On Fri, 15 May 2009 01:35:12 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

On Thu, 14 May 2009, MIG wrote:

On 14 May, 08:05, Tom Crispin
wrote:

2. *From London Bridge, follow the A200 [Tooley Street (bus/cycle
lanes), Jamaica Road (bus lanes), Lower Road (bus lanes), Evelyn
Street], then right Deptford Church Street (nasty junction, bus lanes),
ahead Brookmill Road, ahead Thurston Street, left Loampit Vale, ahead
Lewisham High Street (nasty roundabout, bus lane), left Lee High Road,
right Manor Park, right Staplehurst Road, arrive Hither Green.- Hide
quoted text -

Route 2 ain't so bad really. Even the apparently terrifying
roundabout at Rotherhithe is surprisingly easy.

Yes, i've been through that a few times and it's nothing special. But then
my commuting route as of a few months ago went through Highbury Corner and
Old Street, so i've very much got my roundabout wings!

The only really horrible bit is trying to turn right into Deptford
Church Street, where you can't get into the right lane.

When i went through it, there was naff all traffic, and i had no trouble,
but i do remember being struck by just how much width of road i had to
cross to get into the right position.

The worst bit, i thought, was where Deptford Church Street crossed New
Cross Road: the road on both sides was too narrow for a car to pass me
safely (or at all, really), there was no ASL, and drivers certainly came
at it with the intention of going much faster than i was able to, so the
departure from the lights was a bit stressful. And the surface! My god!
Have the RAF being dumping their old cluster bombs there or something?

Primary position at that crossing is a necessity. I've done it so
many times, I have forgotten how tricky it was first time.

For the past 10 weeks, the A2 southbound has been closed across
Blackheath and traffic diverted onto the A20, Lee High Road. Brookmill
road took much of the A2's traffic. There is an excellent motor
traffic free route from New Cross Road to Lewisham. As always,
however, it takes about 50% longer to ride.

Needless to say, i didn't take this Tooley Street closure seriously
enough, and rode right into it. Away from the actual closure itself, it
was great - there was no traffic, and the road was entirely usable. But at
the closure, to was on the north side of the road, and had to push round
some immense detour. Possibly i would have done better on the south side.

Also, once in Brookmill Road, you can pick up cycle routes through
Lewisham and continue with route 1.

I spotted the signs pointing to those (near the railway bridge?), but
didn't take the risk!

The most educational bit of the ride was getting behind some fairly
petite, slightly dumpy girl who was riding the same way at the top of
Lower Road, idly deciding to make her my pace rider, and then being highly
chastened to find that i had to pedal like the absolute clappers to keep
up with her! I was a bit relieved when i had to stop and look at a map,
and she rapidly vanished into the distance ...

That sounds like Katie, coordinator of Lewisham Cyclists.

On Fri, 15 May 2009, Tom Crispin wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009 01:35:12 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

The worst bit, i thought, was where Deptford Church Street crossed New
Cross Road: the road on both sides was too narrow for a car to pass me
safely (or at all, really), there was no ASL, and drivers certainly
came at it with the intention of going much faster than i was able to,
so the departure from the lights was a bit stressful. And the surface!
My god! Have the RAF being dumping their old cluster bombs there or
something?

Primary position at that crossing is a necessity. I've done it so
many times, I have forgotten how tricky it was first time.

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that i
couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting out in
front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i just pedalled
like mad and prayed.

The most educational bit of the ride was getting behind some fairly
petite, slightly dumpy girl who was riding the same way at the top of
Lower Road, idly deciding to make her my pace rider, and then being
highly chastened to find that i had to pedal like the absolute clappers
to keep up with her! I was a bit relieved when i had to stop and look
at a map, and she rapidly vanished into the distance ...

That sounds like Katie, coordinator of Lewisham Cyclists.

Well if it was, don't tell her i called her dumpy.

tom

--
We need a higher electric field, a higher polarisation product, a longer
storage time and more neutrons. -- NEDM

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and my bike
is pretty ordinary.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that i
couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting out
in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i just
pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and my bike
is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

tom

--
Science runs with us, making us Gods.

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote:
In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

The performance of a human-propelled vehicle is somewhat dependent on the
performance of the propellor.

On 16 May, 18:17, "John Rowland"
wrote:
wrote:
In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

The performance of a human-propelled vehicle is somewhat dependent on the
performance of the propellor.-


I think the discussion was of the approach to the junction at Deptford
Broadway.

You have to come off the small roundabout by Creekmouth and get into
the right lane in order to go straight ahead at the junction. But
then the trouble is that the lanes are very narrow. To be on the left
side of the right lane, you have to block that lane for 100 yards or
more. The other option is to be on the right of the left lane, but
that's risky if there is left-turning stuff overtaking. The left-
turning lane will often be moving while the straight ahead lane on the
right is slow or stopped, because of the filtering sequence.

There's no particular problem if you are at the front at the junction
when the lights clear. I wouldn't fancy nipping in from the left to
squeeze between the traffic island (between left filter and straight
ahead) and a moving car though. Luckily, the lights are green for
such a short time that this is rarely necessary,

In article ,
(John Rowland) wrote:

wrote:
In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

The performance of a human-propelled vehicle is somewhat dependent
on the performance of the propellor.

Human standing start performance is much better than an ICE with a ton of
metal for most values of human power. And that's all you need to get out
of the way starting at lights.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Sat, 16 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

And do you then, having queue-jumped in front of them as would have been
the case in this situation, stay ahead of cars trying to do 40 mph down a
narrow road with neither effort nor prayer? I could have done it, by
taking the primary position and riding at a normal pace, but that would
have been stunningly antisocial.

tom

--
Model 706-8073-421, Robot Sonic

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Sat, 16 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

On Fri, 15 May 2009, wrote:

In article . li,
(Tom Anderson) wrote:

Ah, i'd shamelessly filtered to near the front, and then found that
i couldn't take a secondary position, and chickened out of scooting
out in front of the head of the queue to take primary. In the end i
just pedalled like mad and prayed.

I find I have no problem getting away at the front at lights and
my bike is pretty ordinary.

How is that relevant?

No pedalling like mad or praying required.

And do you then, having queue-jumped in front of them as would have
been the case in this situation, stay ahead of cars trying to do 40
mph down a narrow road with neither effort nor prayer? I could have
done it, by taking the primary position and riding at a normal
pace, but that would have been stunningly antisocial.

I take advantage of being in front to get to the side of the road by the
time I have crossed the junction.

These days there are times when I walk across the line and start off
before the signals change if it is safe to do so, to be sure, I must admit.

--
Colin Rosenstiel