On 28/09/2019 11:36, Graeme Wall wrote:
On 27/09/2019 21:48, MissRiaElaine wrote:

I hereby propose a new law, based on Godwin's Law. Anyone who mentions
Brexit in a thread that is nothing to do with it automatically loses
the argument.

Let's call it Boris's Law.



Godwin's law doesn't say you lose the argument, just "As an online
discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis
or Hitler approaches 1"

You're no doubt right, it's been a long time since I last saw it. But
the principle holds true, and I like my version better..!


--
Ria in Aberdeen

[Send address is invalid, use sipsoup at gmail dot com to reply direct]

On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 20:11:38 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 19:47:45 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 15:44:25 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 16:04:12 +0100
Recliner wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 14:58:53 +0100, Basil Jet
aircraft using the new runway such as the A380 which burns half a ton
of

fuel
just to get from the gate to take off position.


Isn't that what those yellow drones someone linked to last week are
for?

They don't fly, so they're not drones.

They're robotugs called Mototok Spacer 8600s. They aren't powerful
enough to push back wide-bodied jets, though a larger model might. In
any case, they don't replace any jet fuel, as pushback would otherwise
be done by hefty diesel tugs. So they save some diesel fuel and fumes,
but not aviation fuel.

If you knew anything about physics you'd be aware that using a jet engine

to

push a vehicle on the ground is far less efficient than using powered
wheels.

Half of the energy is wasted on chucking air backwards rather than making

the

aircraft go forwards.

Who are you arguing with? Nobody claimed that jet engines were an
efficient way of moving large vehicles slowly round an airport. We were
discussing diesel vs battery pushback tugs.

At some airports - don't know about heathrow - some aircraft push back
using
reverse thrusters.

Name one.

Borispol, Kiev.

https://www.123rf.com/photo_11341508...5-2018-the-pus
hback-of-the-ellinair-airbus-a320-200-aircraft-in-the-borisp.html

https://youtu.be/7ifDnXNNeLM

Not even bothering to look - I was in a plane that did it there so go do one.

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 07:30:18 +0100
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 19:26:11 on Fri, 27 Sep
2019, remarked:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 18:48:55 +0100
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:23:25 on Mon, 23 Sep
2019, remarked:
I used to work near heathrow and the number of people travelling there by
private car was a small percentage of the total.

Total public transport (by passengers) has crept up to 40% over the last
decade (from 35%). Then there's the staff.

It would take probably 500+ cars just to replace 1 full tube train so god
knows
how they calculate that.

By doing proper professional surveys.

Would these be the same proper professional surveys that predicted a brexit
referendum win for remain?

Doing a historical traffic survey is a rather different task to opinion
polling.

Not really - it all depends on sample size. They couldn't measure every
passenger getting off every train or bus every single car that stopped so
it's just as much extrapolation as a voting survey.

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 07:34:26 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 19:24:25 on Fri, 27 Sep
2019, remarked:
On Thu, 26 Sep 2019 13:21:23 +0100
MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 23/09/2019 20:47, Recliner wrote:
MissRiaElaine wrote:
On 23/09/2019 16:32, wrote:

I used to work near heathrow and the number of people travelling there by
private car was a small percentage of the total. I don't see why
that would

change with a 3rd runway. And my office overlooked one of the parking
pounds
of one of the private parking companies. Anyone who had seen what those
****wits
got up to with their prized possesion would never park at heathrow again.

They should never have gone for a 3rd runway at Heathrow. A second
runway at Gatwick would make far more sense.

Not according to the official Airports Commission, the majority of
passengers or the airlines.

Well, whatever as they say. I would certainly prefer to use Gatwick than
Heathrow any day.

Bit of a PITA to get to unless you live near the airport

Or the M25. The eastern section of which I find much more reliable than
the western.

or the brighton main line.

Which serves Central London with its connections and even direct trains
from counties norf of the river, that latter something which Heathrow
lacks (until Crossrail serves parts of Essex).


That's ignoring the Tube, of course.

In message , at 11:57:44 on Sat, 28 Sep
2019, remarked:
I used to work near heathrow and the number of people travelling there by
private car was a small percentage of the total.

Total public transport (by passengers) has crept up to 40% over the last
decade (from 35%). Then there's the staff.

It would take probably 500+ cars just to replace 1 full tube train so god
knows
how they calculate that.

By doing proper professional surveys.

Would these be the same proper professional surveys that predicted a brexit
referendum win for remain?

Doing a historical traffic survey is a rather different task to opinion
polling.

Not really - it all depends on sample size. They couldn't measure every
passenger getting off every train or bus every single car that stopped so
it's just as much extrapolation as a voting survey.

But based on well settled science.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 13:35:48 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:

Well, whatever as they say. I would certainly prefer to use Gatwick than
Heathrow any day.

Bit of a PITA to get to unless you live near the airport

Or the M25. The eastern section of which I find much more reliable than
the western.

or the brighton main line.

Which serves Central London with its connections and even direct trains
from counties norf of the river, that latter something which Heathrow
lacks (until Crossrail serves parts of Essex).

That's ignoring the Tube, of course.

Yes, I forgot the inhabitants of Cockfosters, and their fortitude in
getting a tube to Heathrow.
--
Roland Perry

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 13:53:20 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 13:35:48 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:

Well, whatever as they say. I would certainly prefer to use Gatwick than
Heathrow any day.

Bit of a PITA to get to unless you live near the airport

Or the M25. The eastern section of which I find much more reliable than
the western.

or the brighton main line.

Which serves Central London with its connections and even direct trains
from counties norf of the river, that latter something which Heathrow
lacks (until Crossrail serves parts of Essex).

That's ignoring the Tube, of course.

Yes, I forgot the inhabitants of Cockfosters, and their fortitude in
getting a tube to Heathrow.

Last time I looked, the West End was also north of the river. I live
north of the river, and my rail journeys to and from Heathrow are
always on the Piccadilly line. The Picc serves far more stations in
London than Crossrail will.

On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 11:54:25 +0000 (UTC), wrote:

On Fri, 27 Sep 2019 20:11:38 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 19:47:45 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 15:44:25 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 16:04:12 +0100
Recliner wrote:
On Mon, 23 Sep 2019 14:58:53 +0100, Basil Jet
aircraft using the new runway such as the A380 which burns half a ton
of

fuel
just to get from the gate to take off position.


Isn't that what those yellow drones someone linked to last week are
for?

They don't fly, so they're not drones.

They're robotugs called Mototok Spacer 8600s. They aren't powerful
enough to push back wide-bodied jets, though a larger model might. In
any case, they don't replace any jet fuel, as pushback would otherwise
be done by hefty diesel tugs. So they save some diesel fuel and fumes,
but not aviation fuel.

If you knew anything about physics you'd be aware that using a jet engine

to

push a vehicle on the ground is far less efficient than using powered
wheels.

Half of the energy is wasted on chucking air backwards rather than making

the

aircraft go forwards.

Who are you arguing with? Nobody claimed that jet engines were an
efficient way of moving large vehicles slowly round an airport. We were
discussing diesel vs battery pushback tugs.

At some airports - don't know about heathrow - some aircraft push back
using
reverse thrusters.

Name one.

Borispol, Kiev.

https://www.123rf.com/photo_11341508...5-2018-the-pus
hback-of-the-ellinair-airbus-a320-200-aircraft-in-the-borisp.html

https://youtu.be/7ifDnXNNeLM

Not even bothering to look - I was in a plane that did it there so go do one.

Probably a very long time ago.

In message , at 14:03:49 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 13:53:20 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 13:35:48 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:

Well, whatever as they say. I would certainly prefer to use Gatwick than
Heathrow any day.

Bit of a PITA to get to unless you live near the airport

Or the M25. The eastern section of which I find much more reliable than
the western.

or the brighton main line.

Which serves Central London with its connections and even direct trains
from counties norf of the river, that latter something which Heathrow
lacks (until Crossrail serves parts of Essex).

That's ignoring the Tube, of course.

Yes, I forgot the inhabitants of Cockfosters, and their fortitude in
getting a tube to Heathrow.

Last time I looked, the West End was also north of the river.

In which county north of the river?

I live north of the river, and my rail journeys to and from Heathrow
are always on the Piccadilly line. The Picc serves far more stations in
London than Crossrail will.

It's a rather tedious way to get to and from work at Heathrow, if you
live north of Kings Cross.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 14:03:49 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:
On Sat, 28 Sep 2019 13:53:20 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 13:35:48 on
Sat, 28 Sep 2019, Recliner remarked:

Well, whatever as they say. I would certainly prefer to use Gatwick than
Heathrow any day.

Bit of a PITA to get to unless you live near the airport

Or the M25. The eastern section of which I find much more reliable than
the western.

or the brighton main line.

Which serves Central London with its connections and even direct trains
from counties norf of the river, that latter something which Heathrow
lacks (until Crossrail serves parts of Essex).

That's ignoring the Tube, of course.

Yes, I forgot the inhabitants of Cockfosters, and their fortitude in
getting a tube to Heathrow.

Last time I looked, the West End was also north of the river.

In which county north of the river?

I live north of the river, and my rail journeys to and from Heathrow
are always on the Piccadilly line. The Picc serves far more stations in
London than Crossrail will.

It's a rather tedious way to get to and from work at Heathrow, if you
live north of Kings Cross.

Is there a better way using PT? Obviously, people who don't live near a
Piccadilly line station might change to the line at, say, Finsbury Park.