On 14 Dec, 12:58, "Peter Masson" wrote:

"solar penguin" wrote

Maybe they're trying to avoid a Stratford-style mess of random
platform numbers. When the Kent services start, it would be nice if
_all_ the High Level platforms could be numbered from 1 to [whatever],
in order.

AIUI they will be. 1-4 for EMML; 5-10 for E*; 11-13 for Kent.

There were some here who advocated renumbering for the whole KXStP complex
in a single sequence.

Thanks. So since the SPILL platforms are west of 1-4 they should
logically be -1 and 0. I can see why the planners preferred A and B
instead...

On 14 Dec, 13:03, "Paul Scott" wrote:

"solar penguin" wrote in message
...

On 13 Dec, 16:38, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Still, while their train indicators are still showing trains in the
wrong order (and not being consistent on times at all),

IIRC that is not the fault of the new set up, the PIS on the whole route
through London Bridge and the Thameslink route has suffered from that for
ages...

All modern PIS systems, everywhere, suffer like that when there are a
lot of delays on the line. It's just more noticeable on Thameslink,
because the route is more vulnerable to performance pollution.

I reckon Thameslink is far worse than the SWML though [with which I'm
admittedly more familiar] - if mainline trains arrive out of order the PIS
invariably changes to match. I suspect the SWML's connection between the
train ID in the signalling system and the PIS works better.

I'm not very familiar with the SWML, but I've seen Windsor Line
indicators at Clapham Junction get confused about departure order whe
engineering work has overrun, with staff on the platform telling us to
ignore the indicators and only listen to the manual announcements
instead.

(The computer also kept trying to make faulty automatic announcements,
but whenever that happened someone -- I don't know whether it was the
platform staff or the controllers -- would stop it after the first few
words.)

I've also seen similar things happening at Doncaster and Orpington
whenever the service has been heavily disrupted. If it doesn't happen
on the SWML, then that's the exception, not the rule.

On Fri, 14 Dec 2007, Colin Rosenstiel wrote:

In article ,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

I suppose you (and I) would be able to cycle to Farrington,
City Thameslink or Blackfriars for a slightly less onerous set of
steps :-)

Except that they are rather in the wrong direction for
Westminster.

You what? Westminster to Blackfriars is a substantially shorter
and easier ride than Westminster to King's Cross.

Only if you ignore the train running time. Anyway, how much
better is the platform-street level interchange there?

Pass. I've never used either of them, i'm afraid!

From what I have ever seen of Blackfriars it has every bit the height
difference problems that SPILL has.

Okay. Farringdon does too - you have to carry your bike up a flight of
stairs. I don't find it a big deal, but i can imagine persons of less
sturdy build than me might.

So, City Thameslink?

tom

--
REMOVE AND DESTROY

There are two fire exits in that area on the Southbound platform at least.
Where do they lead?
Its obvious if you've just arrived from Paris and want a southbound
taxi...

Is there any passive provision for connecting to the Chelsea-Hackney
line? Passive provision for the Chelsea-Hackney line seems to be built
into designs for some of the other stations, like the changes about to
happen to the tube at Victoria, and the ones that have already
happened at Angel (that's presumably why the cross passages there are
so wide and have very wide fire exit doors in the middle of them).

Its so cramped at Kings Cross St Pancras that I can only think of two
places for the Chelsea-Hackney to fit, unless they place it at some
extremely deep level. It basically heads in the same direction as the
northern line round there (although "northbound" and "southbound"
point in opposite directions); it either has to go parallel at the
south of the northern line, or to the north of it. To the south would
be so far away from the other exits and entrances that it would be
ridiculous connecting to it, so the north is the only sensible place.

That puts it roughly under the Great Northern Hotel - extremely
convenient for the Northern Ticket hall's passageways (suspiciously
convenient in fact). It also means that it heads under St Pancras -
the southern end of Thameslink would be very convenient for placing
escalators down to the Chelsea-Hackney platforms. They could add
escalators going in the other direction as well to link to the western
ticket hall, perhaps emerging in the now very wide passage between the
eastbound and westbound circle/metropolitan/hammersmith&city
platforms; that way you could get fairly directly from Thameslink into
the tube station.

On 14 Dec, 17:42, lonelytraveller
wrote:
To the south would
be so far away from the other exits and entrances that it would be
ridiculous connecting to it, so the north is the only sensible place.

But that's where it's going. Have a look at the safeguarding map:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/consultations/...pdfsheets10b19

It appears to be south of Euston Road. The original safeguarding is a
long way south, the new proposed (accepted?) new boundary covers an
area up to the north side of the existing tube ticket hall, but
nothing further north.

and the ones that have already
happened at Angel (that's presumably why the cross passages there are
so wide and have very wide fire exit doors in the middle of them).

I presume they go to the lifts and the old building somehow.

The safeguarded route appears to run northwest of the current station
entrance, but the Northern platforms are southeast of it. The "surface
interest" area (ie station buildings etc) is on the west side of
Islington High St, and the only place I can imagine an interchange
passage coming from that way connecting is the landing between the two
sets of escalators.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

Talking of which, much as I like the new station - why is there no
consistency in the way stations are signed and written? St Pancras has
its own font and signs that seem very random (it's already been
mentioned about the mix up of East Midlands Trains, Midland Mainland,
UK Rail (WTF?!) and poor signage to tell people how to get to other
services. Tourists arriving at St Pancras will not find it easy to
locate King's Cross, or Euston, and when they do the signs all look
different.

Agreed - I counted three different designes of official sign. There are the
older ones that say Midland Mainline, the newere ones that are brighter blue
and alternated between First Capital Connect, East Midlands Trains and "UK
Rail Services" (unhelpfully) and then there are the ones near the Eurostar
terminal - which are green and different again!

Some of the signs spell King's Cross with an apostophe, others don't - and
the worst mistake is one sign on the FCC platform that points up stairs to
"Platform b" (Rather then B as every other sign says!)

I think it says it all that the concourse is now littered with "temporary"
service signs with hastily printed out arrows and directions to point people
where to go.

Best Wishes,
LEWIS

Hi All,

I like the statue; it is quite impressive, and people seem to be
photographing it, but I suppose what sticks in your throat is all the PR
guff about the statue being a place for people to meet, like Eros in
Piccadilly Circus. Those sort of places arise naturally, they're not
designed in.

Agreed - its a rubbish meeting place as its out of the way for nearly all
passenger flows. These things (as you say) do come naturally - my favourite
being "Underneath the clock" at Waterloo. Wasn't designed in, but in reality
one of the best places to stand in the station, out of the way of commuters,
central and always obvious.

Of course it would be a disaster if all passengers in and around KX/St.P
were routed through the same spot!

They've already solved that with the signage situation!

Best Wishes,
LEWIS

"María" wrote in message
...

"Peter Lawrence" wrote in message
...

First impressions of the Thameslink platforms at St Pancras which
opened on time this morning (after what must have been a massive
tidy-up operation).


Closed today during evening rush hour because of overcrowding, what a
great start!

María

The Thameslink platforms at St.Pancras (Platforms A & B) opened for business
on Sunday 9th December, and I travelled from there about 10am
I think the first services were about 9.30am according to posters with early
morning services bustituted from West Hampstead to Blackfriars

Kings Cross Thameslink closed at end of service about 1am on the morning of
Sunday 9th December 2007

"Mr Thant" wrote in message
...
On 11 Dec, 10:08, Roland Perry wrote:
In message
, at
01:42:39 on Tue, 11 Dec 2007, Mr Thant
remarked:

Why are the platforms at St Pancras Thameslink so massive in width?

There has been some discussion of whether or not the box was designed
to
a take two island platforms, but reduced to the current layout to save
costs. Now that it's possible to access the station, perhaps we can
see
if it would be possible to steal the outer edges of each platform to
make a track each side, to regain an island layout?

I had a think about this when I was there on Sunday. The answer is
probably yes, but you'd be left with Clapham style islands and
escalators no nowhere.

You'd have to move things like the escalators.

Sorry, I wasn't very clear. The platforms would be two feet wide, so
installing anything wider than a stepladder would block access to the
south end.

U
One of the crutisms of Kings Cross Thameslink was the narrow platforms so I
thank the planners for making them bigger in what for many commuters is
almost a London Termini station it could now have to cope even more with
luggage laden International passengers and with the future expansions of
Thameslink will be become even bigger. Have you seen the size of the
platforms at places like Canary Wharf and Canada Water the planners have
apparently anticipated rail traffic growth to the year 2060. It is far
easier to close parts off in future if not needed, rather than make larger
particuarly when you are dealing with a below ground station

In message
"Lew 1" wrote:

Hi All,

I like the statue; it is quite impressive, and people seem to be
photographing it, but I suppose what sticks in your throat is all the PR
guff about the statue being a place for people to meet, like Eros in
Piccadilly Circus. Those sort of places arise naturally, they're not
designed in.

Agreed - its a rubbish meeting place as its out of the way for nearly all
passenger flows. These things (as you say) do come naturally - my favourite
being "Underneath the clock" at Waterloo. Wasn't designed in, but in
reality one of the best places to stand in the station, out of the way of
commuters, central and always obvious.


Bit embarrasing when there's 10 of you, all wearing a red carnation in your
buttonhole...

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html