Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

In message
"R.C. Payne" wrote:

Graeme Wall wrote:
In message
"Lüko Willms" wrote:

Am Wed, 26 Mar 2008 09:50:54 UTC, schrieb Graeme Wall
auf uk.railway :

And speaking some other language than German might be an advantage
when the sales personnel originates from a country whose language you
master.

As for your last paragraph, I speak rather less Turkish than German.
Well, the salesperson might have migrated from Pakistan, Sri Lanka,
or India...

If I put a smiley on the end, would it make it more obvious that I was
cracking a slight (very slight!) joke?

You know what they say about the German sense of humour...


Not true IME, not even the Prussians who are renowned for not having one. It
can tend towards the practical joke end of the spectrum.

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

Roland Perry wrote
I'm disappointed they aren't doing the rowing in Nottingham - I could
have walked to the venue!

I was under the impression that the Row course at Holme Point(?) was
not up to standard and a NEW facility needed to be brought into
use.
I think its to do with the average wind speed over the course being in
the main more than that allowed.
I could be talking a load of old ******
--
dave hill

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

In message , at
23:23:42 on Tue, 25 Mar 2008, Tom Anderson
remarked:
I remain a supporter of the 2012 Games, I think it'll do a lot of good
in a great many different ways.

I'm disappointed they aren't doing the rowing in Nottingham - I could
have walked to the venue!

Yeah, well Nottingham didn't win the Olympic competition, did it,
London did!

Neither did Weymouth, but that's where the sailing is going to be.

Seems odd to decide to build a brand new rowing lake in the congested
London suburbs when we already have an Olympic sized one (and the
National Centre) at Nottingham.
--
Roland Perry

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

In message , at 16:09:41 on
Wed, 26 Mar 2008, dave hill remarked:
I'm disappointed they aren't doing the rowing in Nottingham - I could
have walked to the venue!

I was under the impression that the Row course at Holme Point(?) was
not up to standard and a NEW facility needed to be brought into
use.

MRD applies.
--
Roland Perry

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

In message , Roland Perry
writes

Seems odd to decide to build a brand new rowing lake in the congested
London suburbs when we already have an Olympic sized one (and the
National Centre) at Nottingham.

Its hardly brand new - Eton's rowing lake opened some years ago and
hosted the 2006 World Rowing Championships, as I recall.
--
Paul Terry

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

In message , at 17:16:42 on Wed, 26 Mar
2008, Paul Terry remarked:
Seems odd to decide to build a brand new rowing lake in the congested
London suburbs when we already have an Olympic sized one (and the
National Centre) at Nottingham.

Its hardly brand new - Eton's rowing lake opened some years ago and
hosted the 2006 World Rowing Championships, as I recall.

Fair enough. I was sure they were building a new lake near Slough. I
must have misheard.
--
Roland Perry

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

On Wed, 26 Mar 2008, John B wrote:

On 26 Mar, 11:50, Graeme Wall wrote:

Generally, you don't have to know the local language to buy something,
gestures of yes and no, indicating numbers by figures or the amount of
money would be enough.

And speaking some other language than German might be an advantage
when the sales personnel originates from a country whose language you
master.

As for your last paragraph, I speak rather less Turkish than German.

Oddly enough, I've just successfully purchased six months' supply of
contact lenses [at 1/3 of UK opticians' prices for the same brand made
in the same US factory. Can we wind up that cartel next please?], some
groceries and toiletries, and a toasted sandwich - all from people who
speak Turkish and no English.

What was in the sandwich?

tom

--
GOLDIE LOOKIN' CHAIN [...] will ultimately make all other forms of music
both redundant and unnecessary -- NTK

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

On Wed, 26 Mar 2008, Roland Perry wrote:

In message , at 23:23:42 on
Tue, 25 Mar 2008, Tom Anderson remarked:

I remain a supporter of the 2012 Games, I think it'll do a lot of good
in a great many different ways.

I'm disappointed they aren't doing the rowing in Nottingham - I could have
walked to the venue!

Yeah, well Nottingham didn't win the Olympic competition, did it, London
did!

Neither did Weymouth, but that's where the sailing is going to be.

Yes, and i'm still annoyed about that. What exactly is wrong with the
Thames estuary, i ask?

Apart from the ships.

tom

--
GOLDIE LOOKIN' CHAIN [...] will ultimately make all other forms of music
both redundant and unnecessary -- NTK

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

On Tue, 25 Mar 2008, Mr Thant wrote:

On 25 Mar, 23:49, Tom Anderson wrote:

The Jubilee?

To Docklands. AIUI the Jubilee between London Bridge and North
Greenwich is already one of the most congested bits of the network.

Right. And how is Crossrail going to relieve that? By letting people on
the North Kent line from east of Abbey Wood change there? That's not
exactly a huge fraction of the Jubilee's passengers, is it? And don't they
already have the option to do Greenwich - Docklands by DLR? Not that
that's exactly a high-capacity route itself.

True. All of which could be done without the tunnel, for a fraction of the
price.

And without increasing any capacity from the termini to where people
work/shop/go out/etc, which is the whole point of the current iteration
of the project.

Entirely agreed. But the point i was making in the text that's been
snipped is that the Crossrail project doesn't deliver significant
increases in capacity outside central London, and none that couldn't be
provided much more cheaply.

Again, could be done without the tunnel.

And where do you plan to build the extra platforms at Paddington and
Liverpool Street?

Liverpool Street isn't limited by platform capacity, it's limited by
capacity through the station throat. Rebuilding that is entirely possible,
although of course not trivial. I don't know about Paddington, i have to
confess. But since all we're talking about is lengthening trains, why do
we need more platforms?

Do we know how much of the budget is for this? My understanding was that
Oxford Circus wasn't going to be rebuilt; the Crossrail station would be
essentialy separate. It thus has a slightly marginal effect on
overcrowding - the people relieved onto Crossrail will no longer be
clogging the place up, but plenty of other people will. No idea about TCR.

Slightly marginal? The two Crossrail stations adjacent to Oxford Circus
will have enormous entrances at the ends nearest to it, exactly to
attract the crowds away without overcrowding the actual Oxford Circus
area. In theory at least they're hoping to attract away a lot more
passengers.

If you're going into Oxford Circus to get on the Victoria line, this isn't
going to make any difference whatsoever. The new bit being added, however
enormous, will only decongest the existing station to the extent that they
can abstract passengers away from the Central line.

tom

--
GOLDIE LOOKIN' CHAIN [...] will ultimately make all other forms of music
both redundant and unnecessary -- NTK

Crossrail could bankrupt London - says Ken Livingstone
 

On Mar 26, 9:17*am, Mizter T wrote:
On 26 Mar, 05:59, The Real Doctor wrote:





On 25 Mar, 22:15, Tony Polson wrote:

Dan G wrote:

On Mar 25, 1:37 pm, Tony Polson wrote:

Dan G wrote:
I think the real rub of Crossrail is that for £16bn you could have
pretty much every other project one would want on the rest of the
English network -- Weald re-openings, East-West routes, lots of
electrification, old alignments and useful chords reopened, lots of
railfrieght interchanges etc. All that would benefit more people in
more places than Crossrail ever will.

Complete tosh.

Please explain.

No point lecturing to the deaf.

And that, Dan, is all you'll get, I'm afraid.

Irritating, isn't it.

I'm guessing that Mr Polson doesn't think £16bn would cover the cost
of all these other projects, but as he hasn't deemed it necessary to
clarify himself when asked politely

Behavior many of us are used to seeing. We have learned to ignore it.