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London National Rail - Permits To Travel discontinued but still required by Law !!!
"Stephen Furley" wrote in message ... On May 24, 8:48 am, "Peter Masson" wrote: "CJB" wrote in message ... There is increasing concern that traincos serving London (and eslewhere around the country) are refusing to accept cash as payment for tickets from their automatic ticket machines. This is causing massive disrupution to potential customers especially those youngsters who do not have a credit card, or in London those whose Oyster card has run out and cannot be topped up. This situation also disadvantages thousands of tourists who expect to be able to purchase train tickets from machines with cash. In the greater London area the National Rail stations are in what is termed a 'Penalty Fare Zone.' Travelling within this zone without a ticket can incur a huge penalty fine. If tickets cannot be purchased for travel within this zone - even if the automatic ticket machines are u/s - then 'Permit to Travel' tickets are supposed to be purchased from another machine for a nominal amount of cash. These tickets then make the travel legal. The balance of the fare is then supposed to be paid at the destination. These are the ONLY tickets available for cash - well used to be. However despite PTTs being a legal requirement in the Penalty Fare Zone(s) the Permits to Travel ticket issuing machines are frequently switched off, or have been removed altogether. Notices clearly displayed at most stations state that it is a legal requirement to purchase these special PTT tickets. Yet many (most / all?) traincos have closed down or removed the PTT machines. So what is the legal situation whereas the requirement is to purchase these PTT tickets, yet the machines that issue them have been removed? Both the National Rail National Conditions of Carriage and the TfL Railway Byelaws make it clear that the requirement to hold a ticket in a Penalty Fare Area / Compulsory Ticket Area do not apply if, at the station where the passenger commenced his journey, there was no ticket office open and no ticket machine in full working order. Peter What does 'full working order' mean? If there is a machine which normally takes cash and cards but at that time is taking cards only would this be considered to be not in full working order? If another station had a machine which was only designed to take cards, and was in full working order, then the situation would effectively be the same as at the other station, where the machine may, or may not, be considered to be in full working order. I take full working order to mean that it can take cash payments in coins or notes and give change. If it is designed also to take cards but can't it's again not in full working order, as a passenger can reasonably expect to use a card and may not have the requisite cash available. In either of these circumstances I would expect a penalty fare, if issued, to be cancelled, and I can't see a TOC or TfL daring to proceed with a prosecution as the magistrates would make their representative look extremely small. Peter |
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