Graham J wrote:
If I get an unresolved journey, it is usually as a result of going on
the DLR through Bank. If I touch in at the main ticket barriers at
Bank, do I need to touch in at the DLR platform as well?

The validators by the DLR platform are a cause of much mystery and
speculation. There is a theory that they are intended for use by passengers
accessing the platforms via the mobility impaired lift as this bypasses the
main ticket barriers. However it has also been pointed out that they are
set for entry only (thus answering a question I posed elsewhere in this
discussion) meaning that passengers using those lifts wouldn't have anywhere
to touch out. I'm not sure a definitive answer has been posted anywhere on
this subject.

Well the *original* version of the "Using your PAYG Oyster" guide
explicitly stated that you *MUST* touch in and out at Bank when taking
the DLR, even if you've touched in at one of the gate lines.

The Oyster website [1] currently says:

quote

DLR

You only need to touch in and touch out when using Oyster to pay as you go.

/quote

Personally, I always touch in and out even though I've got a Zone 1 to 4
Monthly loaded on my Oyster.

HTH,

Barry

On 15 Sep 2006 06:26:07 -0700, wrote:

I am not an expert of unresolved journeys, but I thought I'd post what
I was told yesterday by the ticket office clerk at Kings Cross. As of
November, ticket office staff will not be able to make adjustments to
Oyster Cards for unresolved journeys and that they would all be charged
at £4. The only way of resolving such a journey is if the issue is
flagged up at the time it happens.

Though even then, they may not be able to fix it - they can only do
anything about the most recent 'journey' on the card.

I've managed to pick up unresolved journeys on three occasions. On one
of these, the system created 2 'journeys' on my card for one 'real'
journey; on another, it generated 3. Both times, I queried it
immediately at the ticket office, but the system wouldn't let them
edit anything other than the most recent one, and the Oyster helpline
refused to resolve anything because my card is unregistered (I don't
know if this policy has since changed), so there was simply no way to
fix it.

If I get an unresolved journey, it is usually as a result of going on
the DLR through Bank. If I touch in at the main ticket barriers at
Bank, do I need to touch in at the DLR platform as well?

This validator at Bank is a bit of a bugbear. Its behaviour seems to
be distinctly odd. As far as Oyster ticketing is concerned, the DLR is
just another Tube line, so there no reason why you should ever need to
touch it (just like you wouldn't when changing between Tube lines).

Despite this, I don't think anyone's managed to find a definitive
answer to your question. I think the only way you're ever going to
find out is by experimenting.

If I change at Bank, are the tube and DLR segments of my journey
charged as separate trips?

No. You're just charged the normal Tube fare for the zones you pass
through.

On 15 Sep 2006 00:51:16 -0700, Kev wrote:

I got my first unresolved journey yesterday but what am I expected, not
that I should be, do about it.

Usually, when you try to top up, the ticket machine displays a message
telling you to phone the Oyster helpline about it.

I appears that a journey from Kings X on the 16 Aug is unresolved, in
fact it wasn't from Kings X but from Aldgate East to Brent X changing
at Kings X. I remember the journey well, it took 45 minutes to get to
Golders Green from Kings X.

Sounds like something went wrong during the out-of-station interchange
at KX. Did anything unusual happen as you went through the barriers
there?

I was putting money on the card at the booking office at North
Greenwich yesterday but the staff said that there nothing that they
could do about it.

Unless it's changed recently, they can only do something about it if
it's the most recent journey on the card.

What happens now. I looked on the TfL site but I could find nothing
about unresolved journies.

Their publicity is very much dumbed-down. Someone here was planning to
start a website with more detailed information about Oyster, but I
don't think anything has happened on that front as yet.

The cap had applied that day anyway and I
have put a customer complaint in about the delay.
I definitely swiped out at Brent X. Do I just leave it there.

Depends whether you can be bothered to phone the helpline (and whether
you want to pay - it's an 0845 number).

Unresolved journeys used to drop off your journey history after a
while, but nowadays they seem to stick around on the card forever
unless you get something done about them.

asdf wrote:

Sounds like something went wrong during the out-of-station interchange
at KX. Did anything unusual happen as you went through the barriers
there?
No. I only stopped off at the booking office to check that the cap was
operating as the balance was going down quicker than I expected. That
would only have taken a couple of minutes.
I can only assume that the long journey to Brent X had an affect or the
swipe out didn't register but I usually pay very particular attention
to that.

Kevin

In regards to the DLR/Tube intergration I find it all very confusing
too. If you change from the DLR to tube at Canning Town or Bank its
all shown as one journey and you are charged accordingly by Oyster. If
you change at Tower Gateway or Shadwell or Canary Wharf it counts as
two separate journeys. All very bizarre and means that I won't change
at Canary Wharf/Shadwell even though it would frequently decrease my
journey time.





asdf wrote:
On 15 Sep 2006 00:51:16 -0700, Kev wrote:

I got my first unresolved journey yesterday but what am I expected, not
that I should be, do about it.

Usually, when you try to top up, the ticket machine displays a message
telling you to phone the Oyster helpline about it.

I appears that a journey from Kings X on the 16 Aug is unresolved, in
fact it wasn't from Kings X but from Aldgate East to Brent X changing
at Kings X. I remember the journey well, it took 45 minutes to get to
Golders Green from Kings X.

Sounds like something went wrong during the out-of-station interchange
at KX. Did anything unusual happen as you went through the barriers
there?

I was putting money on the card at the booking office at North
Greenwich yesterday but the staff said that there nothing that they
could do about it.

Unless it's changed recently, they can only do something about it if
it's the most recent journey on the card.

What happens now. I looked on the TfL site but I could find nothing
about unresolved journies.

Their publicity is very much dumbed-down. Someone here was planning to
start a website with more detailed information about Oyster, but I
don't think anything has happened on that front as yet.

The cap had applied that day anyway and I
have put a customer complaint in about the delay.
I definitely swiped out at Brent X. Do I just leave it there.

Depends whether you can be bothered to phone the helpline (and whether
you want to pay - it's an 0845 number).

Unresolved journeys used to drop off your journey history after a
while, but nowadays they seem to stick around on the card forever
unless you get something done about them.

On 15 Sep 2006 08:19:18 -0700, wrote:

In regards to the DLR/Tube intergration I find it all very confusing
too. If you change from the DLR to tube at Canning Town or Bank its
all shown as one journey and you are charged accordingly by Oyster. If
you change at Tower Gateway or Shadwell or Canary Wharf it counts as
two separate journeys. All very bizarre and means that I won't change
at Canary Wharf/Shadwell even though it would frequently decrease my
journey time.

These are known as out-of-station interchanges. You should only be
charged for one journey. The cost of the other will show as 0.00.

Suppose you travel from Westferry to Wapping, changing at Shadwell.
When you touch out at Shadwell, you are charged for a
Westferry-Shadwell journey. But after completing the Shadwell-Wapping
leg, the cost of the Westferry-Shadwell journey will be refunded, and
you'll be charged for the Westferry-Wapping journey.

After the first leg, your journey history will show:

Westferry - Shadwell 1.00

After the second, it will show:

Westferry - Shadwell 0.00
Westferry - Wapping 1.00

Out-of-station interchanges aren't mentioned in any of TfL's publicity
(that I know of), so it's understandable that there's confusion over
whether it counts as one journey or two.

asdf wrote:
Out-of-station interchanges aren't mentioned in any of TfL's publicity
(that I know of), so it's understandable that there's confusion over
whether it counts as one journey or two.

Do all of the out-of-station interchanges that appear on the map count
as one journey?

Are any out-of-station interchanges that count as one journey omitted
from the map?
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

On Fri, 15 Sep 2006 17:08:21 GMT, David of Broadway wrote:

Out-of-station interchanges aren't mentioned in any of TfL's publicity
(that I know of), so it's understandable that there's confusion over
whether it counts as one journey or two.

Do all of the out-of-station interchanges that appear on the map count
as one journey?

I believe so, though I haven't personally tried them all.

Are any out-of-station interchanges that count as one journey omitted
from the map?

Yes, there are a few "secret" ones:

Baker Street - Marylebone NR
Aldgate - Fenchurch Street NR
King's Cross SSL - Euston tube (I discovered this one by accident a
year or so ago, don't know if it still works)
I suspect Euston Square - Euston (tube or NR) may be one, but I've
never had occasion to try it

asdf wrote:
On 15 Sep 2006 00:51:16 -0700, Kev wrote:

I was putting money on the card at the booking office at North
Greenwich yesterday but the staff said that there nothing that they
could do about it.

Unless it's changed recently, they can only do something about it if
it's the most recent journey on the card.

When I generated a mysterious unresolved journey last month at Northwick
Park and asked about it at the ticket window, the agent removed both
that unresolved journey and the one I had picked up a week or two
earlier. However, she did not undo the mysterious £1 charge that I was
really trying to ask about.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

Thanks asdf,

I didn't realise that about out of station interchanges. I tried it
yesterday and the oyster pads on the entry/exit gates charged me twice
(eg £1 from cutty sark to Canary Wharf and then £1.50 for Canary
Wharf to Oxford Street) but I immediately checked my history on the top
up machine and it had "refunded" my first journey.

I have to say that this is appalling for TFL. I'm sure that a huge
number using the DLR aren't aware of this. I don't understand why the
entry/exit gates don't charge you £0.50 or £0.00 for the second part
of the journey. This surely makes far more sense that giving phantom
refunds.

On this note it gets me thinking. When Oyster starts properly on NR
will they allow this sort of intergration? Eg, If I get the train from
deptford to london bridge and then the underground to Green Park, will
it count as one journey or two?




David of Broadway wrote:
asdf wrote:
On 15 Sep 2006 00:51:16 -0700, Kev wrote:

I was putting money on the card at the booking office at North
Greenwich yesterday but the staff said that there nothing that they
could do about it.

Unless it's changed recently, they can only do something about it if
it's the most recent journey on the card.

When I generated a mysterious unresolved journey last month at Northwick
Park and asked about it at the ticket window, the agent removed both
that unresolved journey and the one I had picked up a week or two
earlier. However, she did not undo the mysterious £1 charge that I was
really trying to ask about.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA