Scott wrote:
But if people walk will they not spend less time on the escalator,
leaving more capacity for others? A 70mph road must be able to carry
more traffic each hour than a 30mph road.


OTOH the escalators I observe have, even during peak periods, more and
bigger gaps on the left than on the right. As with roads, not everyone
walks even if there is space to do so; and then not all at the same
speed. And unlike roads with 70 mph speed limits, the left side of
escalators doesn't leave scope for overtaking. Unless escalator
leapfrog is the next leap forwards


--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

On Sun, 29 Nov 2015 13:57:04 +0000, Scott
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Nov 2015 13:00:51 +0100, Eric wrote:



I wouldn't object, I believe the capacity argument, and I always have.
When I first came to London 26 years ago, I was appalled at the convention
of standing on one side only. Think about it. Every time a step arrives
at the end of the escalator, 0 or 1 or 2 people get off. For maximum
capacity, it needs to be 2. On the right-hand side currently, there can
(with minor exceptions) be one person per step. On the left-hand side,
because, as you say, walking needs a bit more inter-person space, there
will never be one person for every step, so full capacity is never
being used.

But if people walk will they not spend less time on the escalator,
leaving more capacity for others? A 70mph road must be able to carry
more traffic each hour than a 30mph road.

You're assuming that the gaps between vehicles don't increase as
vehicle speed increases. They do on the motorway (though perhaps not
enough for safety), and they do between walkers on escalators compared
to standers.

wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2015 10:47:38 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote:



I really doubt the capacity arguments: it may be true that you get more
people on the standing side than on the walking side as walking needs a
bit more inter-person space, but on the other hand the number of people
per second is greater. I wonder if they have really done any
measurements?

It would be trivial to measu just stand at the top of one of the
escalators that has for the duration of the experiment people standing
on one side and walking up the other, and count how many people step off
the top on each side in a fixed period of time. A minute would be plenty
long enough.

Could the result vary with the demographic of the users and the time
and location.
In the rush hours or when a large sports event such as Arsenal at Home
is about to take place I would think that the majority of users will
be reasonably fit and in a hurry and many actaully run up at a fast
pace.

After the time Freedom pass use becomes available a whole load of
other users who don't need to rush around start to use the
system,while a lot will just stand a number will walk up to pass them
but not as many actually run.

Freedom passes are available for use 24 hours a day on the Tube. But
retired people are less likely to use the Underground during the crowded
peaks.

On 29.11.15 11:52, Offramp wrote:
On Sunday, 29 November 2015 10:27:42 UTC, Scott wrote:

Or tell people not to stand on the escalators and keep walking :-)

Walking is bad for escalators. It damages them.

How so?

On 29.11.15 13:12, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2015\11\29 10:27, Scott wrote:
On Sun, 29 Nov 2015 10:13:26 +0000, Clive Page
wrote:

I'm surprised nobody else has noted here what I saw last week in (I
think) the Evening Standard: that TfL are about to tell passengers at
Holborn not to walk up the escalators. They claim that the
passenger-carrying capacity is greater when people stand on both left
and right. There was no mention of a penalty for those trying to walk
up the left hand side, but as we all know, it only takes one person to
block that side by standing on it for the whole system to degrade to
standing on both sides.

I really doubt the capacity arguments: it may be true that you get more
people on the standing side than on the walking side as walking needs a
bit more inter-person space, but on the other hand the number of people
per second is greater. I wonder if they have really done any
measurements?

A much more productive move, in my opinion, would be to run their
escalators a bit faster: those in Moscow, Kiev, and other former soviet
cities, go about 50% faster in my experience. It comes as a slight
surprise to the visitor, but people seem to cope.

Or tell people not to stand on the escalators and keep walking :-)

If would help if they stopped telling us we must carry a dog.

I would think that this is a pretty good idea, particularly in the case
of smaller dogs. I have seen teeth at the top and bottom eat peoples'
shoes.

On 29.11.15 13:37, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2015\11\29 13:17, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 12:59:54 on
Sun, 29 Nov 2015, Recliner remarked:

Already done:
http://www.iimahd.ernet.in/assets/sn...f/2002-11-01Go
utamDutta.pdf

"For a double escalator with a rise greater than about 18.5 metres,
capacity would be greater if people could be encouraged to stand on both
sides."

From page 28:

Conclusion
It is therefore concluded that:

• Passengers will not stand on both sides of an escalator simply
because they are asked to.

• When passengers do stand on both sides capacity is high but this is
only because the majority of passengers do not treat the left hand
side as a standing side.

• However, except for short periods of time, passengers will not stand
on both sides unless they are persuaded (such as through an
advertising campaign) to treat both sides as standing sides.

• If passengers could be persuaded to treat both sides as standing
sides, capacity would not be so high and, if the assumptions made are
correct, it would only be advantageous for high rise double escalators
and for corner A double escalators.

• To impose such a selective policy would be even more difficult than
persuading passengers to stand on all escalators and the benefit
gained would be minimal.



So if I get on an escalator and walk forward then I'm preventing the
people behind me from getting on, but if I stop dead immediately I'm
helping the progress of the people behind me. That seems incredible.

That's the one thing that really annoys be about the use of high-volume
escalators; People stop immediately before getting on because they think
that they have to place their foot directly on the flat surface.

On Sunday, 29 November 2015 17:04:36 UTC, wrote:

Walking is bad for escalators. It damages them.

How so?

Standing on an escalator causes no damage. But walking on an escalator can cause flumatics in the Lower Machine Chamber.

On 2015-11-29, Scott wrote:
8 --------
But if people walk will they not spend less time on the escalator,
leaving more capacity for others?

Yes, they will spend less time individually, but there will still be fewer
of them getting off the escalator in any given time interval, so they
are not leaving capacity for others. Also by doing this they increase
the total transit time for those who walk, not because of time spent on
the escalator, but because of increased queuing time to get onto it.

A 70mph road must be able to carry
more traffic each hour than a 30mph road.

No.

Eric
--
ms fnd in a lbry

"Basil Jet" wrote

Or tell people not to stand on the escalators and keep walking :-)

If would help if they stopped telling us we must carry a dog.


"dogs must be carried" so dog or dogs.

--
Mike D

Recliner wrote on Sun, 29 Nov 2015 at
15:10:22:
wrote:

Could the result vary with the demographic of the users and the time
and location. In the rush hours or when a large sports event such as
Arsenal at Home is about to take place I would think that the
majority of users will be reasonably fit and in a hurry and many
actaully run up at a fast pace.

After the time Freedom pass use becomes available a whole load of
other users who don't need to rush around start to use the
system,while a lot will just stand a number will walk up to pass them
but not as many actually run.

Freedom passes are available for use 24 hours a day on the Tube. But
retired people are less likely to use the Underground during the crowded
peaks.

True. No room for my usual 115ppm trot up the escalator.
--
Iain Archer