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Old August 27th 03, 11:28 AM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am trying to
track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus garages. They are :-

1) The original Kingston garage in Richmond Road. Where on Richmond
Road was it?

2) The ex-Metroline garage somewhere on Victoria Road, between Gypsy
Corner and Old Oak Lane (Not to be confused with the PRESENT depot on
Atlas Road just off the northern end of Victoria Road)

3) The depot at Hornchurch. Strictly speaking, this was NOT in
Hornchurch, but on Hornchurch Road, west of Hornchurch proper. I
suspect that it was on the north side of Hornchurch Road a couple of
hundred yards east of Roneo Corner. Could anyone confirm/correct my
guess?

4) Where are the Mitcham Belle Darts garaged? There is no way they can
get into the yard at 223 Streatham Road. I have found a Mitcham Belle
depot, just south of Beddington Lane Tram stop, but it looked
deserted.

5) Where was Riverside Garage? I thought it was somewhere on the
one-way system surrounding the current bus station, but a photograph I
saw said it was on Talgarth Road.

6) Where was Hammersmith depot? I am talking about the former
trolleybus & BEA coach garage. Was it in Great Church Lane?

7) Exactly where on Shrubland Road was Dalston Depot? I have walked
the full length of it, and there is no evidence that there was a depot
here. For some reason the street name “Ivydene Avenue”
comes to mind, but that name does not appear in my A-to-Z.

8) Sovereign Buses had a depot somewhere in Borehamwood, in the days
when it was called BTS (BT survives as a depot code for vehicles
allocated to Edgware). Where was this depot in Borehamwood?

9) I know that the former Seven Kings depot was on the south side of
the main road between Seven Kings and Goodmayes railway stations. Am I
right in assuming that it was opposite Blythswood Road?

10) There is a "new" operator around Debden called “DOCKLANDS
MINIBUSES” with a “legal-lettering” address of St.
Marys Road (?) in Upminster. The address turns out to be the office of
an accountant specialising in tax-avoidance (or something similar)!
Where are the vehicles garaged?

11) The depot that effectively replaced Loughton appears to be Debden,
with codes DB and DD. Where is it? Someone told me that it is in
Langston Road, but when I went there, I could only find a lorry park
where there were some buses parked. Surely this cannot be it?

12) The original Uxbridge depot (before the present one next to the
tube station) was in Denham Road. Exactly where?

13) Am I correct in assuming that the site of the Sidcup Garage (at
Foots Cray) is now occupied by a LIDL store (who have also built
stores on the sites of Hackney(H), Hanwell(HL) and Rye Lane Peckham
(RL)

Thanks in advance

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Old August 27th 03, 12:50 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

Nick Hewitt wrote:
Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am
trying to track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus
garages. They are :-


5) Where was Riverside Garage? I thought it was somewhere
on the one-way system surrounding the current bus station,
but a photograph I saw said it was on Talgarth Road.


It was, There was an entrance in Talgarth Road and the exit round the
corner. Here are some photos:-

http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg01.jpg

http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg02.jpg

http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg03.jpg


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Old August 27th 03, 06:11 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

In message , Piccadilly.Pilot
writes

5) Where was Riverside Garage? I thought it was somewhere
on the one-way system surrounding the current bus station,
but a photograph I saw said it was on Talgarth Road.


It was, There was an entrance in Talgarth Road


Not exactly. The entrance was in Great Church Street, below the
Hammersmith Flyover. I'm not sure whether the latter can still be called
Talgarth Road once it merges into the flyover, but the bus garage was
undoubtedly situated at ground level, just to the east of the exit from
the current Hammersmith Bus Station.

and the exit round the corner. Here are some photos:-


http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg01.jpg


That photo shows the exit in Queen Caroline Street. The building is
still there (just), now converted to Smollensky's restaurant. When
coming off the A4 from the west it is the one brick building in a sea of
glass and concrete that is almost directly in front of you as you enter
the Hammersmith one-way system - although what you see is the back of
the original building (read on).

It has an extraordinary history - worth recounting for those that don't
know it. The garage was originally constructed in 1736 as Bradmore
House, a Georgian manor house built in the grounds of the huge
16th-century Butterwick House. The latter was demolished in 1836 and the
District Railway eventually built its Hammersmith terminus in the
grounds. Bradmore House itself survived and still looked pristine in
photos of the early 20th century.

Then, in an act of breathtaking vandalism, the London General Omnibus
Company purchased the Georgian building in 1913, removed its innards in
order to create a garage and knocked holes large enough to take
double-deckers in the back (the west side) of each of its wings. These
can be seen in photo 2 (below) that you found.

Later most of the front (east side) was removed in order to provide
access through the former front garden of the house to the new, larger
garage just round the corner (photo 3). It was all renamed Riverside
Garage in 1950.

The "restoration" of Bradmore House as part of the Broadway Centre in
the 1990s was a nice gesture - but as much because it relieves the vast
and undistinguished bulk of the rest, rather than as a real restoration
as such. A little of the rear (west) facade was saved - click the link
at http://www.lambsbricks.com/nav/info_projects_03.htm - but most of it
is totally new construction in the style of the original.

http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg02.jpg


That's a clearer picture of the same.

http://www.piccadillypilot.co.uk/hmbus/HMbsgrg03.jpg


That's the entrance in Great Church Street - the Hammersmith Flyover
extension of Talgarth Road is seen passing overhead, so its very close.

--
Paul Terry
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Old August 27th 03, 06:39 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

In message , Nick
Hewitt writes

5) Where was Riverside Garage? I thought it was somewhere on the
one-way system surrounding the current bus station, but a photograph I
saw said it was on Talgarth Road.


It was in Great Church Street which is indeed on the present one-way
system. It was just to the east of the exit from the new Hammersmith Bus
Station (see other post).

6) Where was Hammersmith depot? I am talking about the former
trolleybus & BEA coach garage. Was it in Great Church Lane?


No, it was certainly not the same garage as Riverside - I think the bus
garage was renamed as "Riverside" in order to avoid confusion between
the two.

I'm almost certain that the trolleybus depot was in Shepherd's Bush
Road, next to the old Osram Lamp Factory (now Tesco) facing Brook Green,
and backing onto more LT land (the Hammersmith & City line depot).
There's a picture at http://www.trolleybus.net/resume.htm (scroll down
to the bottom left).

--
Paul Terry
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Old August 27th 03, 06:45 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages


"Nick Hewitt" wrote:

Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am trying to
track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus garages. They are :-


(snip)

3) The depot at Hornchurch. Strictly speaking, this was NOT in
Hornchurch, but on Hornchurch Road, west of Hornchurch proper. I
suspect that it was on the north side of Hornchurch Road a couple of
hundred yards east of Roneo Corner. Could anyone confirm/correct my
guess?


The garage was on the south side of Hornchurch Road, roughly opposite the
junction with Hyland Way. It was separated from the junction with Candover
Road by a small parade of shops, which remain, though the garage site has
been redeveloped as housing. Also, though the garage was well out of town,
that location does carry a Hornchurch, rather than Romford, postal address,
and is much closer to the former. I wonder how the garage got the RD code?
Romford Garage, of course, carrying the NS code and being known to this day
as North Street.

Chris




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Old August 27th 03, 07:11 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

In message , Nick
Hewitt writes

Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am trying to
track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus garages. They are :-

1) The original Kingston garage in Richmond Road. Where on Richmond
Road was it?


I wouldn't be surprised if this is simply the garage in Clarence Street
that closed only recently when the new bus station opened around the
corner in Cromwell Road.

What is now called Clarence Street is shown as the southernmost part of
Richmond Road in my 1948 A-Z map of the area.

--
Paul Terry
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Old August 27th 03, 11:05 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages


"Nick Hewitt" wrote in message
om...
Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am trying to
track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus garages. They are :-


10) There is a "new" operator around Debden called “DOCKLANDS
MINIBUSES” with a “legal-lettering” address of St.
Marys Road (?) in Upminster. The address turns out to be the office of
an accountant specialising in tax-avoidance (or something similar)!
Where are the vehicles garaged?


Quixley St - E14


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Old August 28th 03, 11:56 AM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages


"Nick Hewitt" wrote in message
om...
Hi people. This is a bit long, so please bear with me. I am trying to
track down a number of past & present ex-LT bus garages. They are :-

1) The original Kingston garage in Richmond Road. Where on Richmond
Road was it?

This is the garage that closed in 2000 and is now a cinema complex. Richmond
Road was renamed Clarence Road at some point

2) The ex-Metroline garage somewhere on Victoria Road, between Gypsy
Corner and Old Oak Lane (Not to be confused with the PRESENT depot on
Atlas Road just off the northern end of Victoria Road)


The old R & I tours garage? It was on the one way system just off the A40.
It closed in 2000 and I believe is being redeveloped.

4) Where are the Mitcham Belle Darts garaged? There is no way they can
get into the yard at 223 Streatham Road. I have found a Mitcham Belle
depot, just south of Beddington Lane Tram stop, but it looked
deserted.


The buses are at the DETR depot on Redhouse Road Croydon

7) Exactly where on Shrubland Road was Dalston Depot? I have walked
the full length of it, and there is no evidence that there was a depot
here. For some reason the street name “Ivydene Avenue”
comes to mind, but that name does not appear in my A-to-Z.


Was on Iveydene Road. I believe the whole area has been redeveloped totally.

8) Sovereign Buses had a depot somewhere in Borehamwood, in the days
when it was called BTS (BT survives as a depot code for vehicles
allocated to Edgware). Where was this depot in Borehamwood?


By the station. Again the area has been redeveloped removing all trace of
previous use.

11) The depot that effectively replaced Loughton appears to be Debden,

with codes DB and DD. Where is it? Someone told me that it is in
Langston Road, but when I went there, I could only find a lorry park
where there were some buses parked. Surely this cannot be it?


Wrong. Loughton closed in May 1986 due to various tendering losses. The yard
(lorry park as you say ) that Arriva Shires park the buses for their
tendered services in is a fairly recent addition.

12) The original Uxbridge depot (before the present one next to the
tube station) was in Denham Road. Exactly where?


Funnily I drove along Denham Road yesterday and couldn't see any sign of the
old depot. I believe it was about a mile or so out of town

13) Am I correct in assuming that the site of the Sidcup Garage (at
Foots Cray) is now occupied by a LIDL store (who have also built
stores on the sites of Hackney(H), Hanwell(HL) and Rye Lane Peckham
(RL)


Yes

Hope this helps

Paul



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Old August 28th 03, 01:07 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
rob rob is offline
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Default Old LT Garages


"Paul Terry" wrote in message
...
In message , Nick
Hewitt writes

5) Where was Riverside Garage? I thought it was somewhere on the
one-way system surrounding the current bus station, but a photograph I
saw said it was on Talgarth Road.


It was in Great Church Street which is indeed on the present one-way
system. It was just to the east of the exit from the new Hammersmith Bus
Station (see other post).

6) Where was Hammersmith depot? I am talking about the former
trolleybus & BEA coach garage. Was it in Great Church Lane?


No, it was certainly not the same garage as Riverside - I think the bus
garage was renamed as "Riverside" in order to avoid confusion between
the two.

I'm almost certain that the trolleybus depot was in Shepherd's Bush
Road, next to the old Osram Lamp Factory (now Tesco) facing Brook Green,
and backing onto more LT land (the Hammersmith & City line depot).
There's a picture at http://www.trolleybus.net/resume.htm (scroll down
to the bottom left).


Afraid it wasn't! The old trolleybus depot and adjacent buildings were
located on the east side of the District/Picc. tube station. They were all
demolished when the current Hammersmith one-way system was developed. The
road now called Butterwick covers much of the land where these buildings
stood.

Rob Griffith


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Old August 28th 03, 04:07 PM posted to uk.transport.buses,uk.transport.london
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Default Old LT Garages

In message , rob
writes

"Paul Terry" wrote in message
...


I'm almost certain that the trolleybus depot was in Shepherd's Bush
Road, next to the old Osram Lamp Factory (now Tesco) facing Brook Green,
and backing onto more LT land (the Hammersmith & City line depot).
There's a picture at http://www.trolleybus.net/resume.htm (scroll down
to the bottom left).


Afraid it wasn't! The old trolleybus depot and adjacent buildings were
located on the east side of the District/Picc. tube station.


Ah, thanks. Presumably the front was facing north onto the Broadway
itself? Looking again at the photo I mentioned I can see that the
traffic island would be one of those that used to run down the middle of
the Broadway.

It occurs to me that what is now the Hammersmith one-way system has had
a trolleybus depot on its north side, bus garages on the south and west
sides, the old Butterwick bus station on the east side and now the new
bus station in the middle. Quite a record!

--
Paul Terry


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