beauvais) 42 miles.

Clapham (Junction) 2 miles, Islington (Highbury &) 1 mile

Loughborough (Junction), 116 miles.

Cyprus 1994 miles
Albany (Park) 3384 miles
West India (Quay) 4704 miles

.... although West India Quay is actually named after the West Indies, not
West India.

Beat that!

Tamworth (Road) 10390 miles