I notice that the 125 bus has a new fleet of buses which look a tiny bit
like Borisbuses, but are not. Having spent all that money on designing a
New Bus For London, I imagined that it would replace all of the
double-deckers as they became life-expired, but it would seem not. Is
the Borisbus considered a failure? Have they stopped making them
already? Was it only ever going to be used in touristy areas, and if so,
why?

On 27/02/2015 16:25, Basil Jet wrote:
I notice that the 125 bus has a new fleet of buses which look a tiny bit
like Borisbuses, but are not. Having spent all that money on designing a
New Bus For London, I imagined that it would replace all of the
double-deckers as they became life-expired, but it would seem not. Is
the Borisbus considered a failure? Have they stopped making them
already? Was it only ever going to be used in touristy areas, and if so,
why?

That'll be the Wright Eclipse Gemini 3 body - and yes, it does look a
bit New Routemaster-esque - I think someone else commented on this here
a while back, and I certainly thought it the first time I saw one of
these buses in 2013 (?). It's the shallower top-deck windows that does
it, I think:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/wirewiping/16395155167

https://www.flickr.com/photos/londonbusbreh1912/16615416021


Re the NBFL / New Routemasters (aka Boris buses) - as of October 2014,
only half the initial 600 ordered had been delivered, and TfL ordered an
extra 200 - so they're definitely still being manufactured.

There was never any plan that the NBFL would replace all other double
deckers.

Regarding the success or otherwise of the NBFL - well, despite some
assurances that all was now well, I think the issue of them getting too
hot in the summer - hence the Roastmaster nickname - is perhaps a
fundamental flaw in the design. They really aren't very pleasant when
it's hot, especially upstairs. Perhaps I'll reserve ultimate judgement
until this summer, but I'm not enormously hopeful.

Also, a number of NBFL routes are now operated without a conductor
throughout the day, so the much heralded opportunity to hop-on and
hop-off the rear platform doesn't exist (there's a door there instead).
And in terms of the potential for fare evasion - which was a significant
part of the Boris critique of bendy buses - the NBFL has three doors
which can all be used for entry and exit, and on those routes with a
conductor they nonetheless don't do any ticket checking - instead they
guard the back door (I've seen some looking out for possible fare
evasion, but they can't really roam from the rear platform).

Lets say I wouldn't put the NBFL in the unqualified success category.

On 2015-02-27 16:52:31 +0000, Mizter T said:

Regarding the success or otherwise of the NBFL - well, despite some
assurances that all was now well, I think the issue of them getting too
hot in the summer - hence the Roastmaster nickname - is perhaps a
fundamental flaw in the design. They really aren't very pleasant when
it's hot, especially upstairs. Perhaps I'll reserve ultimate judgement
until this summer, but I'm not enormously hopeful.

I think they will either have to fit opening windows or full-on aircon,
which of course will both hit fuel consumption of an already heavy bus.

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On 27/02/2015 17:38, Neil Williams wrote:

On 2015-02-27 16:52:31 +0000, Mizter T said:

Regarding the success or otherwise of the NBFL - well, despite some
assurances that all was now well, I think the issue of them getting
too hot in the summer - hence the Roastmaster nickname - is perhaps a
fundamental flaw in the design. They really aren't very pleasant when
it's hot, especially upstairs. Perhaps I'll reserve ultimate judgement
until this summer, but I'm not enormously hopeful.

I think they will either have to fit opening windows or full-on aircon,
which of course will both hit fuel consumption of an already heavy bus.

Full aircon on a bus with an always open door doesn't seem like a winner.

I think Paul C has previously speculated that fitting opening windows
upstairs might not be structurally possible on the NBFL.

Certainly, other better ventilated buses - with opening windows and
forced air ventilation systems - were more pleasant than stuffy NBFLs on
hot days.

In article , (Basil Jet)
wrote:

I notice that the 125 bus has a new fleet of buses which look a tiny
bit like Borisbuses, but are not. Having spent all that money on
designing a New Bus For London, I imagined that it would replace all
of the double-deckers as they became life-expired, but it would seem
not. Is the Borisbus considered a failure? Have they stopped making
them already? Was it only ever going to be used in touristy areas,
and if so, why?

Looks like a pretty bog standard modern bus to me.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote:
In article , (Basil Jet)
wrote:

I notice that the 125 bus has a new fleet of buses which look a tiny
bit like Borisbuses, but are not. Having spent all that money on
designing a New Bus For London, I imagined that it would replace all
of the double-deckers as they became life-expired, but it would seem
not. Is the Borisbus considered a failure? Have they stopped making
them already? Was it only ever going to be used in touristy areas,
and if so, why?

Looks like a pretty bog standard modern bus to me.

Yes, I agree. Doesn't look at all like a Boris bus to me. For good or bad,
Boris buses really do look quite different to other modern buses (and to
old RMs, too).

On 2015-02-27 17:50:33 +0000, Mizter T said:

Full aircon on a bus with an always open door doesn't seem like a winner.

Shops manage it, using those air curtain things. So there might be a way.

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On 2015-02-28 10:56:30 +0000, Paul Corfield said:

I expect the NB4L will always remain controversial. I don't use them
because they are so noisy they give me headaches and make me ill. I
rarely get headaches so for me to get one requires something
"special". Every time a route converts to the NB4L another bit of the
bus network is "shut off" for me. Call me stupid if you want but no
other bus makes me ill.

I don't find them any noisier than any other London bus with the
upstairs extractor fans. Is there perhaps something else about them,
like the ride quality?

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On 2015\02\28 10:56, Paul Corfield wrote:

I expect the NB4L will always remain controversial. I don't use them
because they are so noisy they give me headaches and make me ill. I
rarely get headaches so for me to get one requires something
"special". Every time a route converts to the NB4L another bit of the
bus network is "shut off" for me. Call me stupid if you want but no
other bus makes me ill.

Wow. I don't think you've mentioned that. That's a scandalous flaw.
In the bus, not in you!

Thanks to everyone who's commented.

On 2015-02-28 12:53:55 +0000, Basil Jet said:

Wow. I don't think you've mentioned that. That's a scandalous flaw.
In the bus, not in you!

I would be interested in what the precise cause of that is. I have a
similar thing with trains - the awful suspension and failure to bolt
the seats to the wall on the Class 180s means I can barely stand a
journey in one.

Now they *were* units that had so much potential but turned out cheap
and nasty.

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.