From
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...e-night-trains

Trains will run through the night from 12 September 2015, with six running
an hour across the five “night tube� lines – Jubilee, Victoria and most of
the Piccadilly, Central and Northern lines.

Transport for London (TfL) said the move would support almost 2,000
permanent jobs and provide a £360m boost to the economy.

Demand for overnight tube services, matching New York and Berlin, has been
demonstrated by the increasing numbers of late-night London Underground
journeys, which have risen at twice the rate of daytime trips since 2000 –
a period in which night bus usage almost trebled.

Boris Johnson, mayor of London, said: “Running trains all through the night
was once thought impossible, but with the huge investment we’ve put in and
upgrades that have been delivered we stand ready to take the tube to the
next level. The evolution of the night tube will without doubt make London
an even better place to live, work, visit and invest.�

Mike Brown, the managing director of London Underground, said: “Already
over half a million Londoners use the Tube after 10pm on Fridays and
Saturdays, and the introduction of the night tube, which will cut journey
times and open up new possibilities across the nighttime economy, is a
historic step in our modernisation of London Underground.�

He said TfL was seeking a sponsor for the service, despite criticism over
previous deals. Neither Barclays nor Emirates’ sponsorship of the cycle
hire and cable car have covered costs, while a previous deal with the Wonga
loan firm for late-night tube travel at the new year caused controversy.

Unions have accused TfL of trying to divert the public from its wider
programme of redundancies.

Mick Cash, the new RMT general secretary, said: “Whilst RMT is not against
night running of the tube in principle, provided all staff involved are
properly rewarded and that safety and security is thoroughly worked out and
agreed, the truth is that the mayor threw this plan in as a diversion from
his massive cuts and closures programme that will axe a thousand staff and
decimate services and safety.�

The launch of 24-hour weekend tubes coincides with the start of the
third-largest international sporting event, the Rugby World Cup, which will
be hosted by England from 18 September. An estimated 400,000 overseas
visitors are expected, with three venues hosting key matches in the
capital.

In message

, at 02:19:48 on Wed, 24 Sep 2014, Recliner
remarked:
From
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...rground-24-hou
r-tube-night-trains

Trains will run through the night from 12 September 2015, with six running
an hour across the five “night tube� lines – Jubilee, Victoria
and most of
the Piccadilly, Central and Northern lines.

Transport for London (TfL) said the move would support almost 2,000
permanent jobs and provide a £360m boost to the economy.
....

Mick Cash, the new RMT general secretary, said...
the truth is that the mayor threw this plan in as a diversion from
his massive cuts and closures programme that will axe a thousand staff and
decimate services and safety.�

So what is it: 2,000 more or 1,000 less?
--
Roland Perry

In article
,
(Recliner) wrote:

From

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...nd-24-hour-tub
e-night-trains

Trains will run through the night from 12 September 2015, with six running
an hour across the five _night tube_ lines _ Jubilee, Victoria and most of
the Piccadilly, Central and Northern lines.

Transport for London (TfL) said the move would support almost 2,000
permanent jobs and provide a £360m boost to the economy.

Demand for overnight tube services, matching New York and Berlin, has been
demonstrated by the increasing numbers of late-night London Underground
journeys, which have risen at twice the rate of daytime trips since 2000 -
a period in which night bus usage almost trebled.

Boris Johnson, mayor of London, said: "Running trains all through the
night was once thought impossible, but with the huge investment we've put
in and upgrades that have been delivered we stand ready to take the tube
to the next level. The evolution of the night tube will without doubt make
London an even better place to live, work, visit and invest."

Mike Brown, the managing director of London Underground, said: "Already
over half a million Londoners use the Tube after 10pm on Fridays and
Saturdays, and the introduction of the night tube, which will cut journey
times and open up new possibilities across the nighttime economy, is a
historic step in our modernisation of London Underground."

He said TfL was seeking a sponsor for the service, despite criticism over
previous deals. Neither Barclays nor Emirates' sponsorship of the cycle
hire and cable car have covered costs, while a previous deal with the
Wonga loan firm for late-night tube travel at the new year caused
controversy.

Unions have accused TfL of trying to divert the public from its wider
programme of redundancies.

Mick Cash, the new RMT general secretary, said: "Whilst RMT is not against
night running of the tube in principle, provided all staff involved are
properly rewarded and that safety and security is thoroughly worked out
and agreed, the truth is that the mayor threw this plan in as a diversion
from his massive cuts and closures programme that will axe a thousand
staff and decimate services and safety."

The launch of 24-hour weekend tubes coincides with the start of the
third-largest international sporting event, the Rugby World Cup, which
will be hosted by England from 18 September. An estimated 400,000 overseas
visitors are expected, with three venues hosting key matches in the
capital.

With a picture of the District Line at Earl's Court. Doh!

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In message , at 11:37:18 on
Wed, 24 Sep 2014, Paul Corfield remarked:
Transport for London (TfL) said the move would support almost 2,000
permanent jobs and provide a £360m boost to the economy.
...

Mick Cash, the new RMT general secretary, said...
the truth is that the mayor threw this plan in as a diversion from
his massive cuts and closures programme that will axe a thousand staff and
decimate services and safety.�

So what is it: 2,000 more or 1,000 less?

I rather suspect the 2,000 jobs are jobs in the wider economy not in
TfL / LU. That's how I read it.

Given the number of taxi and bus drivers it'll put out of a job, I'm not
sure where the increase in jobs outside TfL will come from.

If it requires 2,000 people to run a
partial Night Tube service then something's seriously wrong!

Shift working for drivers, signallers, station staff etc. I don't know
how many they require for the current manning pattern on those lines,
but it'll need an increase of two shifts a week.

I wonder what they'll do about cleaning and maintaining the trains those
nights - not bother, or do half on a Friday night and the other half
Saturday night?

It is clear that circa 1,000 posts are to be removed from LU. I think
it is in the high 900s but TUs will always round up the number.

--
Roland Perry

In message , at 11:42:15 on
Wed, 24 Sep 2014, Paul Corfield remarked:
Whether people want to pay two fares - tube and connecting bus -
compared to a single bus fare on a direct night bus remains to be
seen.

Season ticket (Travelcard) holders, daily Oyster/CPC capping etc.

What this will bring into focus is when exactly the end of the capping
day is, 0430 currently, which should cope with most of the "party
animals".
--
Roland Perry

And still no comment or intent as to what happens to the Night Bus
network and whether extra buses will be added in the suburbs to give
convenient links perhaps offset by reductions on the busier trunk
routes that parallel main tube lines.

I don't know anybody who has a problem over the time of the last tube. What is a problem is the time of the last connecting bus or National Rail service.

On 2014-09-24 10:42:15 +0000, Paul Corfield said:

Whether people want to pay two fares - tube and connecting bus -
compared to a single bus fare on a direct night bus remains to be
seen.

Time for me to moot the idea of a full Verbundtarif again, which would
remove discrepancies like these? Or at the very least connectional
Tube-bus fares, which would retain the motivation not to use the Tube
when busy and still tick the "bus is cheaper for those of limited
income" box?

By that I mean that if you make a Tube journey, connecting bus journeys
would be included in the price. This would avoid the currently very
unfair situation where those not served directly by the Tube are
further disadvantaged by paying more. Not to mention the bus
equivalent, where those journeys requiring two buses are penalised.

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On Wed, 24 Sep 2014 11:46:01 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 11:37:18 on
Wed, 24 Sep 2014, Paul Corfield remarked:
Transport for London (TfL) said the move would support almost 2,000
permanent jobs and provide a £360m boost to the economy.
...

Mick Cash, the new RMT general secretary, said...
the truth is that the mayor threw this plan in as a diversion from
his massive cuts and closures programme that will axe a thousand staff and
decimate services and safety.”

So what is it: 2,000 more or 1,000 less?

I rather suspect the 2,000 jobs are jobs in the wider economy not in
TfL / LU. That's how I read it.

Given the number of taxi and bus drivers it'll put out of a job, I'm not
sure where the increase in jobs outside TfL will come from.

I don't suppose there will be any reduction in night buses. And I
don't suppose any taxi drivers will be put out of a job.

If it requires 2,000 people to run a
partial Night Tube service then something's seriously wrong!

Shift working for drivers, signallers, station staff etc. I don't know
how many they require for the current manning pattern on those lines,
but it'll need an increase of two shifts a week.

I wonder what they'll do about cleaning and maintaining the trains those
nights - not bother, or do half on a Friday night and the other half
Saturday night?

It's only a limited service on a subset of lines for two nights a
week, so the fleet will still be in a depot for at least five nights a
week. Even on those weekend nights, only a reduced fleet will be in
service.

In message , at
04:05:07 on Wed, 24 Sep 2014, Piatkow
remarked:
And still no comment or intent as to what happens to the Night Bus
network and whether extra buses will be added in the suburbs to give
convenient links perhaps offset by reductions on the busier trunk
routes that parallel main tube lines.

I don't know anybody who has a problem over the time of the last tube.
What is a problem is the time of the last connecting bus or National
Rail service.

Last tubes are a "problem" for people whose destination is near a tube
station, and they want to stay out in the evening. It's not about
connecting to bus or National Rail.
--
Roland Perry

On 2014\09\24 11:46, Roland Perry wrote:

Given the number of taxi and bus drivers it'll put out of a job, I'm not
sure where the increase in jobs outside TfL will come from.

Proper taxi drivers will probably do well out of it, since it will keep
suburban ranks busy all night, and reduce long loss-making jobs for
central area drivers to the suburbs... but thousands of minicab drivers
might be out of a "job".