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-septem ber.org, at 09:45:26 on Mon, 9 Mar 2015, Recliner remarked: I was taking some pictures outside the then very new M&S Simply Food in the "Circle" bit of St Pancras when the bouncer on the door (why would they need one?) got very aggressive and demanded I stop, and delete any photos I had already taken. He seemed to be suggesting that I was involved in industrial espionage. I must have had a pretty desperate client if they didn't already know what goes on inside an M&S SF. As luck would have it a BTP chap was nearby and I asked him if there was a ban on photography there and he chuckled a bit and said "of course not". ps Is that bit of St Pancras public or private - it belongs to LCR I suppose. I think the whole of all railway stations is private, owned by NR, LCR, TfL, etc. Modulo NR being a nationalised organisation and TfL being Local Authority owned. Ditto with enclosed shopping malls. And, of course, the shopping areas in St P are both. The southern embankment near the mayor's office is also private land. I went on a photography walk, and the guide said that, as a pro photographer, he knew exactly where he could set up a tripod unmolested, and other areas where he'd soon be evicted if he looked like a pro. I think the new Granary Square is the same. You can wander around taking pics to your heart's content with an amateur camera (I have), but set up a tripod or start taking videos with what looks like pro gear and the private security guards will soon approach you for a chat. It's these various lines in the sand which I object to when it comes to "public" spaces. After all, if you misbehave in numerous other ways the law will deem them to be public places. In the USA it's not uncommon for a Mall to have a dress-code. And that's not just "men must wear a shirt" but things like "no baseball hats". -- Roland Perry |
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On 2015-03-08 23:43:09 +0000, Recliner said:
eastender wrote: On 2015-03-08 21:56:50 +0000, Recliner said: eastender wrote: On 2015-03-08 17:24:22 +0000, Recliner said: eastender wrote: On 2015-03-08 15:02:01 +0000, Recliner said: eastender wrote: On 2015-03-08 10:45:02 +0000, Recliner said: eastender wrote: On 2015-03-07 23:38:01 +0000, Paul Corfield said: I'm obviously guessing here but there are not many refuge sidings on the ELL core section so you really need to get trains beyond Surrey Quays to be able to hide them away somewhere. I was wondering when watching it being built what they would do for contingency - it seems very little. The elevated section down to Shoreditch used to carry four tracks and one would have thought a siding could have been put in there. Yes, they used the wider embankment for the new stations, but could have put a reversing siding between stations. But it does seem to be the modern policy to keep tracks as simple as possible, as points and crossovers are themselves vulnerable to failures. For this reason, I think many tube lines now have fewer crossovers than before. By extension, I was reading this piece in the Guardian the other day: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...y-into-the-air The sell-off of Broad Street station and space is one example of dreadfully short-sighted and cut price deals for developers. Imagine how the railway would look now with a modern spur down to Broad Street. I'd have though the Broadgate office development is far more usefu. And if Broad St station was still open, the amazingly successful conversion of the ELL to the Overground, with the link to H&I, would never have happened. I think closing a London terminus given what we now know about population growth and demand for travel was not a good decision. But you can say that about a lot of railway closures. The new Overground line adds a lot more capacity than was lost when that little-used terminal finally closed. Yes but this is with the benefit of hindsight - who knows what would have been built around a Broad Street line by now. There was no point keeping the almost disused, shabby old station open. The re-established Richmond to Stratford route, and the busy new ELL Overground routes are far more useful. The fortunate thing is that the old line's disused viaduct was preserved for future railway use, while the redundant station site was turned into something much more useful. The point about the sell-off of public space is also important. I don't agree at all. Only private sector money would have created the wonderful new Kings Cross Granary Square developments, or restored St Pancras Chambers into the magnificent new hotel. Ditto the Docklands area. As for Broad St, the smart office buildings and privately-owned 'public' spaces are a huge improvement over what was there before. The grand old City buildings were always private developments. Unlike that very left-wing Guardian polemic article, I've no problem with privately owned land, or the way that London has sprouted various curiously-shaped big buildings of late. I like the Gherkin, the Shard and even the new Walkie Talkie (less so the bland Heron Tower). The new Canary Wharf Crossrail station is also very promising. Let's hope OOC gets similar developments. You obviously have no problem then with privatisation of vast tracts of cities where no one can protest or take pictures without permission, and where the adjoining poor neighbourhoods are almost totally excluded from investment. Instead what we get is space opimised for commerce and bland upmarket shopping. Actually, you can take amateur pics in those areas without permission, and I often do. I've never been involved a protest in my life, and as far as I'm concerned, they're a nuisance that stops me from getting to places, not something I welcome or would want to encourage. As for the adjoining poor neighbourhoods, they tend to become much more desirable places to live than they used to be, and money floods in (eg, Hoxton). That's the opposite of them being excluded from investment. How else would they attract investment? So, yes, I'm all in favour of wealth creation, and governments spend money, rather than creating wealth. By all means regulate and tax the private sector, but don't think you can create wealth without it. Have a look at this report: http://www.annaminton.com/privatepublicspace.pdf I must say we are probably living in parallel universes - where you see only private good I see ordinary people priced out of housing, expensive housing lying empty, large 'spaces' patrolled by private security and gated (eg Canary Wharf), neglected neighbourhoods next to Canary Wharf, Excel, King's Cross etc, anodyne and expensive shopping centres (Westfields). See also http://www.newleftproject.org/index....s_and_for_whom E. |
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On Mon, 9 Mar 2015 14:29:40 +0000
eastender wrote: I must say we are probably living in parallel universes - where you see only private good I see ordinary people priced out of housing, Its funny isn't it how some people are so keen on uncontrolled immigration yet when the inveitable consequences occur - eg **** all housing available in london at a reasonable rent - its suddenly someone elses fault. And I'm not just talking about the lefties, we have idiots like Boris saying how wonderful it is that Londons population will rise above 9m by 2020. Yes, absolutely fantastic - so long as you're not a native (of whatever skin colour) who would like to be able to afford to live here and doesn't want to share some scummy little house with 5 strangers then commute in on overcrowded public transport at rip off prices for a zero hours job that pays so little due to immigrants pushing the wages down (and anyone who claims they haven't doesn't live in the real world I'm afraid). expensive housing lying empty, large 'spaces' patrolled by private security and gated (eg Canary Wharf), neglected neighbourhoods next to Canary Wharf, Excel, King's Cross etc, anodyne and expensive shopping centres (Westfields). If people didn't like shopping centres they'd go bust. You might not like them - and frankly neither do I - but most other people do. -- Spud |
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wrote:
On Mon, 9 Mar 2015 14:29:40 +0000 eastender wrote: I must say we are probably living in parallel universes - where you see only private good I see ordinary people priced out of housing, expensive housing lying empty, large 'spaces' patrolled by private security and gated (eg Canary Wharf), neglected neighbourhoods next to Canary Wharf, Excel, King's Cross etc, anodyne and expensive shopping centres (Westfields). If people didn't like shopping centres they'd go bust. You might not like them - and frankly neither do I - but most other people do. Yes, on that I think we three, and probably most others here, are agreed. I suspect that the Venn diagram of male railway newsgroup posters and avid mall shoppers has very little overlap. |
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Yes, on that I think we three, and probably most others here, are
agreed. I suspect that the Venn diagram of male railway newsgroup posters and avid mall shoppers has very little overlap. I take it you dismiss the way Westfield Stratford has brought to nearby residents (including users of the of the NLL) much easier access to a decent M&S food hall and large Waitrose - both sources of good scoff irrespective of who actually does the shopping? That said, I'll accept being informed that *real* railway enthusiasts enthuse only about eggs, bacon and sausages cooked on a shovel :) -- Robin reply to address is (meant to be) valid |
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"Robin" wrote:
Yes, on that I think we three, and probably most others here, are agreed. I suspect that the Venn diagram of male railway newsgroup posters and avid mall shoppers has very little overlap. I take it you dismiss the way Westfield Stratford has brought to nearby residents (including users of the of the NLL) much easier access to a decent M&S food hall and large Waitrose - both sources of good scoff irrespective of who actually does the shopping? Can you go into either of those stores without having to pass through the dreaded enclosed mall area? |
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Can you go into either of those stores without having to pass through
the dreaded enclosed mall area? I am not sure if "dreaded" applies to the whole "enclosed mall area" or just part of it - eg the bit where you tend to meet 4 femails walking in line abreast with stilletoes ready to deal with any obstacles. But FWIW both stores are at ends of the mall and so can be accesed with very, very little exposure to other stores. The M&S food hall is right by the Stratford's Northern ticket hall. You don't have to walk past any other store. Waitrose is at the far end of the mall from M&S. But from the Northern ticket hall you can walk along "the Street" which is not enclosed so you don't have inhale concentrated retail pheromones all the way. Or you could use Stratford International - although the shortest route from there does take you past a few other stores. I think you can use the same routes from either car park but the only one I can vouch for is car park A which is at the Waitrose end. -- Robin reply to address is (meant to be) valid |
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