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Old January 26th 09, 04:38 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

I travelled today from FB to C&L via Baker Street and my Oystercard was
charged GBP6 for the outward journey at about 7.45am, and GBP3 for the
return journey at about 11.15am.

First of all, are these the correct fares?

Secondly, this may become a regular commute for me for a while, and I
wonder what my most economic option would be for a season ticket (weekly
or monthly - I don't see it going beyond 5-6 months). I asked at a
ticket office, but the TFL person wasn't able to tell me offhand and I
wasn't able to wait for him to spend lots of time checking.

The first part of my journey would be a walk to the nearest tube and the
last part another walk - each about 1mile. I'm thinking of taking my
folding bike for these bits, assuming there's room for it on the first
leg of the tube journey, but I imagine I could also cycle straight to
Baker Street to take the Metropolitan line.

Not only would I enjoy the exercise, but I think I could also cycle this
stage faster than the tube takes, especially if I use my regular bike.
The Met train to Amersham this morning was virtually empty, so I presume
there'd be no objection to taking a bike on board.

This leads me to question 3 - is it OK to take a regular bike on board?

And fourthly, would travelling from Baker Street instead of FB make my
season ticket more expensive?

Many thanks in advance.
--
congokid
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Old January 26th 09, 05:42 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

In message , congokid
writes

I travelled today from FB to C&L via Baker Street and my Oystercard was
charged GBP6 for the outward journey at about 7.45am, and GBP3 for the
return journey at about 11.15am.

First of all, are these the correct fares?


Yes. C&L is Zone 8. The Oyster single is 6 peak (your outward journey)
and 3 offpeak (your return).

Secondly, this may become a regular commute for me for a while, and I
wonder what my most economic option would be for a season ticket
(weekly or monthly - I don't see it going beyond 5-6 months).


If you are working normal hours and travelling peak time in both
directions, it will be 12 a day on PAYG Oyster. I don't know what a
season would be, but I'm sure somebody will.

This leads me to question 3 - is it OK to take a regular bike on board?


Only out of peak hours (but you could take it all the way from FB if
going via Baker Street).
--
Paul Terry
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Old January 26th 09, 06:57 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

Paul Terry wrote in
:

If you are working normal hours and travelling peak time in both
directions, it will be 12 a day on PAYG Oyster. I don't know what a
season would be, but I'm sure somebody will.



228.10 per month (see http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/your-guide-
to-fares-and-tickets-Zones-7-9-plus-watford-junction.pdf)

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Old January 26th 09, 11:52 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer


congokid wrote:

I travelled today from FB to C&L via Baker Street and my Oystercard was
charged GBP6 for the outward journey at about 7.45am, and GBP3 for the
return journey at about 11.15am.

First of all, are these the correct fares?


Paul Terry's already answered this so sorry for covering the same
ground, but just in case you want it to check this or any other fare
for yourself you can query the TfL Fare finder online he
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/tickets/faresandtickets/2009/farefinder/

As it explains, the higher (Peak) fare applies Monday to Friday from
0630 to 0930 and from 1600 to 1900, the lower Off-Peak fare at all
other times including public holidays.


Secondly, this may become a regular commute for me for a while, and I
wonder what my most economic option would be for a season ticket (weekly
or monthly - I don't see it going beyond 5-6 months). I asked at a
ticket office, but the TFL person wasn't able to tell me offhand and I
wasn't able to wait for him to spend lots of time checking.


Again, sorry for retreading David Jackman's earlier answer - as he
said a zones 1-8 Travelcard will cost 228.10 for a monthly and 59.40
for a weekly. You can also buy a season Travelcard for any period up
to a year - the price will be calculated on a pro-rata basis. There
isn't an option of a point-to-point season ticket on London
Underground and there hasn't been for quite some time.

The Travelcard you get needs to be valid for all the zones you travel
through, so cost-wise there's nothing to be saved by starting your LU
journey at say Baker Street as opposed to Fulham Broadway. See the
Tube Map marked with the zones he
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...d-Tube-map.gif

You could also travel on a Chiltern Railways train from London
Marylebone to Chalfont & Latimer - for fares purposes the Chiltern
line is basically regarded as an Underground line as far as Amersham,
so the same Oyster PAYG fares apply and a zones 1-8 Travelcard would
also be valid. As a result of this fares arrangement there isn't a
separate Chiltern trains only season ticket for this rail journey, so
cost wise it's no more economical.

The only other way I can see to make this journey cheaper is to avoid
travelling through zone 1 altogether - this would mean you would only
need to get a zones 2-9 Travelcard at 172.80 monthly and 45.00
weekly (a zones 2-8 Travelcard is not available) [1].

From Fulham a non-zone 1 route this could involve taking a West London
Line (WLL) train from West Brompton to Willesden Jn, then a Bakerloo
or London Overground train to Kenton, alighting and nipping round the
corner to Northwick Park station on the Met line and continuing your
journey from there.

OK, that sounds fairly insane - but if one was instead to cycle to a
Bakerloo line station in zone 2 - i.e. one north/west of Warwick
Avenue, then that could work. I haven't checked cycle routes but off
the top of my head you could head to say Kensal Green or Queen's Park
or even Willesden Junction.

Despite the fact that Kenton and Northwood stations are almost
literally around the corner from each other, there is an issue with
this masterplan - fast trains heading for Chalfont & Latimer don't
stop at Northwood, as shown on this Met line diagram:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/metropolitan.pdf

But all Met line trains, including the fasts to Amersham, stop at
Finchley Road - so if you really wanted to save money you could cycle
up here. Plus the Oyster PAYG fares from Finchley Road to C&L are 4
Peak, 2 Off-Peak - so five Peak return journeys (i.e. a weeks worth)
would come to 40, less than the 45 cost of the weekly zones 2-9
Travelcard.


The first part of my journey would be a walk to the nearest tube and the
last part another walk - each about 1mile. I'm thinking of taking my
folding bike for these bits, assuming there's room for it on the first
leg of the tube journey, but I imagine I could also cycle straight to
Baker Street to take the Metropolitan line.

Not only would I enjoy the exercise, but I think I could also cycle this
stage faster than the tube takes, especially if I use my regular bike.
The Met train to Amersham this morning was virtually empty, so I presume
there'd be no objection to taking a bike on board.


This leads me to question 3 - is it OK to take a regular bike on board?


Unfortunately I'm about to repeat stuff Paul Terry posted earlier, but
only to elaborate on it - as he said, regular bikes cannot be carried
anywhere on the Underground network, specifically they are totally
verboten between 0730-0930 and 1600-1900 (Mondays to Fridays) - see
the Bicycles on the Underground map here (PDF):
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/bicycle-tube-map-0108.pdf

Folding bikes can however be carried at any time:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/cycling/9049.aspx

This is also the case with regards to Chiltern Railways trains.


And fourthly, would travelling from Baker Street instead of FB make my
season ticket more expensive?


No difference whatsoever - note that fares are calculated based on
what zones you pass through, as opposed to where you start or finish
your journey. Therefore there's nothing to be gained by starting a
journey outside of zone 1 if it subsequently passes through zone 1,
for example. (The Oyster system 'knows' if a journey passes through
zone 1 - more precisely, it is programmed with a number of presumed
routes between A&B. Most of the time the system just applies 'common
sense' logic.)

Indeed if you were to travel on the Underground between Baker Street
and FB that journey would effectively be 'free' if you had started
from Chalfont & Latimer - likewise it would cost you nothing extra if
you were to continue down to Heathrow, for example.


-----
[1] Travelcard season prices including zones 7-9 are on page 10 here
(PDF):
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...d-junction.pdf
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Old January 27th 09, 07:58 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

"Mizter T" wrote in message
...
....
Despite the fact that Kenton and Northwood stations are almost
literally around the corner from each other, there is an issue with
this masterplan - fast trains heading for Chalfont & Latimer don't
stop at Northwood, as shown on this Met line diagram:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/metropolitan.pdf



Perhaps you've got confused between Northwood and Northwick Park, Mizter T?

5 stations along the line; quite a long walk.
--
David Biddulph




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Old January 27th 09, 09:58 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer


On 27 Jan, 08:58, "David Biddulph" groups [at] biddulph.org.uk
wrote:

"Mizter T" wrote:

Despite the fact that Kenton and Northwood stations are almost
literally around the corner from each other, there is an issue with
this masterplan - fast trains heading for Chalfont & Latimer don't
stop at Northwood, as shown on this Met line diagram:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/metropolitan.pdf


Perhaps you've got confused between Northwood and Northwick Park, Mizter T?

5 stations along the line; *quite a long walk.


Indeed, over 5 miles walk actually. Sorry, that's an utterly,
ridiculously daft error to have made! Earlier in my post I did manage
to correctly state that it was *Northwick Park* station that was
around corner from Kenton station earlier, but somehow later on in my
post it has transmuted into Northwood later on in my post. Quality
control was evidently seriously lacking when I wrote that.

Just so as to attempt to clarify what I meant (as opposed to what I
said!) here's a street map showing just how close Northwick Park and
Kenton a
http://www.streetmap.co.uk/oldmap.srf?x=516727&y=188161&ar=N

Silly, not least because they're rather different places as well - for
example Northwick Park has a big teaching hospital, whilst Northwood
notably plays host to the tri-service military headquarters.
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Old January 27th 09, 11:12 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

In article
,
Mizter T writes

Thanks Mizter T, and also to Paul and David x 2 for your replies.

I think I'll stick to the simple route I did yesterday, and bite the
bullet. Looks like an expensive commute whatever I do.

It's a pain not being able to take a regular bike on an empty Met train,
though - that bike is a smoother ride over 5 or so miles than the
Brompton.
--
congokid
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http://congokid.com
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Old January 27th 09, 01:03 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer


On 27 Jan, 12:12, congokid wrote:

In article
,
Mizter T writes

Thanks Mizter T, and also to Paul and David x 2 for your replies.

I think I'll stick to the simple route I did yesterday, and bite the
bullet. Looks like an expensive commute whatever I do.

It's a pain not being able to take a regular bike on an empty Met train,
though - that bike is a smoother ride over 5 or so miles than the
Brompton.


Sorry about adding in the large dose of confusion there!

I wasn't really expecting you to jump at the chance of cycling on a
Brompton to Finchley Road! It doesn't jump out at me as an ideal
location to leave a regular bike locked up all day either.


Can I confess to making another mistake (this isn't going very well is
it?!)...

Regarding Chiltern trains, in fact it appears that you *can* take a
regular bicycle on their trains in the contra-peak direction - i.e. in
your case that's against the predominant flow of people into London in
the morning and vice-versa in the evening. See their webpage he
http://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/tr...ing-your-bike/


So, that would be one option, though Chiltern trains to and from C&L
are basically only half-hourly. Their timetable is available as a PDF
from this page:
http://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/pl.../download-our-
timetable/

Alternatively you can look up train times on the National Rail website
he
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/

One other (slightly cheeky) possibility, should you wish to retain the
option of travelling on the Met line, is that you could cycle your
regular bike into Marylebone then leave it and lock it up there in the
safe cycle storage place, then either travel onward to C&L by Chiltern
train or alternatively by the Met line from Baker Street station which
is just around the corner (I'm not getting muddled this time, it
really is!). That would mean you wouldn't have to wait around in order
to catch a half-hourly train.

However one thing I'm not clear on is where the cycle storage place is
at Marylebone (I've a vague picture in my head of it but that's not
helpful!). It's possible it is beyond the gateline, i.e. you would
need to pass through the ticket gates to access it (or through the
manual side gate). *If* this is the case and *if* you had a season
Travelcard I don't think there would be any problem if you were to
pass in and then back out of the automatic gates, the issue would be
more whether staff might take affront at their hospitality -
specifically their cycle facilities - being 'abused'. If you were to
aim to travel out on a Chiltern train then this might make it a bit
less of an issue.

I will endeavour to find out where the cycle parking is at Marylebone
and report back - if it's outside the gateline then there wouldn't be
any practical problem with you doing this (I suppose morally speaking
you could 'justify' it by at least heading out on a Chiltern train
every now and then!).
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Old January 27th 09, 01:18 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

In message
,
Mizter T writes

I will endeavour to find out where the cycle parking is at Marylebone
and report back


Platform 3, and available only to season-ticket holders, according to:
http://www.chilternrailways.co.uk/st...ne/facilities/

(I guess that's behind the gateline, but it's not stated)
--
Paul Terry
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Old January 27th 09, 01:19 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Fulham Broadway to Chalfont & Latimer

Mizter T gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying:

One other (slightly cheeky) possibility, should you wish to retain the
option of travelling on the Met line, is that you could cycle your
regular bike into Marylebone then leave it and lock it up there in the
safe cycle storage place, then either travel onward to C&L by Chiltern
train or alternatively by the Met line from Baker Street station which
is just around the corner (I'm not getting muddled this time, it really
is!). That would mean you wouldn't have to wait around in order to catch
a half-hourly train.


TBH, once you're at M'bone, it's rarely worth walking to Baker St
(5-10min) then catching a c.15min interval Met which'll take 15-20min
longer to get out to civilisation beyond the M25. You might as well hang
about, and get a comfy, fast train. It's different when you're travelling
with rush-hour, since the Chilterns can remind you of photos of Japanese
rush-hour trains... (although, tbf, Chiltern haven't started to employ
people to push passengers through the closing doors. Yet.)

However one thing I'm not clear on is where the cycle storage place is
at Marylebone (I've a vague picture in my head of it but that's not
helpful!). It's possible it is beyond the gateline


It definitely is - where platform 4 used to be, before they moved it half
way to Harrow.


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