Turning London orange
 

In message , at 18:01:42 on Fri, 23 Sep
2016, Mizter T remarked:
The London mayor aims to deliver better, more coordinated local
services to local voters.

In the same way he aimed not to raise fares, and within days of taking
office had to retract?

He's delivering exactly what he said he would: a TfL fares freeze. He
never promised to freeze other fares, and has no ability to do so.

Actually he did, and I agree he doesn't.

He didn't promise any more than that, and didn't "retract" anything.

From his manifesto...

"Freeze TfL transport fares for four years [...]"
(page 8, PDF page 9)

http://preview.tinyurl.com/SadiqManifesto2016

The paragraph from his manifesto which was quoted the most was:

"Londoners won't pay a penny more for their travel in 2020 than they do
today."

Londoners don't only use trains where TfL sets the fares.
--
Roland Perry

Turning London orange
 

In message
-sept
ember.org, at 19:50:29 on Fri, 23 Sep 2016, Recliner
remarked:

while the unions are indulging in incessant strikes and sickies on
Southern that

Southern just want their pay cheque. The policy (and the hit on the
fares basket) are down to the DfT.

simply wants to change the role of train guards, with no loss of jobs
or conditions.

--
Roland Perry

Turning London orange
 

On 2016\09\22 06:21, Charles Ellson wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 03:23:04 +0100, Basil Jet
wrote:

On 2016\09\21 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services into
the Overground:

http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...erent-6143328/


Thanks. Looks like Deptford Park (Surrey Canal Road) is not getting
built at all!

New Bermondsey Shirley ? It seems to be dependant on if/when the
related development gets finished (or even started). This month's
start date seems to be some time next year.
https://www.lewisham.gov.uk/inmyarea...d-answers.aspx


Thanks. I still thinks it's a bad idea... they should build a station
instead where the Surrey Quays - New Cross Gate line crosses Surrey
Canal Road[*], and maybe put platforms on the London Bridge to Deptford
/ New Cross lines as well, and abandon the ELL New Cross branch. This
would improve interchange, and the site would be equidistant from
existing stations instead of around the corner from South Bermondsey.
[*] There are curvature and possibly gradient issues here

Turning London orange
 

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 14:36:39 +0000 (UTC), d wrote:

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living in a
cave for the last 20 years.

This is ill thought out nonsense. It looks to me like Mr Kahn wants
to leave his mark (fundamentally change London?)

Future authorities will have to sort out the mess. The travelling
public meanwhile will suffer.

Turning London orange
 

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:27:37 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


wrote in message ...
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services
into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy
time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living
in a
cave for the last 20 years.

--
Spud


The seem to think that they can magic up slots to provide a 10 minute
frequency on every route

Exactly, but Mr Kahn might make it happen. And, as you say below:

whilst this might work on the routes that terminate inside (or just outside)
of the London "Zone", this is not going to work for the routes which carry
main line services to the coast.

Living on the Portsmouth Direct, as one does, this does not bode well.
We need improved frequencies. That could come with the conversion of
Waterloo International and a grade separated junction at Woking. But,
NOT if Mr Kahn is going to take a big chunk of the paths out of
Waterloo for his Metro Service.

Turning London orange
 

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:58:58 +0100, "
wrote:

On 22.09.16 16:48, Recliner wrote:
tim... wrote:

wrote in message ...
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services
into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy
time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living
in a
cave for the last 20 years.

--
Spud


The seem to think that they can magic up slots to provide a 10 minute
frequency on every route

whilst this might work on the routes that terminate inside (or just outside)
of the London "Zone", this is not going to work for the routes which carry
main line services to the coast

I don't think their vision extends that far. TfL wants to take over the
stopping metro routes that run a little outside the zones (to places like
Dartford), not all the way to the coast.

Is there not a plan, however, for the TfL Empire to take over the
Thameslink lime out to Brighton?


One hopes not. As is, Thameslink is a useful regional service. We
do not need Crossrail style trains with no loos.

Turning London orange
 

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 12:11:43 -0500,
wrote:

In article , () wrote:

On 22.09.16 16:48, Recliner wrote:
tim... wrote:

wrote in message
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services
into the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...o-look-very-di
fferent6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official
TfL mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the
south london lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will
give them an easy time because they're a public corp rather than a
TOC has obviously been living in a cave for the last 20 years.

The seem to think that they can magic up slots to provide a 10 minute
frequency on every route

whilst this might work on the routes that terminate inside (or just
outside) of the London "Zone", this is not going to work for the routes
which carry main line services to the coast

I don't think their vision extends that far. TfL wants to take over the
stopping metro routes that run a little outside the zones (to places
like Dartford), not all the way to the coast.

Is there not a plan, however, for the TfL Empire to take over the
Thameslink lime out to Brighton?

No, not even Thameslink within Greater London.

Good.

Turning London orange
 

On Fri, 23 Sep 2016 13:41:48 +0100, "
wrote:

On 22.09.16 20:00, Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On 22.09.16 16:48, Recliner wrote:
tim... wrote:

wrote in message ...
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services
into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy
time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living
in a
cave for the last 20 years.

--
Spud


The seem to think that they can magic up slots to provide a 10 minute
frequency on every route

whilst this might work on the routes that terminate inside (or just outside)
of the London "Zone", this is not going to work for the routes which carry
main line services to the coast

I don't think their vision extends that far. TfL wants to take over the
stopping metro routes that run a little outside the zones (to places like
Dartford), not all the way to the coast.

Is there not a plan, however, for the TfL Empire to take over the
Thameslink lime out to Brighton?

Not that I'm aware of, and not according to the news report. Do you have a
link?

No, I thought that I read it on this group. IIRC, it was more of a
long-term plan, rather than anything around the corner.

When the West, North, South, and East London Lines, along with the
Watford DC service transitioned to the London Overground, the change
was so worthwhile.

In the 1960s I first "discovered" the North London line and watched
its painful decline. But, the investment in new infrastructure the
linking up of the North and East London Lines, the improved customer
environment was SO, SO welcome.

And it worked, why not leave it as is. No way can this sort of
investment be afforded for all of London's suburban network, the TOCs
are not doing a bad job for the most part.

Turning London orange
 

On 24/09/2016 09:35, e27002 aurora wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 16:27:37 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


wrote in message ...
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services
into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy
time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living
in a
cave for the last 20 years.

--
Spud


The seem to think that they can magic up slots to provide a 10 minute
frequency on every route

Exactly, but Mr Kahn might make it happen. And, as you say below:

whilst this might work on the routes that terminate inside (or just outside)
of the London "Zone", this is not going to work for the routes which carry
main line services to the coast.

Living on the Portsmouth Direct, as one does, this does not bode well.
We need improved frequencies. That could come with the conversion of
Waterloo International and a grade separated junction at Woking. But,
NOT if Mr Kahn is going to take a big chunk of the paths out of
Waterloo for his Metro Service.


Can't see a grade separated junction at Woking happening any time soon.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Turning London orange
 

e27002 aurora wrote:
On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 14:36:39 +0000 (UTC), d wrote:

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 15:29:59 +0100
" wrote:
On 21.09.16 21:31, Recliner wrote:
TfL's grand vision for turning London's suburban overground services into
the Overground:


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/21/london...very-different
6143328/

I got an idea. Let's just turn the entire network, from Penzance to
Wick, orange.

Indeed. Its really not very well thought out if this is an official TfL
mock up. And what the obsession with TfL taking over all the south london
lines is god knows. Anyone who thinks the unions will give them an easy time
because they're a public corp rather than a TOC has obviously been living in a
cave for the last 20 years.

This is ill thought out nonsense. It looks to me like Mr Kahn wants
to leave his mark (fundamentally change London?)

This scheme was started during the previous mayor's tenure. Sadiq is just
continuing with Boris's plan.