In message , at 15:54:36 on Thu, 16 Jul
2009, Charles Lindsey remarked:
Is a "private hire" car (aka minicab) public transport?

Not unless you can walk up to one in the street and request immediate
transport to some destination (i.e. unless it is a "Hackney Carriage").

Can you walk up to a railway station and "hail" a train for immediate
transport in the same way?

I think not.

The important property of "Public" transport, is that anyone [with
money] can use it. But sometimes you have to book it in advance.
--
Roland Perry

In message , Recliner
writes

Public transport in the UK is subject to VAT but at 0%:-
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/start/introduction.htm
which also has a paragraph "The difference between exempt and
zero-rated" although some of our resident VAT-handlers might be able
to improve on the explanation as the HMRC page does not really say
much about those who might "buy" at 0% but then have to charge their
own customers at a non-zero rate.

The point is that the travel by train or plane has a zero VAT rate, but
the service I bill my customer for has a standard VAT rate (currently
15%), regardless of the VAT rates on the inputs.

15%? Isn't VAT 17.5%?
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

On Jul 16, 4:54*pm, "Charles Lindsey" wrote:

In Roland Perry writes:

Is a "private hire" car (aka minicab) public transport?

Not unless you can walk up to one in the street and request immediate
transport to some destination (i.e. unless it is a "Hackney Carriage").

Erm, back in the day in the London of pre-minicab regulation that was
nonetheless a very common occurrence (much to the ire of black cab aka
Hackney Carriage drivers), and it's hardly unknown today either.

"Steve Fitzgerald" ] wrote in message

In message , Recliner
writes

Public transport in the UK is subject to VAT but at 0%:-
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/start/introduction.htm
which also has a paragraph "The difference between exempt and
zero-rated" although some of our resident VAT-handlers might be able
to improve on the explanation as the HMRC page does not really say
much about those who might "buy" at 0% but then have to charge their
own customers at a non-zero rate.

The point is that the travel by train or plane has a zero VAT rate,
but the service I bill my customer for has a standard VAT rate
(currently 15%), regardless of the VAT rates on the inputs.

15%? Isn't VAT 17.5%?

No

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
"Steve Fitzgerald" ] wrote

15%? Isn't VAT 17.5%?

No
Temporarily reduced from 17.5% for just over a year from December 2008 to
December 2009. This was suggested by former Tory Chancellor Ken Clarke as a
way of reducing the effect of the recession; the Labour Government jumped at
the idea without thinking it through themselves; and the Tory Opposition now
says it was a stupid idea that isn't working.

Peter

Mizter T wrote:
On Jul 16, 4:54 pm, "Charles Lindsey" wrote:

In Roland Perry
writes:

Is a "private hire" car (aka minicab) public transport?

Not unless you can walk up to one in the street and request immediate
transport to some destination (i.e. unless it is a "Hackney
Carriage").

Erm, back in the day in the London of pre-minicab regulation that was
nonetheless a very common occurrence (much to the ire of black cab aka
Hackney Carriage drivers), and it's hardly unknown today either.

The only feature of London minicabs which is designed specifically to serve
the interest of the public rather than the interest of the minicab
drivers/bosses is the fact that the drivers are verified to have been
convicted of no rapes since coming to this country. By contrast, London
taxis have numerous features which serve no interest to the driver but serve
the interest of the city as a whole - the tight turning circle which
approximately doubles the cost of the vehicle but prevents London from being
permanently gridlocked being the most obvious one.

Certain minicab companies march short distance passengers to the nearest
taxi rank in the knowledge that the taxis are legally compelled to take
these money-losing rides. By increasing the proportion of money-losing rides
picked up at that rank, they deter taxis from using that rank in future,
ultimately bankrupting and emptying the taxi rank. This allows the minicab
company to then take back those short rides but charge much more than the
taxis used to charge, GBP20 now being the minimum fare for some minicab
companies at night - if the passenger can fit in a car, that is, those
wheelchair users can all go to hell once the taxis are gone. The minicab
ethos is about as far from the public transport ethos as you can get.

On 17 July, 12:46, "Basil Jet"
wrote:
Mizter T wrote:
On Jul 16, 4:54 pm, "Charles Lindsey" wrote:

In Roland Perry
writes:

Is a "private hire" car (aka minicab) public transport?

Not unless you can walk up to one in the street and request immediate
transport to some destination (i.e. unless it is a "Hackney
Carriage").

Erm, back in the day in the London of pre-minicab regulation that was
nonetheless a very common occurrence (much to the ire of black cab aka
Hackney Carriage drivers), and it's hardly unknown today either.

The only feature of London minicabs which is designed specifically to serve
the interest of the public rather than the interest of the minicab
drivers/bosses is the fact that the drivers are verified to have been
convicted of no rapes since coming to this country. By contrast, London
taxis have numerous features which serve no interest to the driver but serve
the interest of the city as a whole - the tight turning circle which
approximately doubles the cost of the vehicle but prevents London from being
permanently gridlocked being the most obvious one.

Certain minicab companies march short distance passengers to the nearest
taxi rank in the knowledge that the taxis are legally compelled to take
these money-losing rides. By increasing the proportion of money-losing rides
picked up at that rank, they deter taxis from using that rank in future,
ultimately bankrupting and emptying the taxi rank. This allows the minicab
company to then take back those short rides but charge much more than the
taxis used to charge, GBP20 now being the minimum fare for some minicab
companies at night - if the passenger can fit in a car, that is, those
wheelchair users can all go to hell once the taxis are gone. The minicab
ethos is about as far from the public transport ethos as you can get.

Leave The Market to sort everything out in everyone's best interests.
The Market is a benign force for Good, unlike Regulation, which is
Evil.

In message
, at
05:59:59 on Fri, 17 Jul 2009, MIG
remarked:
Leave The Market to sort everything out in everyone's best interests.
The Market is a benign force for Good, unlike Regulation, which is
Evil.

So you'd prefer that all NXEC's customers lost their money (tickets
bought in advance etc) if they cease trading?
--
Roland Perry

"Roland Perry" wrote in message

In message
,
at 05:59:59 on Fri, 17 Jul 2009, MIG
remarked:
Leave The Market to sort everything out in everyone's best interests.
The Market is a benign force for Good, unlike Regulation, which is
Evil.

So you'd prefer that all NXEC's customers lost their money (tickets
bought in advance etc) if they cease trading?

Obviously that won't happen, but I wonder what the exact mechanism for
the transfer will be? Will the new DfT ECML operating company simply
take over NXEC, complete with all its staff, leases, assets, contracts,
etc, or will there be some messy transfer of all of these to the new
company?

On 17 July, 14:17, Roland Perry wrote:
In message
, at
05:59:59 on Fri, 17 Jul 2009, MIG
remarked:

Leave The Market to sort everything out in everyone's best interests.
The Market is a benign force for Good, unlike Regulation, which is
Evil.

So you'd prefer that all NXEC's customers lost their money (tickets
bought in advance etc) if they cease trading?

That's an excellent example of the Good that the Market has to offer
to Customers. Other examples welcome.